I'm 29 and considering enlisting for the next 4 years. I lack about 1 year of college until I earn my BS in Computer Info Systems, and will TRY to work on this while enlisted. I was wondering if it is possible for an older recruit like me to eventually become an officer, once I receive my degree? Is there a strict age limit on all officer programs?

Thanks.

Yes, age limits for commissioning are limited by congress.

They vary by community. The OPNAV 1420.1A is the instruction governing enlisted-to-officer programs. It includes all the different programs and age limits and age waivers for prior enlisted service.

Certain programs are more forgiving when it comes to age limits. For example Supply is 35 years of age. (The max for most "normal" officer communities)

The other option for older enlistees is the Limited Duty Officer and Chief Warrant Officer programs which REQUIRE enlisted service. Those programs are very compatible with older enlisted personnel. They also don't require degrees. (Although to be competitive you should have at least an Associates.) Dowside is that you need to be at least an E-6 to start applying, plus some other requirements. (E-7 for CWO)

I recommend you "websearch" with whatever Search program you like for OPNAV 1420.1A
It's dry reading and probably a lot of nonsense Navy jargon if you aren't in the Navy yet, but I can clarify acronyms and jargon if you have some more specific questions.


**Age limits off-hand that I remember**
Nuke: 27.5 years waiverable to 29.5
SWO: 29 waiverable to 31
Supply: 35

While it is possible, there are a great number of factors that will play into acceptance into OCS. One of the biggest factors is your degree field. The Navy generally likes engineering degrees - trust me I know from hard and disappointing experience. Another is active duty performance. Still yet another is what field you apply to - surface, aviation, engineering duty, medical, etc... Grades, off-duty community service, and all sorts of other things count. As Brandolf states, don't discount LDO/CWO. If you go LDO, once you reach the LT level, you could also apply to transfer to another designator (i.e., if you are a surface LDO, you could apply to convert to 1110. Don't know why anyone would do that, but it happens).

And if you make CWO, then you are a God.

Personally if it gets me in the door. . .I'm okay with LDO and then applying for SWO. Didn't think you could do that though.

What is the difference between CWO/LDO and regular officers - other than you must be enlisted to apply?

They are specialists in their respective fields, which is why there is a time in navy and rank requirement before applying. Instead of holding general line billets, they do more rate-specific work.

And do they still report to the line officers?

I think a little clarification is needed here.

A CWO or an LDO is a line officer, eligible to succeed to command. They hold billets that are the same as any other officer, and fill the same position in the chain of command as any other officer.

In general layman’s terms, the billets filled by MOST CWOs and LDOs are division officer jobs to manage the more technically demanding rates. The CWO or LDO, by virtue of experience, can more fully explain to the chain of command the hows and whys of how things work, and again to better translate to the Sailors of the division what is needed from the equipment.

Remember, its not just important to know what the capabilities and limitations of a warship are, it is imperative to know HOW a warship does what it does.

On a small ship, there might be two CWO/LDO billets, one in Combat Systems and one in Engineering. The officer in one of those billets is expected to be "the expert" in all matters within that department, and even into other departments when functional lines cross departmental boundaries.

Larger ships grow more complex, making it necessary to have more CWO/LDO billets, which include department heads.

Ashore, CWOs and LDOs can be Division Officers, Department Heads, XOs, OICs, and even COs.

Hope this helps.

vegasrider is correct.
Limited Duty Officers are officers in every right. It is merely their "assignments" that are limited.
Just because they won't be "assigned" as the CO doesn't mean in an emergency they can't take command. Just because an Ordnance LDO (drawn from FC, FT, TM, MMW, AO communities) is assigned only as a Weapons Dept Head and not to NAVOPS or Engineering doesn't mean the regular URL officers can skimp on respect and salutes.

CWO's are technical specialists and LDO's are technical managers (where the amount of in-depth training for a normal officer exceeds practicality in cost and time).
CWO's tend to do the same Div-O tour or same special technical tasking for the remainder of their career. . .making them super-experts, while LDO's tend to move from Div-O to Dept Head eventually to CO of a shore facility managing personnel in their original technical "area."

At least thats some of the spin I've seen on Mustang sites.

Vegasrider is the guy to ask about CWO though.

What kind of "officer training" is required for LDO/CWO? Do you go through Officer Candidate School? And what is a SWO?

Thanks.

quote:

Originally posted by 16301222:
What kind of "officer training" is required for LDO/CWO? Do you go through Officer Candidate School? And what is a SWO?

Thanks.

OIS for CWO/LDO candidates used to be affectionately known as "fork and knife school." While there was a basic curriculum, if you had been selected for CWO or LDO you really didn't need it. What it did was provide a couple of months of separation from wherever you came from to make sure you realized you were no longer wearing the uniform of a Chief, Senior Chief, Master Chief, or in rare cases Petty Officer First Class (my class of 35 - 25 Navy and 10 Coast Guard - had one LDO ensign who had not made CPO), but now you are wearing one of a Naval Officer. It was a great vacation in Pensacola.

I understand that now it has been combined with other Officer Indoctrination Courses up in Newport for direct commission people. My understanding was the original intent was to have CWO/LDO candidates got through with regular OCS kids too, but that went over like a beer fart in a baptist church. The little I have heard about it over on NKO and various Mustang websites sounds like it is now pretty unpopular.

SWO = Surface Warfare Officer. In the Navy at large, refers to any black shoe officer aboard a ship, especially one who is surface warfare qualified. Includes CWOs and LDOs. In the Surface community, it refers to 1110's. An 1110 is a general unrestricted line officer. Traditional Navy.

There is no real school for CWO like the Army Warrant Officer School. CWO in the Navy is a very different animal, and the way to get selected is - SUSTAINED SUPERIOR PERFORMANCE.

Period.

Thanks vegas. You cleared things up tremendously. So how do the "tradition" naval officers feel about having to salute another who hasn't gone through the "usual channels" to get their commission? Can a CWO/LDO promote all the way up to Admiral, or is there some kind of "ceiling rank"?

quote:

Originally posted by Epsilon203:
Thanks vegas. You cleared things up tremendously. So how do the "tradition" naval officers feel about having to salute another who hasn't gone through the "usual channels" to get their commission? Can a CWO/LDO promote all the way up to Admiral, or is there some kind of "ceiling rank"?

A salute is a salute. You salute anyone who outranks you. You might not think the LT SUPPO, to pick an easy target, deserves any kind of respect, but since the SUPPO is an LT and I was a CWO, I would salute him. And if he did not return my salute in a proper military manner I had his arss for breakfast. A CWO usually gets alot of respect from Junior Officers. I had to correct a couple from time to time as they would salute me.

There are now CWO grades 2 - 5 in the Navy. It is 4 years between grades. Pretty much everyone will promote to W3 unless you fall very hard on your sword. Selectivity gets tougher at the W4 level, about 70%. There was no W5 when I retired, so I do not know first hand what the selection rate is, though I expect it to be around 40%. Once you are passed over 2x for promotion you must retire. See the current regulations for applying to the CWO program, there are a couple of changes due to the flying CWO experiment, but in general, to apply you need to be at least a Chief with 2 years in grade at commissioning. You commission CWO2.

LDO can go as high as O6, or Captain. There is no current O7 billet for the LDO community that I know of. Since most LDOs have nearly 10 years in at commissioning, they will hit their 30 year maximum well before being eligible for O6 selection. Once selected for O5 or O6, though, they can continue past the 30 year limit on a year to year thing like regular unrestricted line senior officers do. By the way, an LDO commission is a temporary commission. You remain a permanent enlisted. When you reach the O4 level you must be a permanent officer to accept promotion. Because you must have 10 years commissioned service to retire as an officer, if you are not permanent at the O2 or O3 level and fail to promote, or for some reason want to retire at your 20 year mark, you revert to enlisted. CWO is a permanent commission from day 1.

By the way, I have never seen a Chief Warrant Officer salute another Chief Warrant Officer. CWOs in the Navy are a very tight bunch. They are the best of the best and they know it. Like I said, there are four grades of CWO, but (as I read in a book somewhere) rank among warrant officers is like virginity among prostitutes - there is none.

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