Today I was bouncing around on Federal agencies websites looking at different carrer paths they offer. (I am still joining the USCG first). I noticed on the FBI's website the Hostage rescue Team's qualifications. It list every military branch, except for the USCG, and layed out which special operations group would increase your chances of gaining a spot with the HRT. Now I am curious if the members Within DOG and the USCG community think they measure up and could compete for an HRT position. MSST, MSRT, VBST, and LEDET what do you think? Maybe this is just another case of the USCG being left out.

I'm sure the CG members would believe they could compete for the job. However, the FBI teams are not exactly a wide open field with thousands of members, so the chances of anyone, CG or otherwise, scoring one of those jobs are pretty slim.

It seems your interest in the CG is only to prepare you for a future job so why waste your time with the CG? Why not spend your time getting the schooling necessary to pursue that career rather then spend 4 years in the CG?

Those other DoD units are trained longer, have direct combat experience, and more. While the LEDET/TACLET/MSST etc etc have some great training, they are not combat units, nor are they involved in the amount of "gunplay" that the others are part and parcel to.

DOG units are not Special Operations Forces.

EX GM, Actually I am expecting to retire from the Coast guard, and then pursue other government agency jobs. I have all ready completed my Schooling for now. BS in CJ

I did forget to mention specialized training such as SWAT training was also mentioned as acceptable. Would the DOG units most likely fall under this?

Also please understand I am not doubting what the DOG does and can do everyday, I am simply curious how these units feel about there training and experiences, and where this places them amoung other SWAT based units. How do those other swat units feel about the DOG, if they have had much contact.

quote:

EX GM, Actually I am expecting to retire from the Coast guard, and then pursue other government agency jobs. I have all ready completed my Schooling for now. BS in CJ

Ah, OK, now I get it.

quote:

EX GM, Actually I am expecting to retire from the Coast guard, and then pursue other government agency jobs. I have all ready completed my Schooling for now. BS in CJ

Fair warning: most if not all GS-1811 positions (criminal investigator) have a mandatory retirement age of 57. To get a retirement from them, you have to give 20 years. That means retiring from the CG before age 37 to get your second career job started.

If you went to college for four years out of HS (assuming your were 18 YOA and took four years to complete your degree), you are already behind the eight ball to get that agent job.

The FBI in general doesn't really look at CJ degrees. They want doctors, lawyers, accountants, computer programmers and forensics, etc. A general CJ degree might get you into the door at a local PD, but a Public Administration or Business Administration degree will help get you advanced there.

Unfortunately, a CJ degree isn't all what it used to be. Probably should have gotten a Homeland Security degree instead.

Way of the world...

quote:

Originally posted by JerryG:

quote:

EX GM, Actually I am expecting to retire from the Coast guard, and then pursue other government agency jobs. I have all ready completed my Schooling for now. BS in CJ

Fair warning: most if not all GS-1811 positions (criminal investigator) have a mandatory retirement age of 57. To get a retirement from them, you have to give 20 years. That means retiring from the CG before age 37 to get your second career job started.

If you went to college for four years out of HS (assuming your were 18 YOA and took four years to complete your degree), you are already behind the eight ball to get that agent job.

The FBI in general doesn't really look at CJ degrees. They want doctors, lawyers, accountants, computer programmers and forensics, etc. A general CJ degree might get you into the door at a local PD, but a Public Administration or Business Administration degree will help get you advanced there.

Unfortunately, a CJ degree isn't all what it used to be. Probably should have gotten a Homeland Security degree instead.

Way of the world...

Thank you for the advice, but I am still young and have many ideas of my future, only time will tell what I actually pursue. I figured with a BS in CJ and Military experience this would increase my chances. I also plan to get a 2nd degree but not now.

does anyone have any feelings on the original post

Here is a cut and paste

Tactical Experience Requirements.
To qualify for the Tactical Recruiting Program (TRP), you will need to bring some special skills, talents, and experience. All candidates will be rated based on their experience levels, and the most qualified will be eligible for this program. Each candidate will have the opportunity to summarize tactical training and experience in the Tactical Recruiting Program on-line application, which may be accessed after completing the Special Agent application. Here is a snapshot of those qualifications:

Must have at least 3 years of tactical experience in either law enforcement or the military.

Law Enforcement Experience:
With a Federal Agency tactical team (This category includes all Military Police.).


Or with a Local/County/State Agency or Department tactical team.
- Full-time tactical team experience will carry more weight than part-time experience.

- Completion of continuing education courses in at least three of the following: Basic SWAT • Advanced SWAT • Hostage Rescue • High Risk Arrest • Barricaded Subject • Basic Sniper/Observer • Advanced Sniper/Observer • Tactical Firearms • Mechanical Breaching

Military Experience – Army
Combat Arms experience. Service in Special Forces Group or Ranger Regiment will carry more weight.

Military Experience – Navy
Must have served in the Naval Special Warfare Community as a SEAL or Naval Special Warfare Officer.

Military Experience – Marine Corps
Combat Arms experience.

Military Experience – Air Force
Must have served in Combat Controller, Combat Rescue (Pararescue), or Tactical Air Control Party fields.

wheatacre:

The FBI HRT is their elite unit for that mission. Based in Quantico, VA, they respond anywhere in the country.

With that said, every FBI Field Office has a local SWAT contingency made up of local field agents that serve in tht capacity, when necessary. The HRT is called in for special missions.

The CG MSST/MSRT/PSU missions and capabilities may be a mystery to the FBI at this point. They may not be aware of what exactly the DOG does, and that is why the experience is not listed on your "cut and paste".

I admire your career goals, but again, I'd research things quite a bit more and nail those timelines (AKA age requirements) down as I stated above.

Good luck!

I understand, but I was trying to use the FBI as just one example.

JerryG.
AS for my carrer goals I actually am very interested in CGIS, Which I may pursue. I also looked very deeply into the age requirements which you listed, I was not aware of them so I am thankful. With you working in CGIS do you think a fed job would be any different overall. I am not interested in the Pay, as I am not a money hungry person.

Also do you know anything about FERS? I ask becuase I saw this on the Secret Service website?

"Will my military time count towards retirement?

Employees covered under the Federal Employees Retirement System (FERS) may receive credit for post 1956 military service only if he or she deposits with the employing agency a sum equal to three percent (3%) of the military basic pay he or she earned during the period of military service, plus interest. Interest begins two years after appointment. Active duty in the military service is counted for annual leave accrual purposes. However, if an applicant has retired from the military service, only time served in a war or campaign is credible for annual leave accrual purposes."

As the paragraph states, you can "buy back" your military time to count towards your federal civil service retirement (FERS). It is added on the end of the total service time.

My personal example, I bought back all 5 years 9 months of USCG time. As an 1811, I fall under the LEO/FF retirement of 20 years at age 50 or 25 years at any age. If I do 25 years civil service my USCG time gets added on at the end for a total of 30 years and 9 months.

My personal opinion is that you should look at what your end goal is. If you want to be an 1811, there are probably faster ways to achieve that goal than USCG service. Getting your foot in the door with any FLEA will allow you to gain federal status as well as relevant work experience.

I disagree with Jerry regarding the utility of the CJ degree or a Homeland Security degree. In my experience, the G, with the exception of certain agencies (i.e. FBI), doesn't really care what the degree is in as long as you have it. I have seen "degree inflation" where many candidates without relevant work experience obtain a master degree to be more competitive.

With all this being said, I wouldn't trade my USCG time for anything and really didn't know what my end goal was until I got on TACLET/LEDET. It took me four years and two additional agencies post USCG to obtain an 1811 position; some of my peers had already reached journeyman positions with their agencies by this time. Best of luck to you.

quote:

Originally posted by wheatacre:


does anyone have any feelings on the original post

Jerry already beat me to the posting about trying to retire from the military and get hired by a Federal Agency.

In reference to the original topic, I served on the US Customs Warrant Entry Tactical Team for maybe nine years down in South Florida.

I definitely think the USCG training helps but there's a whole lot more to learn once you get on to a Federal team like a SWAT, SRT, WETT or whatever they want to call themselves.

Having something like a couple or more years with a USCG DOG team is definitly going to look good on any application for the Federal Government. Does that help answer your question any better?

By the way, my brother has been with the King's Bay team for the past two years so I've got somewhat of an idea of what they do, not an overall knowledge of everything though.

Me? Prior to Customs, I was in the USCG for six years. Two years doing boardings from a 378' (The Chase) and the last three years as a Cox'n/Boarding Officer in the Florida Keys. That's what got me hired with Customs. (1 yr was at a SAR station in Mass.)

Don

quote:

Originally posted by FedRich:
My personal opinion is that you should look at what your end goal is. If you want to be an 1811, there are probably faster ways to achieve that goal than USCG service. Getting your foot in the door with any FLEA will allow you to gain federal status as well as relevant work experience.

Currently my goal is to be in the USCG, I have always wanted to serve the country and I believe the Coast Guard is my best fit right now. I am also allready DEP'ed in.

Thank you all for your advice.

Do you feel in the near future the CG Dog will become more common knowledge and therefor accpectable within the SWAT community

quote:

Originally posted by wheatacre:


Do you feel in the near future the CG Dog will become more common knowledge and therefor accpectable within the SWAT community

I'm not sure why you think it even matters. They don't have to answer to SWAT teams.

Don

I agree I dont know why I put that? Bored at work I guess

Wheat,

The DOG units have a unique set of skills for a maritime enviroment. Yes, the MSRT does sone high speed low drag tactics, but the reality is they are not SWAT. I was an operator for 12 years, the difference in tactics and training are comparable in some respects, but not the same.

Don't get me wrong. The MSST, MSRT, TACLET, LEDET's, are good to go, I recently had the opportunity to observe one of the MSST's doing room clearing and tactics training, I would go through a door with those cats anyday!

If you want to be a fed, look at CGIS once you get in the USCG. Also, the new ME rate will be online in JAN 2010, that IMHO is the rout you might want to take. The ME will, allegedly, be the "law enforcement specialist" at a unit and the primary function will be LE centric.

Something to chew on.

When I was stationed in New York City in 2003-4, we brought a large group of FBI SWAT Team members out to a specific location on a 41' to do some training with NYPD ESU, NYSP MRT, Park Police SRT, and a few other agencies and spec ops teams. I had a chance to speak with a few of the members on that team who informed me that almost all the members of their team were either Navy SEALs, Marine Force Recon, or some other type of prior service special operations combat team member. Believe me when I say, when these guys were getting pumped up, you could definitely see it in their eyes. They were some hardcore dudes. They also informed me that being on the FBI SWAT Team was only a collateral duty, and they all had some type of desk job.

quote:

Originally posted by JerryG:
wheatacre:

The FBI HRT is their elite unit for that mission. Based in Quantico, VA, they respond anywhere in the country.

I've been to the FBI unit at Quantico. A while back we (USCG) provided some special helo/water training for them.

I beg to differ that MSST's and LEDETS and TACLET are not combat Units. Alot of guys have prior LE experience on the outside in the real world, former police officers or some are reservists that are currently assigned to MSSTs. Alot of guys when I was at the MSST's all had prior combat training from other armed forces.

As for the FBI HRT, well can you WACO. I would rather train with NYPD ESU or LAPD SWAT or any of the SWAT teams then the FBI anyday. They all have more real world experience. Sorry if I offended any FEDS here. I have worked with local SWAT teams and the FBI and I have seen the difference.

quote:

Originally posted by Phxrider:
I beg to differ that MSST's and LEDETS and TACLET are not combat Units. Alot of guys have prior LE experience on the outside in the real world, former police officers or some are reservists that are currently assigned to MSSTs. Alot of guys when I was at the MSST's all had prior combat training from other armed forces.

As for the FBI HRT, well can you WACO. I would rather train with NYPD ESU or LAPD SWAT or any of the SWAT teams then the FBI anyday. They all have more real world experience. Sorry if I offended any FEDS here. I have worked with local SWAT teams and the FBI and I have seen the difference.

You never want any egos to get in the way of safety. While I was with the Customs WETT team, there were many raids where we had either the Homestead, FL PD SWAT team or the FDLE (Florida Dept of Law Enforcement) SWAT teams assist us.

In all honesty, it's those State or Local teams that have a whole lot more experience going for them.

Don