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COLUMBUS, Ohio - Republican John McCain declared for the first time Thursday he believes the Iraq war can be won by 2013, although he rejected suggestions that his talk of a timetable put him on the same side as Democrats clamoring for full-scale troop withdrawals.

The Republican presidential contender, in a mystical speech that also envisioned Osama bin Laden dead or captured, and Americans with the choice of paying a simple flat tax or following their standard 1040 form, said only a small number of troops would remain in Iraq by the end of a prospective first term because al-Qaida will have been defeated and Iraq's government will be functioning on its own.

"By January 2013, America has welcomed home most of the servicemen and women who have sacrificed terribly so that America might be secure in her freedom. The Iraq War has been won," McCain told an audience of several hundred here in the capital city of a general election battleground state.

Later, as the Arizona senator drove to the airport on his "Straight Talk Express" campaign bus, McCain was peppered by reporters with questions about the timetable. He and his aides insisted there was a difference between ending the war and bringing troops home and, as they criticize the Democrats, announcing a withdrawal upfront without regard for the military endgame.

"It's not a timetable; it's victory. It's victory, which I have always predicted. I didn't know when we were going to win World War II; I just knew we were going to win," McCain said.

The Vietnam veteran added: "I know from experience, you set a day for surrender — which is basically what you do when you say you are withdrawing — and you will pay a much a heavier price later on."

In the primary campaign, McCain had criticized former Republican rival Mitt Romney for hinting at a timetable.

Democrats challenged McCain's comments, led by presidential contender Hillary Rodham Clinton.

In a statement, the New York senator dismissed McCain and said he "promises more of the same Bush policies that have weakened our military, our national security and our standing in the world." The Barack Obama campaign said that while the candidate agrees with some of McCain's sentiments, "you cannot embrace the destructive policies and divisive political tactics of George Bush and still offer yourself as a candidate of healing and change."

Other Democrats equated McCain's comment with President Bush's May 1, 2003, speech on the deck of an aircraft carrier displaying a "Mission Accomplished" banner.

In his remarks, McCain peered through a crystal ball to 2013 and envisioned an era of bipartisanship driven by weekly news conferences and British-style question periods with joint meetings of Congress.

The senator conceded he cannot make the changes alone, but said he wanted to outline a specific governing style to show the accomplishments it can achieve. He backed up his remarks with a Web ad featuring similar content.

"I'm not interested in partisanship that serves no other purpose than to gain a temporary advantage over our opponents. This mindless, paralyzing rancor must come to an end. We belong to different parties, not different countries," McCain said. "There is a time to campaign, and a time to govern. If I'm elected president, the era of the permanent campaign will end; the era of problem-solving will begin."

To the disdain of some fellow Republicans, the likely GOP nominee has worked with Democrats on legislation aimed at overhauling campaign finance regulations, redrafting immigration rules and regulations and implementing government spending controls.

While that has cultivated a maverick image for McCain, the Arizona senator has also been accused of exhibiting a nasty temper — swearing even at fellow lawmakers from his own party — and unabashed partisanship.

In particular, McCain has clashed with the leading Democratic presidential contender, Barack Obama. After tangling with the Illinois senator on lobbying reforms, McCain questioned Obama's integrity in a publicly released 2006 letter.

McCain wrote he had thought Obama's interest in ethics legislation "was genuine and admirable," before adding: "Thank you for disabusing me of such notions." He accused Obama of "partisan posturing."

In outlining other potential achievements of a first term in his speech, the 71-year-old McCain implicitly was suggesting he would seek a second term, an attempt to mute suggestions he would serve only four years after being the oldest president elected.

In particular, he sees a world in which the Taliban threat in Afghanistan has been greatly reduced.

He added: "The increase in actionable intelligence that the counterinsurgency produced led to the capture or death of Osama bin Laden, and his chief lieutenants. ... There still has not been a major terrorist attack in the United States since Sept. 11, 2001."

McCain also pledged to halt a Bush administration practice of enacting laws with accompanying signing statements that exempt the president from having to enforce parts he finds objectionable.


 
Posts: 20550 | Registered: Mon 22 April 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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If McCain truly believes this, he'd better qualify it with something. Otherwise it is as meaningless as any other campaign promise. I don't necessarily want all troops out of Iraq immediately but I do know that we should not be there forever.
 
Posts: 3132 | Registered: Thu 02 January 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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"I'm not interested in partisanship that serves no other purpose than to gain a temporary advantage over our opponents. This mindless, paralyzing rancor must come to an end. We belong to different parties, not different countries," McCain said. "There is a time to campaign, and a time to govern. If I'm elected president, the era of the permanent campaign will end; the era of problem-solving will begin."

So, McCain says (to paraphrase): "I'm a uniter, not a divider."
Hey...that's encouraging. Roll Eyes
 
Posts: 2318 | Registered: Thu 26 August 2004Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
"Resistance to reason is futile"

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The Republican presidential contender, in a mystical speech that also envisioned Osama bin Laden dead or captured, and Americans with the choice of paying a simple flat tax or following their standard 1040 form, said only a small number of troops would remain in Iraq by the end of a prospective first term because al-Qaida will have been defeated and Iraq's government will be functioning on its own.


I'd like to have some of what he's smoking.

Then again NOT!
 
Posts: 3108 | Registered: Tue 22 April 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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I give him even money.. in fact i give him better odds on Iraqi reunification than on American reunification....
 
Posts: 4845 | Registered: Thu 24 January 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

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Originally posted by godawgz:
I give him even money.. in fact i give him better odds on Iraqi reunification than on American reunification....

...or Democratic Party reunification. Big Grin


 
Posts: 20550 | Registered: Mon 22 April 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Oh, not to worry about the dems... Hillary just announced a timetable for withdrawing from the race regardless of conditions on the ground...
 
Posts: 4845 | Registered: Thu 24 January 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Originally posted by godawgz:
Oh, not to worry about the dems... Hillary just announced a timetable for withdrawing from the race regardless of conditions on the ground...


Hey, it ain't over till the fat lady in the pants suit sings!...
LOL Respectfully, SUNLINER81
 
Posts: 14977 | Registered: Thu 09 March 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Big Grin Beer Big Grin
 
Posts: 4845 | Registered: Thu 24 January 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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'Ghost city' Mosul braces for assault on last bastion of al-Qa'ida in Iraq
By Patrick Cockburn in Mosul
Monday, 12 May 2008


Mosul looks like a city of the dead. American and Iraqi troops have launched an attack aimed at crushing the last bastion of al- Qa'ida in Iraq and in doing so have turned the country's northern capital into a ghost town.


Soldiers shoot at any civilian vehicle on the streets in defiance of a strict curfew. Two men, a woman and child in one car which failed to stop were shot dead yesterday by US troops, who issued a statement saying the men were armed and one made "threatening movements".

Mosul, on the Tigris river, is inhabited by 1.4 million people, but has been sealed off from the outside world by hundreds of police and army checkpoints since the Iraqi government offensive against al-Qa'ida began at 4am on Saturday. The operation is a critical part of an attempt to reassert military control over Iraq which has led to heavy fighting in Baghdad and Basra.

The besieged city is now difficult to reach; we began the journey from the Kurdish capital Arbil in a convoy of white pick-up trucks, each with a heavy machine gun in the back manned by alert-looking soldiers, some wearing black face masks, that were escorting Khasro Goran, the deputy governor of Mosul, to his office in the city.

Soon after crossing the long bridge over the Zaab river and leaving territory officially controlled by the Kurds, we saw lines of trucks and cars being stopped by police. Their drivers presumably had not heard of the curfew. At the Christian village of Bartilla we exchanged our pick-ups for more heavily armoured vehicles with windows a few inches across of bulletproof glass.

I had been to Mosul down this road half a dozen times since the fall of Saddam Hussein in 2003 and on each occasion the military escort necessary to reach the city safely has grown bigger. Squinting through the small glass portholes it was clear that local people were taking the curfew seriously. Even the miserable cafes used by the truck drivers, and which I had imagined never closed their doors, had pulled down their metal shutters.

In eastern Mosul the streets are usually bustling and stalls spill on to the road near the tomb of the prophet Jonah, who died here some time after his alarming experience with the whale. Most of the people living in this part of the city are Kurds, who support the central government against al-Qa'ida. Yet, here too every shop was shut and there were police and soldiers at checkpoints every 50 yards. An extra brigade had been sent from Baghdad for the offensive along with special security troops to reinforce the 2nd and 3rd divisions.

Outside the police headquarters, the black vehicles of the Interior Ministry, each with a heavy machine gun and a yellow head of a tiger as an insignia on the doors, were drawn up in rows. American helicopters flew high overhead as well as drones for reconnaissance. There was the occasional burst of firing and bomb blast in the distance. The governor of Mosul, Dunaid Kashmoula, says the city "has come to be dominated by the leaders of al-Qa'ida as a result of the delay in the military operation" originally scheduled for earlier this year.

Nevertheless, the insurgents in Mosul have never held whole quarters of the city and there was no street fighting.

The Iraqi prime minister Nouri al-Maliki promised this offensive on Mosul as the last battle against al-Qa'ida. He promised revenge for the assassination of the previous police commander for the city who had been assassinated by an al-Qa'ida suicide bomber dressed in a police uniform.

These are critical days for Mr Maliki's government. Since 25 March he has launched military offensives in Basra and Baghdad. He is receiving support from the Americans and the Kurds. But it is not clear if the Iraqi army will fight without the backing of US firepower in the air or on the ground. On Saturday a ceasefire was agreed with the Mehdi Army of Muqtada al-Sadr in Sadr City giving the government greater control. But, as in Mosul, it is not clear how far the government's opponents have simply retreated to fight another day.

There is no doubt that security in Mosul has been deteriorating over the last six months. Mr Goran, who in effect runs the city, said that 90 people were killed in Mosul last September compared to 213 dead this March, including 58 soldiers and policemen. The number of roadside bombs had risen from 175 to 269 over the same period.

The official theory for this is that al-Qa'ida in Iraq, which has only a limited connection with Osama bin Laden and is largely home grown, has been driven out of its bastions in Anbar and Diyala provinces and Sunni districts of Baghdad. It has retreated to Mosul, the largest Sunni Arab city and the third largest in Iraq.

This is probably over-simple. Attacks on US troops in Anbar province have restarted and in Sunni districts of west Baghdad al-Qa'ida appears to be lying low rather than being eliminated. In many cases in Baghdad al-Sahwa, the supposedly anti-al-Qa'ida awakening councils paid by the Americans, in practice have cosy arrangements with al-Qa'ida.

I had decided to go to Mosul – arriving in the first hours of the government offensive – because of what proved to be a false report that the head of al-Qa'ida in Iraq, Abu Ayyub al-Masri, had been captured in the city. Later Iraqi security officers said they captured many "Emirs", al-Qa'ida cell leaders, and targeted hundreds of suspected houses.

I was in Mosul on the day it was surrendered by Saddam Hussein's forces in 2003. Scenes of joy were succeeded within the space of a few hours by looting and gun battles between Arabs and Kurds. Five years later Mosul, one of the great cities of the world, looks ruinous and under siege. Every alley way is blocked by barricades and the only new building is in the form of concrete blast walls. The fact that the government has to empty the streets of Mosul of its people to establish peace for a few days shows how far the city is from genuine peace.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/gho...-in-iraq-826264.html
 
Posts: 2408 | Registered: Sat 17 December 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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The war's been over for five years.
 
Posts: 8073 | Registered: Sat 31 December 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

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Originally posted by mcgreer:
The war's been over for five years.

Yep, the war against Iraq has been over for five years...the war for Iraq is still ongoing.


 
Posts: 20550 | Registered: Mon 22 April 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Originally posted by Sgt_Schlappy:
quote:
Originally posted by mcgreer:
The war's been over for five years.

Yep, the war against Iraq has been over for five years...the war for Iraq is still ongoing.

I fail to see the difference. Iraq is a mess whichever angle you choose to look at it from. Iraq's government is now subject to enormously more Iranian influence than ever, and still the vast majority of Iraqi's want the occupation forces gone.
The Iraqi Army, more then five years down the road, cannot carry out any kind of a major operation without having their hands held by US troops. Sadr gets the opportunity to lick his wounds and rearm AGAIN, even after being pretty much abandoned by the Iranians.
Violence is only really down between in the areas between concrete blast walls and curfews. The last few months have been as bloody as just about any other few months a year ago....
How's it going, that war for Iraq, by the way?
 
Posts: 4023 | Registered: Thu 08 December 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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McCain misquoted we would win by 2013.....what he really meant was 2033.
 
Posts: 9563 | Registered: Thu 20 October 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Actually I think McCain meant to say it would end in 3210.
 
Posts: 95 | Registered: Tue 10 January 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Yes by then we will have won the battle of fallujah 1000 times. Razz
 
Posts: 9563 | Registered: Thu 20 October 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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We could have it wrapped up by then, but once again anywhere our troops are in the ME they will be a target.. reference Beirut, Khobar Towers, The USS Cole, etc etc..
 
Posts: 4845 | Registered: Thu 24 January 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

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I fail to see the difference.

Then you fail. Glad you can at least admit it.


quote:
the vast majority of Iraqi's want the occupation forces gone.

...as soon as is realistically possible, not before.


quote:
The Iraqi Army, more then five years down the road, cannot carry out any kind of a major operation without having their hands held by US troops.

Primarily thanks to the EU's refusal to assist with training.


quote:
more Iranian influence than ever

Do you think just up and leaving would solve that problem?


quote:
How's it going, that war for Iraq, by the way?

Slow, but steady progress...outside of more assistance from the international community (and regional neigbors) got any suggestions on how it can be sped up?


 
Posts: 20550 | Registered: Mon 22 April 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

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Originally posted by foxred03:
If McCain truly believes this, he'd better qualify it with something. Otherwise it is as meaningless as any other campaign promise. I don't necessarily want all troops out of Iraq immediately but I do know that we should not be there forever.




I don't see why not, we're going to be in Germany forever, most likely we'll be in Japan forever, you know damn well our ground forces in Korea aren't going anywhere.
 
Posts: 4758 | Registered: Sun 06 March 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
"God Save The American States"
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i think we could too but only if we the people all support it and all means of doing it.... only then can we win this..... but it will take the support of all of us both the house and senate all support what will be needed to do it.....


 
Posts: 33395 | Registered: Thu 18 August 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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