RE: http://www.military.com/features/0,15240,170900,00.html

"OVER MY DEAD BODY", it isn't your dead body that counts, it's the dead bodies of the trainees that count! Here'a a question for you, why don't you make AIT part of recruit training?
You can find excuses not, but they are excuses, none the less. If every soldier was first, a "RIFLEMAN", then what ever they were, sure seems like it would be a very effective Army...
I can understand the excuse of budgetary constraint, but that is a function of bad civilian leadership...
IMHO...
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

Since when did the Army start calling it boot camp? That would be the Marines, and don't ask a Marine to compare their training to the Army, because if you ask a MArine, their boot is the toughest place on earth.

quote:

Here'a a question for you, why don't you make AIT part of recruit training?

The simple answer is the Army has around 200 MOS's most of which has thier own AIT and they are located at dozens of differnt bases. Basic Training "the Army does not call it Boot Camp" however is only located at 5 bases currently. The logistics to support basic training at all AIT bases is just not there.

quote:

Originally posted by CannonsFront:

quote:

Here'a a question for you, why don't you make AIT part of recruit training?

The simple answer is the Army has around 200 MOS's most of which has thier own AIT and they are located at dozens of differnt bases. Basic Training "the Army does not call it Boot Camp" however is only located at 5 bases currently. The logistics to support basic training at all AIT bases is just not there.

Then I have a misconception, from what the Marine Corps did, when I was in the Navy.
The Marines expanded upon the basic weapons training of a Marine that had graduated from "boot camp". At the time, they were sent from MCRD San Diego, to Edson Range at Camp Joseph H. Pendleton, for, I believe, three more weeks of basic Marine Infantryman training, after their "boot" leave. Then they were sent to technical schools, like in the "Air Wing" or technical training as say a "turret repairman" or for "vehicle maintenance" schooling...
That was my point, make every Army Soldier, a basic Rifleman, so when and if an enemy attacked your convoy and your "wrecker" was shot out from under you, you could dismount and fight with full training as a basic Infantryman...
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

quote:

Originally posted by SUNLINER81:
"OVER MY DEAD BODY", it isn't your dead body that counts, it's the dead bodies of the trainees that count! Here'a a question for you, why don't you make AIT part of recruit training?
You can find excuses not, but they are excuses, none the less. If every soldier was first, a "RIFLEMAN", then what ever they were, sure seems like it would be a very effective Army...
I can understand the excuse of budgetary constraint, but that is a function of bad civilian leadership...
IMHO...
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

I'm not sure I understand your thought process. Are you suggesting that AIT be incorporated into Basic Training? If so, would we locate 200 different schools on the same post as Basic Training, or would we put a basic training camp on every Post that conducts AIT?
Not being a smart *** Sunliner...just don't understand what you're proposing?

I hear the first two weeks will be on sexual harassment.

I think it is great that Bootcamp has extended to 10 weeks. When I went in (69-72),it was much longer,and we learned so much more in that time frame,also had time to transition into "AIT",which made it much easier for us.

quote:

Originally posted by SUNLINER81:
If every soldier was first, a "RIFLEMAN", then what ever they were, sure seems like it would be a very effective Army...
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

Why do you think we are called GIs? General infantry. As my old 1st Sgt.(he was 11Bravo) used to say you are first & fore most infantry, then whatever else second. Some of us crewchief types tried to disagree. He answered by asking what are you if your helicopter is shot down?
Answer: infantry in a flight suit!

quote:

Originally posted by Ol_Doc:

quote:

Originally posted by SUNLINER81:
"OVER MY DEAD BODY", it isn't your dead body that counts, it's the dead bodies of the trainees that count! Here'a a question for you, why don't you make AIT part of recruit training?
You can find excuses not, but they are excuses, none the less. If every soldier was first, a "RIFLEMAN", then what ever they were, sure seems like it would be a very effective Army...
I can understand the excuse of budgetary constraint, but that is a function of bad civilian leadership...
IMHO...
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

I'm not sure I understand your thought process. Are you suggesting that AIT be incorporated into Basic Training? If so, would we locate 200 different schools on the same post as Basic Training, or would we put a basic training camp on every Post that conducts AIT?
Not being a smart *** Sunliner...just don't understand what you're proposing?

See my post above yours on the matter, I think that I cleared that up. There seems to be a fundamental difference, between the definition of Army AIT and what was Marine advanced training right after boot camp, when I was in, many years ago. I could have a misconception even then, as I wasn't a Marine, but the Marines attended the same schools, in aviation, as did the Navy and every Marine I talked with told me that they went to three weeks advanced training at Edson Range at Camp Pendleton after graduation from MCRD San Diego, for the "Hollywood" Marines, don't know where the Marines from Parris Island went...
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

quote:

Originally posted by Duster6:
I hear the first two weeks will be on sexual harassment.

I'd almost go back in for the right one sexually harrasing me for two weeks.

quote:

Originally posted by 67NOV:

quote:

Originally posted by SUNLINER81:
If every soldier was first, a "RIFLEMAN", then what ever they were, sure seems like it would be a very effective Army...
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

Why do you think we are called GIs? General infantry. As my old 1st Sgt.(he was 11Bravo) used to say you are first & fore most infantry, then whatever else second. Some of us crewchief types tried to disagree. He answered by asking what are you if your helicopter is shot down?
Answer: infantry in a flight suit!

G.I. actually was a slang name for Government Issue, all the way back to WW-II, but I guess you already know that and were making a joke about it...
I remember asking my Father about it and he told me about how everything that they received, had a G.I. typed as the last thing on their supply forms...
Shirt, Mans, Khaki, long sleeve 4EA G.I.
Shoes, Mans, field, brown[PR] 1EA G.I.
That's where he told me the term came from, everything you had, from your feet to the top of your head was G.I. and jokingly, so were you, a G.I....
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

This message has been edited. Last edited by: SUNLINER81,

I don't remember who told me this, but it's always stuck with me.

"The only difference between the regular Army and the Rangers is that the Rangers practice the basics really well."

So getting that extra training time would definitely be a great thing.

The army starting a 10 week Boot Camp is such a contrast to 1944 when young recruits, some dropping out of their senior year in high school, were rushed to Europe with barely 6 weeks of training. The result was massive casualties as some regiments were wiped out, such as in the Huertgen Forest. See the book by Paul Fussell on this subject, who also wrote "Thank God for the Atom Bomb" about the fears of a huge invasion of Japan, scheduled for late 1945 and another attack in 1946.

quote:

Originally posted by 4499124:
The army starting a 10 week Boot Camp is such a contrast to 1944 when young recruits, some dropping out of their senior year in high school, were rushed to Europe with barely 6 weeks of training. The result was massive casualties as some regiments were wiped out, such as in the Huertgen Forest. See the book by Paul Fussell on this subject, who also wrote "Thank God for the Atom Bomb" about the fears of a huge invasion of Japan, scheduled for late 1945 and another attack in 1946.

Or in Korea, where there were incidences of Marines getting a "boot camp" on the troop transports on the way over...
Respectfully, SUNLINER81

The army might have and does call it 'basic training' but I called it 'boot camp'. Why 'boot camp'? Because during their stay they were just empty headed bodies filling empty boots, both waiting to get broke in.

The army's Boot Camp is training the soldier to be a basic infantryman first by teaching them the basic of infantry knowledge, weapons qualification, obsticle course, infiltration course, hand grenade course, hand to hand, bayonet training, etc etc etc. Then everyone goes onto whatever speciality they signed up for and if it's infantry, they then go on to advanced infantry school. Everyone leaves boot camp with the working knowledge required to step in as a rifleman whenever the time comes.

NAVY BOOT CAMP, GREAT LAKES NAVAL TRAINING CENTER. 1959, OCT. 1ST. TO DEC. 20TH. 12 WEEKS OF BOOT CAMP. GUESS THE NAVY HAD MORE TO TEACH OR WE WERE JUST SLOW LEARNERS.

quote:

Originally posted by Batt_Boy:
Since when did the Army start calling it boot camp? That would be the Marines, and don't ask a Marine to compare their training to the Army, because if you ask a MArine, their boot is the toughest place on earth.

Hate to bust your bubble sparkie, but having did both Army BASIC and Marine BOOT CAMP, Army BASIC is no where near as chaotic. And, the way the Army has watered-down BASIC training (Drill Sergeants dont yell as much, carrying stress cards, trucks coming to a full stop and there is a "step-stool" positioned so recruits dont twist their ankles, Drill Sergeants taking on more of a mentor role), Marines dont have to say which indoc to the military is harder.....its been duly noted! Before you even try to make this a Army vs. Marines, you might want to ask around first.

quote:

Originally posted by saw424:
NAVY BOOT CAMP, GREAT LAKES NAVAL TRAINING CENTER. 1959, OCT. 1ST. TO DEC. 20TH. 12 WEEKS OF BOOT CAMP. GUESS THE NAVY HAD MORE TO TEACH OR WE WERE JUST SLOW LEARNERS.

Had to know how to operate the 3NAP nozzle on the end of that fire hose, shipmate!...
LOL Respectfully, SUNLINER81

Sunliner81, slight change. Marines go home for 10 days leave, then off to Marine Combat Training (non-Infantry).Advanced infantry skills taught for one to conduct themselves and operate in a combat environment. From there, MOS's are assigned and those who are going to be full-fledged 0311's (God's Chosen!), stay on post and go to ITB-Infantry Training Battallion..infantry on 'steroids! East coast, Marines go from Camp Geiger to Camp Lejeune, west coast Camp Pendelton.