THIS ARTICLE IS A GOOD PERSPECTIVE ON WHAT HISTORY TELLS US ABOUT DEALING WITH THE ISLAMIC MOVEMENT:

http://www.hillsdale.edu/imprimis/

AGREE? DISAGREE?? THIS IS CERTAINLY FOOD FOR THOUGHT

Thanks Ron. A good read. Indeed Islam and the Islamo Fascists have created great job security for our sons.

BUMP......Worth reading!

A very important quote:
“Freedom and Justice in Islam”
Bernard Lewis, Cleveland E. Dodge Professor Emeritus of Near Eastern Studies, Princeton University
So there is a good deal of pro-Western and even specifically pro-American feeling. But the anti-American feeling is strongest in those countries that are ruled by what we are pleased to call “friendly governments.” And it is those, of course, that are the most tyrannical and the most resented by their own people. The outlook at the moment is, I would say, very mixed. I think that the cause of developing free institutions—along their lines, not ours—is possible. One can see signs of its beginning in some countries. At the same time, the forces working against it are very powerful and well entrenched. And one of the greatest dangers is that on their side, they are firm and convinced and resolute. Whereas on our side, we are weak and undecided and irresolute. And in such a combat, it is not difficult to see which side will prevail.

RONCO, excellent! As I read this well written article, much of the views by this educated man fell in line with what some had posted and others ahd challenged in another topic on this forum. Unfortunate that discussion had not continued, couda' had the potential of better understanding what, why, and how of the issues and situation.

Do I agree? Yes, with much of he has written, and there are also some brutal points that were made that I may not agree with, yet there is valid truth to it.

YEAH...LIKE WE ARE AT WAR, THEY ARE COMING FOR US, AND THEY THINK WE ARE WEAK

AT MY LOWEST, I FEAR THEY ARE CORRECT...AT MY HIGHEST I SAY STAY THE COURSE!

Dave, I think that our support for the "well entrenched" is derived from the ancient concept of maintaining a balance of power. This caused nations to support the most horrid of regimes simply because it kept the waring at an "acceptable" level. For us, as we grew, it helped secure our sovrienty.

HOWEVER, given the fact of a globe shrunk to as small as ours is, this immoral system has to, in my opinion, be removed and indeed replaced with representitive governments that recognise the Creator granted rights which include "life, liberty and the persute of happiness."

While our support of , say, Jordan, does not make it a democracy or a Republic, it indeed causes a certain amount of MODERATION of those Governments. Those who oppose the government are "free" to hate us for it.

In places like Iran, a government we do NOT support, Hate America , except by that government, has not taken hold BECAUSE we do not support them and would prefer they were GONE.

I see much anti-Americanism as being related to that "balance of Power" philosophy, one that the State Department loves to much. Most Euro-governments still kling to that model, so their governments resent the change that Pres. Bush 43 is trying to make and loved Clinton because he was a total foreign policy "baffoon".

IF Iraq works out in the long run, the euroweinees may come around, because as Henry Ford 1 proved, if you make the laborer prosper, you become vastly wealthy, if not, you create a stagnant feudalism. As the euroweinee nations ate completely stagnent, and the events in Iraq begin to swell their coffers, they'll be aboard very quickly.

A tremendous amount rides on the Bush Admin.'s initiatives, far more that meets the American newshawk eye.

A tacky but needed to be discussed subject. If we just keep our heads in the sand we shall surely perish.
Politicians sending our young people into Jihad wars with fanatics, may not be the wisest of actions, unless a plan is laid out firm and with resolve.

quote:

Bernard Lewis: "But the anti-American feeling is strongest in those countries that are ruled by what we are pleased to call “friendly governments.” And it is those, of course, that are the most tyrannical and the most resented by their own people."
Followed by:
"And one of the greatest dangers is that on their side, they are firm and convinced and resolute. Whereas on our side, we are weak and undecided and irresolute."

In my opinion we face an enemy that we cannot see just by looking. We allow people to come into this country with minimal checking on who they really are, and what they may happen to be. We have allowed the USA to be dominated by the heavy influx of non English speaking people. I have been on elevators in Columbus when Arabic is spoken. Thus we who do not speak the language, could be overhearing just about anything. In a recent visit to Columbus I went to Westland Mall, which was extremely nice shopping place when we moved south in 1998. Many stores have now closed, all remaining have both Spanish and English signs posted for information as well as sales and prices.
When I have visited foreign nations they did not have English signs posted, they had their own language signs posted and I had to adapt to their language and their ways.
I live in a very small city in southern Ohio. This is where my children now bring home sales kits to raise money for our school programs, printed in English and Spanish on the sales envelope. What next Arabic?

PEOPLE BOARD AIRLINES INTO AND OUT OF THIS COUNTRY WITH NO PICTURE ID AND CAN'T ANSWER SIMPLE QUESTIONS...

PEOPLE ARE VOTING WITH NO PICTURE ID...

PEOPLE HAVE A SS CARD AND A DRIVERS LICENSE AND THEY CANNOT EVEN SPEAK ENGLISH...

WE ARE STUPID TO ALLOW THIS TO CONTINUE

RONCO, Yes, we are.

When the Islamo Fascists again manage to "get it right once" the American people will awaken again. Five years is a long time for a rich/soft/pampered/puzzy society like ours.

NOT TO MENTION ONLY 10% OF THE AMERICAN FAMILYS HAVE A DOG IN THE FIGHT...

I SAY TURN LOOSE THE DOGS AND USE ALL THE FORCE WE HAVE TO RID THE WORLD OF THIS SCOURGE...

ENOUGH ALREADY

BUMP

Muslim beliefs
This appears to sum up what we are faced with. Muslim religion in the fastest
growing religion per capita in the United States, especially in the minority races!!!

Allah or Jesus?
by Rick Mathes

Last month I attended my annual training session that's required
for maintaining my state prison security clearance. During the training session
there was a presentation by three speakers representing the Roman Catholic, Protestant
and Muslim faiths, who explained each of their belief systems.
I was particularly interested in what the Islamic Imam had to say.
The Imam gave a great presentation of the basics of Islam, complete with a video.
After the presentations, time was provided for questions and answers. When it
was my turn, I directed my question to the Imam and asked:
"Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but I understand that most
Imams and clerics of Islam have declared a holy jihad [Holy war] against the infidels
of the world. And, that by killing an infidel, which is a command to all Muslims,
they are assured of a place in heaven. If that's the case, can you give me the
definition of an infidel?"
There was no disagreement with my statements and, without hesitation,
he replied, "Non-believers!" I responded, "So, let me make sure
I have this straight. All followers of Allah have been commanded to kill everyone
who is not of your faith so they can go to Heaven. Is that correct?" The expression
on his face changed from one of authority and command to that of a little boy who
had just gotten caught with his hand in the cookie jar. He sheepishly replied, "Yes."
I then stated, "Well, sir, I have a real problem trying to imagine Pope John
Paul commanding all Catholics to kill those of your faith or Dr. Stanley ordering
Protestants to do the same in order to go to Heaven!" The Imam was speechless.
I continued, "I also have problem with being your friend when you and your
brother clerics are telling your followers to kill me. Let me ask you a question.
Would you rather have your Allah who tells you to kill me in order to go to Heaven
or my Jesus who tells me to love you because I am going to Heaven and He wants you
to be with me?" You could have heard a pin drop as the Imam hung his head
in shame. Needless to say, the organizers and/or promoters of manditory 'Diversification'
training seminar were not happy with Rick's way of dealing with the Islamic
Imam and exposing the truth about the Muslim's beliefs.
I think everyone in the US should be required to read this, but with
the liberal justice system, liberal media, and the ACLU, there is no way this will
be widley publicized. Please pass this on to all your e-mail contacts.
This is a true story and the author, Rick Mathes, is a well known leader
in prison ministry.

HAVE YOU SEEN THE DOCUMENTARY MOVIE "OBSESSION"

THERE ARE 1.4+ BILLION MUSLIMS AND ABOUT 25% ARE COMMITTED TO JIHAD...THE FIRST TARGET IS ISREAL AND THE NEXT IS AMERICA...WILL WE BE READY

COMING TO A STATE NEAR YOU

In addition to the dhimmitude of local politicians Iowa Muslims have been exploiting taxpayer funding and state and federally funded institutions to promote their political, social and educational Jihad. An example of the degree to which Muslims are attempting to main stream Islamism in Iowa can be seen in the fact that The 1st conference of the Islamic Foundation of Iowa did not take place in a mosque, but was held at at the taxpayer funded Central Middle School in Waterloo Iowa, despite having being a religious gathering with unmistakeably Islamo supremacist agenda : "The practical structure of building an Islamic society -Come to know the future visions and plans for Muslims in Iowa."
http://www.militantislammonitor.org/article/id/2513

WAKE UP, AMERICA

THE CRACK IN THE DOOR...

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/12/01/D8LOC15O0.html

...A SLIPPERY SLOPE!!!

ARE WE PAYING ATTENTION

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America, Not Keith Ellison, decides what book a congressman takes his oath on

By Dennis Prager - Tuesday, November 28, 2006

Keith Ellison, D-Minn., the first Muslim elected to the United States Congress,
has announced that he will not take his oath of office on the Bible, but on the
bible of Islam, the Koran.
He should not be allowed to do so -- not because of any American hostility to the
Koran, but because the act undermines American civilization.

First, it is an act of hubris that perfectly exemplifies multiculturalist activism
-- my culture trumps America's culture. What Ellison and his Muslim and leftist
supporters are saying is that it is of no consequence what America holds as its
holiest book; all that matters is what any individual holds to be his holiest book.
Forgive me, but America should not give a hoot what Keith Ellison's favorite
book is. Insofar as a member of Congress taking an oath to serve America and uphold
its values is concerned, America is interested in only one book, the Bible. If you
are incapable of taking an oath on that book, don't serve in Congress. In your
personal life, we will fight for your right to prefer any other book. We will even
fight for your right to publish cartoons mocking our Bible. But, Mr. Ellison, America,
not you, decides on what book its public servants take their oath.

Devotees of multiculturalism and political correctness who do not see how damaging
to the fabric of American civilization it is to allow Ellison to choose his own
book need only imagine a racist elected to Congress. Would they allow him to choose
Hitler's "Mein Kampf," the Nazis' bible, for his oath? And if
not, why not? On what grounds will those defending Ellison's right to choose
his favorite book deny that same right to a racist who is elected to public office?
Of course, Ellison's defenders argue that Ellison is merely being honest; since
he believes in the Koran and not in the Bible, he should be allowed, even encouraged,
to put his hand on the book he believes in. But for all of American history, Jews
elected to public office have taken their oath on the Bible, even though they do
not believe in the New Testament, and the many secular elected officials have not
believed in the Old Testament either. Yet those secular officials did not demand
to take their oaths of office on, say, the collected works of Voltaire or on a volume
of New York Times editorials, writings far more significant to some liberal members
of Congress than the Bible. Nor has one Mormon official demanded to put his hand
on the Book of Mormon. And it is hard to imagine a scientologist being allowed to
take his oath of office on a copy of "Dianetics" by L. Ron Hubbard.

So why are we allowing Keith Ellison to do what no other member of Congress has
ever done -- choose his own most revered book for his oath?
The answer is obvious -- Ellison is a Muslim. And whoever decides these matters,
not to mention virtually every editorial page in America, is not going to offend
a Muslim. In fact, many of these people argue it will be a good thing because Muslims
around the world will see what an open society America is and how much Americans
honor Muslims and the Koran.

This argument appeals to all those who believe that one of the greatest goals of
America is to be loved by the world, and especially by Muslims because then fewer
Muslims will hate us (and therefore fewer will bomb us).
But these naive people do not appreciate that America will not change the attitude
of a single American-hating Muslim by allowing Ellison to substitute the Koran for
the Bible.

In fact, the opposite is more likely: Ellison's doing so will embolden
Islamic extremists and make new ones, as Islamists, rightly or wrongly, see the
first sign of the realization of their greatest goal -- the Islamicization of America.

When all elected officials take their oaths of office with their hands on the very
same book, they all affirm that some unifying value system underlies American civilization.
If Keith Ellison is allowed to change that, he will be doing more damage to the
unity of America and to the value system that has formed this country than the terrorists
of 9-11.

It is hard to believe that this is the legacy most Muslim Americans want
to bequeath to America. But if it is, it is not only Europe that is in trouble.

===================================================================================

If anyone gets the chance, read the book, "American Jihad."

IMO Do not trust them.