|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||||||||||
Military.com Forums Hot Topics & Current Events In the News Issued Body Armor Best for Combat|
Go
|
New
|
Find
|
Notify
|
Tools
|
Reply
|
|
|
Basic Training |
RE:The current gear issued is best,...THAT is TOTAL B.S..The pencil pushers only care about one thing and it isn't the safety of Marines.It has been proven there is better bullet vests out there, they just don't like the price. Also Marines can buy their own gear--get real! And get the Best this country can make-like scopes and night vision for Sniper units. Just give them the BEST and they will do the rest. http://www.military.com/features/0,15240,137399,00.html
|
||
|
|
Experienced Member |
however, commanders may authorize the use of commercial armor if it doesn't interfere with the functionality of the issued gear
I would interpret this statement very liberally as a unit commander. |
|||
|
|
Experienced Member |
Good morning John and welcome to the forum. Thanx for your service. I salute you! There have been a couple of earlier threads discussing this issue. Most agree with your assessment.
|
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
I think things haven't changed much since my time in VietNam-67-68, we were always short equipment and had to barter with the Army who always seemed to have sooooo much.
 |
|||
|
|
Experienced Member |
So does the Air Force. My mouth dropped in amazement back in 1982 when I was escorted through an Air Force communications warehouse at Edwards Air Force Base, California.
|
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
When was the last time Major Tippett took a few rounds with his infallible body armour. While our tactical weapons and protective systems experts may have all the answers, they are more than lacking in solutions. It must be nice to be able pontificate in a safe haven (U.S.).
|
|||
|
Member |
The US Army Issue Interceptor Body Armor with SAPI Plates SAVED My Azz Twice in Baghdad, I'm a Believer Now.
|
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
And I drove cars for thirty with no seat belts and never got killed, So what is the point?
|
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
I would have to assume that the given interview was in response the the testing that NBC did (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=861L7Ly-gR4), in which the said testing was to compare the Interceptor Body Armor w/ SAPI plates was compared to Dragon Skin by Pinnacle Armor(http://www.pinnaclearmor.com/body-armor/). I first discovered Dragon Skin through Military.com.
Anyway, in the testing NBC went to a independent ballistics lab in Europe. During this testing the SAPI plate failed to stop the 4th round of 7.62 armor piecing rounds while Dragonskin stopped the 7th shot. They also said that Dragonskin had a lot less blunt force trauma to the clay behind the vests. I should point out that 7 shots was the maximum number of shots fired in any of the tests. After testing the 7.62 armor piecing rounds they switched to 7.62 armor piecing incediary rounds. Interceptor w/SAPI plates stopped 5 rounds of this but the 5 round left a deep indentation in the clay. Interceptor failed on the 6th round. There was one point during the test that the Army said that they heated both Armor systems to 120 degree F and that Dragonskin failed due to melting of internal adhesives which secure Dragonskin's disks in place. I would have liked to see NBC test that claim as well, but they did not. There are other things they could test between them as well. For example, how does Dragonskin behave in a Fire? Would it melt to the wearer's skin like UnderArmor? I believe the Interceptor is an excellent vest, certainly better than most on the market. Personnally, I would rather have Dragonskin if it is going to be my life on the line. |
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
Here is another link to the part of the NBC report that addresses the tempture issue that was raised in the above post. This is actally the first part of the same report.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMrA2SEat8k Here is another link that covers Pinnacle's level 5 Dragonskin. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKnfHhRl7U0 Another Couple Videos Future Weapons(Part 1 of 2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYaSRIbPWkM Future Weapons(Part 2 of 2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_HRQNd84ZA |
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
The armor the we get issued Isnt the lightest or the most menuverable. If a marine wants dragon skin and pay for it out of his pocket let him use it its his life. So just let the men take what they want if the sign a waver
|
|||
|
|
Member |
-The Point Einstein is the ISSUE Body Armor WORKS, IT Does save LIVES without the Dragon Skin Hype. Dragon Skin is also 20lbs Heavier than the IBA, Now You may never have to wear that, but for those who do 20lbs extra in that heat reduces Mobility, degrades physical performance. As for DS having Neck Protection, well so does the IBA, and guess what? Neither is Rifle Fire Proof, both are designed to stop Fragments. Pinnacles DAPS Shoulder Pieces dont even cover as much upper arm as the IBA based DAPS. |
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
When it comes to personal protective equipment, commanders have a moral obligation to enforce the disciplined use of approved gear. The Marine or Soldier that leaves his SAPI out of his vest (in addition to being a fool) places the rest of his unit at higher risk. If he is wounded unecessarly, it dilutes the ability of the squad's corpsman or medic from dealing with other, less avoidable injuries. Regarding the Interceptor vest, one of my Marines in Fallujah got hit 4X by 7.62x39 in the chest, and his black SAPI stopped all 4. The newer green SAPI are even better, and the interceptor vests don't melt in the direct sunlight (aka daytime patrolling). The new side plates also allow the weight of the armor worn to be "scaled" up or down, based on the mission and local threat. BTW, the NBC test shots on the Dragonskin were all full frontal shots. Shoot it at an oblique angle to the surface, and anecdotal experiences in Iraq indicate it's a different ball game. Glad the gentleman survived not wearing seatbelts. Like any protective gear, when you need it you REALLY NEED IT!
|
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
I am a Marines Mother want my son to have the best armor on the market. If Dragon Skin is the best then I would buy it for him if they would let him wear it. Another thing why doesn't our country furnished room and board for our fighting men and women. My son told me he has to pay for room and board. That sucks. They are out there risking their lives and the military can't pay for there food and a place for them to sleep. Come on America speak up.
|
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
What is your son's rank, and where is he currently stationed?
|
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
wat i wanna know is wy dont we give everybody the best and watch them do wat they were trained to do the stupid crackers wy cant they figure that out
|
|||
|
|
Experienced Member |
You statement says it all...IF DragonSkin is the best. The FACT is that DragonSkin can't stop the rounds that issued body armor can. The FACT is that the glue that holds the DragonSkin "scales" together fails at 120 degrees F, which is not an atypical temperature in Iraq in the summertime. There is always this assumption that the military buys the cheapest piece of crap and forces it on poor soldiers in order to support industries and contractors. But, really, look back at the military's history. You ***** about the M16, but the military has an excellent track record for dumping their rifle when a better one comes along. They noted the superiority of the Spanish using smokless powder mausers v/s their trapdoor springfields, so they dumped the 45-70 for the .30 Army (aka 30-40 Krag) in the Krag-Jorgenson rifle...to take advantage of a repeating rifle with a smokeless powder cartridge. Only 11 years later they upgraded again to the 1903 Springfield to take advantage of a more powerful cartridge. 3 years later they upgraded the cartridge again to a spitzer bullet for even better performance. 30 or so years later they upgraded to a semi-auto. This trend was the same earlier, it was the same later. Don't assume the M16 (or any other piece of GI equipment) is a piece of crap because the military issues it to soldiers. Issuing equipment that is inferior and/or gets troops killed is counterproductive. When something better comes along, the military will invariably adopt it and issue it. My point: Don't believe Pinnacle's DragonSkin hype. It's the product of a PR department; not superior results compared to Interceptor. By the way, the service does provide room and board to your son. What your son probably lost is his extra allowances for housing and subsistence, because the government is providing both in theater. Or, your son IS getting the allowances, and has to pay them back for his meals and hooch. |
|||
|
|
Experienced Member |
The best according to testing, or the best according to the opinion of Uncle Roy, Cousin Mel, Grandpa and your buddy Skeeter? Opinions are like a**holes...and the military has already figured that out. But, hey...join up and feel free to express your opinion as much as you want. |
|||
|
Experienced Member |
The difference is the other cars on the road weren't all aiming at you. |
|||
|
|
Basic Training |
I believe this contention is not true. I believe the Marine Corp's is basing their contention, in whole or in large part, on the US Army's testing of "Dragon Skin" at their Aberdeen Prooving Grounds. As a ammunition, I believe the ARMY specificall "doped" the round's they used to purposefully defeat previous "Dragon Skin" test's...which were superior to our current standard issue jacket's. I believe the ARMY designed their own "super cartridge" loading configuration's at their own cartridge loading laboratories. The ARMY did NOT use standard-issued NATO round's in their test's. I have inquired of the President of Pinnacle Armor, maker's of "Dragon Skin" and they were not invited to these test's and were refused examples of samples of the actual round's used. I rest my case this probable case of deception and fraud. Oh, and to hell with the "best" equipment for our troop's, huh?
|
|||
|
| Previous Topic | Next Topic | powered by eve community | Page 1 2 |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
|||
| Site | Military.com Forums | ||
| Servlet | eve2da047 | ||
| Version | 1.2.22 build 9062 | ||
| Module | Forums 4.0.3 | ||
| Stylesheet | "Front Door" | ||
| Wordlet Set | "Default Wordlet Set" | ||
|
Military.com Forums Hot Topics & Current Events In the News Issued Body Armor Best for Combat
