I have gotten differnt answers on this topic one was 45 degrees and the other 30 degrees I can't remember what manual it is in are SOP.

I can only tell you from my expierence that if you pull the hammer off and it leans more than 2-3 degrees... run it over and build it again. If you are passing it and it is leaning have some pride in your AOR and run it over and rebuild it.

As per the D5 ATON SOP

RULE: A structure leaning greater than 40 degrees is consider to be destroyed.

found on page 6-52

It's also a real judgement call on the units part:
-If the aid is a DBN and it's not leaning into the channel then you should never set a TRUB on it. The channel will be marked better with the leaning aid than a floating one. ESPECIALLY if the channel is narrow.
-If it's a light you have to set it if it's past 20 deg. At that angle a 155mm lantern's focus will be off, and to leave it would mean that it would be "burning dim" ie, discrepant.

Always set channel-ward when practicle but watch out if it's narrow.

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-If the aid is a DBN and it's not leaning into the channel then you should never set a TRUB on it.

But you also have to realize that with the aid already leaning over, that it will more than likely give way shortly....thus being destroyed with no wreckage on scene, or, with wreckage on scene. If you set a TRUB channelward, then it is already marked if/when the aid goes over.

I don't know about your AOR, but in ours, if the aid is leaning....its just a matter of time before she goes all the way over!

As for the lights, you are fully correct about the focus being off...hence the need to set the TRLB.

original_ftg
EXCELLENT POINT! I am in Galveston and I would say about 80% of the time it's only a matter of time before she goes all the way over...due to the fact that nearly all piles are driven into soft mud. However, with many AOR's the bottom is sand/shell, or possibly hard clay (like in SF or most west coast aids), and normally they will last the length of time it takes for the contractor/tender to get out there and fix it. Bottom line; in my opinion it's still better to not mark a DBN that does not pose a hazard to the channel...until it can driven with a new pile.

strb725, I see your point. However, I am inclined to agree with BM1 Tomas. It would depend on how far over it is leaning, but in my opinion I would think that the mariner would rather see a leaning DBN with a TRUB next too it than nothing at all. This would give visual confirmation to the mariner that we (the Coast Guard) are doing our job. Also, this would alleviate multiple Discprepancy reports on the same aid. Even though a BNM was issued, I can think of numerous times where we have not been able to attend to an aid due to weather, and in that time frame it has been reported discrepant multiple times. This would include Lights and DBNs. Another factor for my unit is trailer time. We face up to 2 hour trailer time one way to get out to one of the busiest parts of our AOR. The pros to set a TRUB on a leaing DBN definately out weighs at least a 4 hour road trip. I guess, though, it really depends on your AOR and how far it's actually leaning. What works well in the deep south might not work the same up north! Keep em winkin and blinkin!

Freshwater Bayou!!!

Ding Ding Ding we have a winner! John, I was wondering when you were gonna get in on this conversation!

I know Clint I couldn't hold out any longer. I hope all you guys are having some good ole ATON fun.

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Freshwater Bayou!!!

Now that brings back some not so fond memories from when I brought the 55 back from Freeport after a yard period! We fueled and stayed the night there during that trip......

According to the Aids to Navigation Administration Manual:

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An aid that is damaged should not be listed as a destroyed unless the aid is completely destroyed or is leaning at an angle greater than 45 degrees. An aid that can be repaired without replacing the structure should not be listed as destroyed.

Now that says, destroyed, not discrepancy, but according to where you are at would determine whether you are looking at a discrepancy or not.

Generally an aid that is leaning between 10 and 44 degrees should be reported to the primary servicing unit for further inspection.

I laughed when I read the comments about rebuilding any aids that were 2 to 3 degrees off.

Another person said 40 degrees which is fine, because that's a district standard and if you didn't already know, it's fine to exceed the Commandant's standards, but never to deviate from them.

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Originally posted by original_ftg:

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Freshwater Bayou!!!

Now that brings back some not so fond memories from when I brought the 55 back from Freeport after a yard period! We fueled and stayed the night there during that trip......

We spudded down there a few times and made the mad-dash for the pay phone to call home. All it cost us was a few pints of blood! @#%$ing mosquitoes!!!!

Anybody been "fortunate" enough to visit Intercoastal "City" out there? So many stories...

When I was OinC of ANT Sabine we took the 55' over to Vermillion Bay to put it back together after Hurricane Andrew. We met a TANB and crew from ANT Galveston in Intercoastal City where we moored for about 3 or 4 nights. We slept on the 55 of course, while the TANB crew pitched a tent. We moored right by "the" store in town where we got some beverages and had a great time sitting on the banks of the "beautiful" ICW. Not one piling was knocked over but most of them were stripped of dayboards and lighting equipment.

Prior to being at Sabine for 5 years, I was XPO on the HATCHET. Got to run SW Louisiana for 8 years. I love those little Louisiana ICW towns! Lake Arthur was my favorite. Good times!