Just a little note here-

On another thread the subject of having the AUX get involved with doing border type of enforcement/reporting came up and I would like to throw that our for discussion here.

So, with that said, what do you think of the CGAUX doing some type of border enforcement or reporting?

Let us try to keep it just to this issue and not bring in other hashed out ideas about name of groups, just brainstorm ideas, heck maybe someone up the ladder will get the idea also!

Let's have some of the pros and cons on this issue tell us why you see it as a plus or why not.
Don't just post your comment in the negative or positive without backing it up.

ANd please let us know if you are a current CG-Aux member or not and please try to be civil toward one another this time.

PS: No I am not CG-AUX.
Ken

This message has been edited. Last edited by: kdreger,

We already are and have been doing so for many, many, many years.

We already are and have been doing so for many, many, many years.

A truthful more complete, nuanced and therefore more truthful answer requires you divide patrolling into the three zones of interest - air, sea and land.

Let's dispose of the easy one first - land. The Aux doesn't do it. The Aux has no one on the border. It is hard enough to next-to-impossible to get permission to do land-mobile patrols away from the border - ie critical infrastructure. Should the CGAux do it? First does the Aux have sufficient strength and interest near the border to support the mission? My hunch would be it doesn't.

Then the easy one - air. During my time in the Aux Air program - border patrol or in CG-speak alien interdiction was the sine qua non of southern Florida aviation. Just about every flight was an alien interdiction flight. And we were pretty good at it. It is also very safe. However, it was mostly a day time operation. I don't remember any interdiction flights going off at night and none patrolled the critical area that the smugglers took at night.

Surface (water) patrols were pretty much off the board. Three years ago there was an approved experimental set of patrols that ran at night off shore with night vision goggles and preferably radar. The experiment got terminated when the CG PTB stated such covert night ops were a violation of the OpsPolMan and other policies. It was the Rogue Coxswains deliberate violation of the 'no covert ops' policy that lead to my predictament (but lets not go there again).

That could leave the possibility of 'open' patrols but there are problems with that. To be of any use the patrols have to be far off-shore. If you are within a few miles of the coast, the BGs will be ashore before anyone can respond. But the CG doesn't like the Aux to be far off-shore.

If the Aux boat is far enough off-shore to be of use then the CG seems to have an issue with the Aux vessel pursuing the BG vessel until the cavalry arrives. It doesn't have this problem with Aux aircraft so the issue may be more of a safety concern (what if the BGs turn on the unarmed Aux vessel) then some LE related issue.

So the real answer is that the Aux is involved with border security but only in 1 element - air. And that involvement flucuates heavily based on the size of the CG budget in any given quarter.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: FL51D7,

This is twice this week people have said that I've made an untrue statement or am not being truthful. I'm getting pretty sick of it.

If you want to say that a more "complete answer..." I'm fine with that.

quote:

I'm fine with that.

Could you elaborate please....?



Just bustin' your chops in a lighthearted moment!

I can take the heat on people who don't like my opinions, but carelessely and unnecessarily implying that someone is lying about stuff is uncallsed for.

carelessely and unnecessarily implying

Maybe if you weren't so flippant and brief in your answers then the problem wouldn't have arisen in the first place.

Just compare your answer to the more complete and therefore more truthful answer.

Anyway I fixed it.

Ken,

Maybe if you posed your question to only current members of the CG Auxiliary -- then your responses may be more...valuable.

The USCG's exposure to "the border" are primarily the oceans and gulfs. The CGAUX being an element of total USCG forces is involved in operations in these "border areas". Recognize that the primary mission of the CG Auxiliary is recreational boating safety, and you'll find that dedicated LE support missions are not the majority of USCG ordered and funded patrols.

Realize too that we operate under USCG orders -- we can't simply hop in a boat and go "cruising". Even if the desire of the Auxiliarists were to become involved in such water-borne neighborhood watches for illegals (and I doubt that it is), they would not be able to simply "get involved".

With that said, all CG Auxiliary missions on the water allow for an element of Maritime Domain Awareness -- if something looks suspicious, it should be documented and communicated by the Auxiliary vessel -- but the subject(s) are not to be confronted.

So, in effect, the CG Auxiliary is involved in observing and reporting suspicious activities on the nation's water borders.

If the question is: Should the CG Auxiliary become involved with the "BPAUX"? -- My answer is no -- for the reasons previously discussed in the other thread.

The "CG Aux leadership up the ladder" is now aware of your group -- and the content of the recent threads here in the forum. (as they became aware of an errant CG Auxiliary detachment's website -- that has now been shut down) No interest has been communicated back down the chain of any interest in giving the "BPAUX" any legitimate consideration...sorry.

FS that is great, I welcome the call and I am sure they have my contact information by now.

I may be traveling but will get back to them as soon as I can.

Ken

If I may add some thoughts here, just my opinion, not any official policies of any agency.

I was a BM3/Coxswain in Islamorada 85-88 and then a US Customs/CBP Marine Enforcement Officer in South Florida for 17 yrs.

CG Aux aircraft can certainly spot targets of interest such as a go-fast drifting out of gas or broke down, a group of bales in the water, boats stashed in the mangroves, etc.

These targets can be reported back to the USCG Station who can either send their own boat or contact another agency, ie: CBP, USBP, FWC etc and see if they have a boat that can respond.

The CG Aux aircraft may also spot a suspect aircraft flying low on the deck to avoid radar. Now this generally occurs at night but I know of a few cases it happened in daylight. Call it in, don't try to get close enough to get tail numbers.

CG Aux Vessels, they may certainly stumble upon a broken down smugglers boat and not realize it until they are alongside. Pull away ASAP and get far away. Let the L/E agencies handle it. If you see something that looks suspicious before you pull up close, don't bother trying to get close enough to read the registration numbers. Just call it in.

Stay safe out there and thank you for your efforts.

Don

quote:

I was a BM3/Coxswain in Islamorada

In other words you went to heaven and didn't have to die first. I was at Station Marathon for a short period.

quote:

Originally posted by TybeeBM1:

quote:

I was a BM3/Coxswain in Islamorada

In other words you went to heaven and didn't have to die first. I was at Station Marathon for a short period.

As a visitor of mine from Milpitas, California commented a couple of years ago while sitting by my pool in a gentle breeze and sipping a Mojita: "Another crappy day in Paradise."

When I was at Marathon a visitor asked an MK2 if the crystal clear water in the canal was salt or fresh. He replied that it was neither salt water or fresh water. When the visitor asked what it was the MK2 said, "Bacardi".

Any place is better than Milpitas!

Focus guys, focus, back on topic, and remember be nice please.

If you want to throw stones, throw them at me.

Ken

Only if we can carry guns. Lots of BAD guys that have and use guns bringing drugs over.

Better to stay away from that. Lots to do any way. We do a lot of good, but the pay is a little low for being shot at.

Curt

Not on the Mexican border. Right now there are gang wars going on in Mexico over control of drug and illegal alien smuggling. Unlike the Mafia, these people do not draw the line at women and children. If it moves, it dies, is their philosophy. Do you think these assassins would hesitate to shoot at an Auxiliary OPFAC?