Here is the situation. You have a male first class and female second class. Both have the same rate and work in the same company. He is in her chain of command. During a land based operation you notice the two making hand gestures toward each other. It appears as though they are snapping the parts of a set of shelter halves. Both begin to smile when they see each other making the gesture. It comes to your attention later from other members of the company that they are co-habitating during the exercise. It is later noticed by the group grading that the female in question was found naked in her pup tent while they were placing casualty cards.

What would you do? You make the call.

V/r
Carl M. Ploense III

The fact that so many people know about it, yet the two people in question don't seem to be in trouble, is probably because everyone who knows about it feels that it would be futile to report it. This type of thing - and I don't necessarily mean fraternization, but failure to report something that should be reported - probably happens everyday at every command.

Seems pretty obvious you would have to drop the dime here, unless there is something else you are trying to get at.

More to the point, as a Chief would you feel obligated to reprimand or report this?

If reprimanding what course of action would you take? Counseling, Official page 13, write them up for NJP?

I gather that this would be considered a blatant violation of fraternization policies.


Thank you for your input. I look forward to your thoughtful comments.

Regards,
Carl M. Ploense III

If these Sailors were not in my chain of command (say there was more than one company involved in this exercise, they were in one company and I in another) I would have an obligation to bring this matter up with my counterpart in their chain of command for action.

If they were my subordinates, then I would have to pull each one aside for formal counseling with regard to their conduct and Navy policy on fraternization, making clear to them that continuing this conduct may result in disciplinary action. Based on what you describe in your scenario, informal/verbal counseling would be inappropriate here.

Additionally, I would after the exercise is over, arrange for some GMT on fraternization policy, making it a point to use some recent examples of Sailors who were disciplined for inappropriate relationships, such as the Sailors on a ship in Pearl Harbor back in 2005.

The scenario you use is very similar to a scenario on this subject in a book that is in my professional library. However, in that scenario there is one twist - the senior person involved in the inappropriate relationship is a personal friend of the reader, with a relationship going back many years.

Thank you Chief Jeffers,

Your concise and thoughtful comments are good to see. I have the impression that there is better discipline in the commands you have been in than some I have been in.

With your approval I would like to present more leadership scenarios for you and the other Chief's in the mess. Actually this is a precursor for a research project I am involved with in graduate school. I am working with different leadership models and so far the military model is the most efficient.

Thanks again,
Carl M. Ploense III

Carl:

The reason the military leadership model might seem to work better is that civilians, for the most part, don't do leadership. They do management. If there is any leadership, it is done by committee, which equates to no leadership at all...there is not a single voice to follow, and no single person to admit a mistake if it happens.

Well the landscape I have seen in both corporate and edcuational communities is such that they are trying (unsuccessfully) to teach leadership. I believe that both communities don't really understand the nature of the beast. They often misunderstand management for leadership. The models for leadership, such as the concensus model, are as effective as a football bat.

My experience has shown time and again that I can spot the veteran in an organization most often by who has the greatest responsibility.

There is a lot of psycho-bable out there claiming itself to be leadership. Don't waste your time reading "The Positive No" or "Fierce Conversations" The only thing they are good for is a field expedient replacement for toilet paper.

I have seen good leaders take and reshape an organization and mold it into an efficient machine when it was as messed up as a soup sandwich.

Rare is the strong leader who has not military experience. I have seen one so far and he was a football coach at a Missouri University some time ago.

Perhaps the lack of a well developed leadership system in corprate America is why whe have some of the problems that exist today.

regards,
Carl M. Ploense III

If these people worked for me. If they were good workers, got the job done, clean records, respected by their piers etc...

I would take the PO1 aside and tell him what I had observed, explain that if he and the PO2 did have something going on we needed to deal with it. I would make sure he understood that what they were doing is not only against the UCMJ but more importantly that it could cause problems within the Div. I would let him know that I expected him to deal with it and that they would have my undivided attention. I would make sure they saw me several times aday just standing around, or checking things, etc
I would also let it be known that if he didn't solve the problem then I would. I found out early that there is a time to be a hard a$$ and there's a time to cut some slack.

I thank all who posted their thoughtful comments. It appears that there is a consistent theme that leaders would address what is tantamount to a violation of the UCMJ regarding fraternization.

I will post another scenario soon.

I look forward to seeing what the sum total of leadership opinions are.

Very Respectfully,
Carl M. Ploense III