quote:

Kinda like all of the bloviating blowhard bloggers here...

you make a living by posting here? Neat!

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First of all the removal of the president of Honduras was legal. He was in violation of their constitution. It was not a coup d' etat.

BUT the way they did it was illegal. That's the problem. It was a coup. It is what it is.

"A coup d'état (pronounced /ˌkuːdeɪˈtɑː/ us dict: kōō′·dā·tâ′), or coup for short, is the sudden, unconstitutional deposition of a legitimate government, by a small group of the State Establishment — usually the military — to replace the deposed government with another, either civil or military. A coup d’état succeeds when the usurpers establish their legitimacy if the attacked government fail to thwart them, by allowing their (strategic, tactical, political) consolidation and then receiving the deposed government’s surrender; or the acquiescence of the populace and the non-participant military forces."

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Originally posted by Kegler300:

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Originally posted by adminnco1:
Rush "lost" nothing. He is a bloviating blowhard who makes his living commenting on the actions of others while safely hiding behind a microphone.

Kinda like all of the bloviating blowhard bloggers here...

Some, but by all means not all, as many, unlike chickenhawk Rush, served in the military.

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Originally posted by crackerjacks61:

quote:

First of all the removal of the president of Honduras was legal. He was in violation of their constitution. It was not a coup d' etat.

BUT the way they did it was illegal. That's the problem. It was a coup. It is what it is.

"A coup d'état (pronounced /ˌkuːdeɪˈtɑː/ us dict: kōō′·dā·tâ′), or coup for short, is the sudden, unconstitutional deposition of a legitimate government, by a small group of the State Establishment — usually the military — to replace the deposed government with another, either civil or military. A coup d’état succeeds when the usurpers establish their legitimacy if the attacked government fail to thwart them, by allowing their (strategic, tactical, political) consolidation and then receiving the deposed government’s surrender; or the acquiescence of the populace and the non-participant military forces."

Bingo! So definitionally, there is no such thing as a "legal" coup and Obama's characterization of the coup as "not legal" was/is meaningless ... except that he will be expected to say the same thing for all future coups ... since there is no such thing (your definition) as a legal one.

Coups are one of two things ... successful ... or unsuccessful. So far, this one has been successful ... as opposed to one in Venezuela some years back that left chowderhead Chavez in jail.

Sen. Jim DeMint (R, S.C.) also supports the coup in Honduras.

"http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2009/07/02/sen-demint-supports-honduran-coup/"

It doesn't matter how much the GOP adores the Honduran coup (and wet dreams all over itself hoping it will happen here in the USA), the coup will not survive given that the UN, OAS, and United States condemn it and refuse to recognize Michelleti as the Honduran President.

Ahhhh the thrill of the Dems, having Bush, Palin, and Limbaugh to bash, life after sanity

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Originally posted by Kegler300:

quote:

Originally posted by adminnco1:
Rush "lost" nothing. He is a bloviating blowhard who makes his living commenting on the actions of others while safely hiding behind a microphone.

Kinda like all of the bloviating blowhard bloggers here...

Rush, makeing millions bashing Dems

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Originally posted by PhoenixDark:
Sen. Jim DeMint (R, S.C.) also supports the coup in Honduras.

"http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2009/07/02/sen-demint-supports-honduran-coup/"

It doesn't matter how much the GOP adores the Honduran coup (and wet dreams all over itself hoping it will happen here in the USA), the coup will not survive given that the UN, OAS, and United States condemn it and refuse to recognize Michelleti as the Honduran President.

Sorry PD ... but I disagree. It doesn't matter whether the UN, OAS, or Obama recognize Michelleti ... they'll recognize his duly elected replacement elected in November (or possibly earlier) ... and it won't be Zelaya. Michelleti is a place-holder ... and unless he backs away ... or the OAS mounts an invasion force in violation of its charter ... the coup is over except for essentially meaningless posturing.

All coups are definitionally "illegal" ... a meaningless categorization from a meaningless POTUS. What matters is whether they are successful ... or not. Zelaya is gone ... there will be no change to the Honduran Constitution ... accordingly I don't see how anyone can say the "coup" was not successful.

Doesn't surprise me the Republican Party Leader Rush Limbaugh would now start coming out with openly seditious/treasonous statements advocating the violent overthrow of our freely elected government. Perhaps keeping Guantanamo open for his type wouldn't be such a bad investment in our national security.

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Originally posted by jack_flats:
Doesn't surprise me the Republican Party Leader Rush Limbaugh would now start coming out with openly seditious statements advocating the violent overthrow of our elected government. Perhaps keeping Guantanamo open for his type wouldn't be a bad investment in our national security.

Glad to see you now favor keeping Guantanamo open ... don't care why you come around ... just so you do. Make sure you write Obama with your recommendation.

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Originally posted by jack_flats:
Doesn't surprise me the Republican Party Leader Rush Limbaugh would now start coming out with openly seditious/treasonous statements advocating the violent overthrow of our freely elected government. Perhaps keeping Guantanamo open for his type wouldn't be such a bad investment in our national security.

Forget Gitmo - turn him over to the Egyptians

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Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

Originally posted by PhoenixDark:
Sen. Jim DeMint (R, S.C.) also supports the coup in Honduras.

"http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2009/07/02/sen-demint-supports-honduran-coup/"

It doesn't matter how much the GOP adores the Honduran coup (and wet dreams all over itself hoping it will happen here in the USA), the coup will not survive given that the UN, OAS, and United States condemn it and refuse to recognize Michelleti as the Honduran President.

Sorry PD ... but I disagree. It doesn't matter whether the UN, OAS, or Obama recognize Michelleti ... they'll recognize his duly elected replacement elected in November (or possibly earlier) ... and it won't be Zelaya. Michelleti is a place-holder ... and unless he backs away ... or the OAS mounts an invasion force in violation of its charter ... the coup is over except for essentially meaningless posturing.

All coups are definitionally "illegal" ... a meaningless categorization from a meaningless POTUS. What matters is whether they are successful ... or not. Zelaya is gone ... there will be no change to the Honduran Constitution ... accordingly I don't see how anyone can say the "coup" was not successful.

What you fail to realize is that without any meaningful diplomatic recognition of his government by these organizations (UN, OAS, and the USA), Honduras will quickly find itself quite isolated in the world community.
No foreign trade, it's banks being outcasts in the international banking community no IMF financial aide, no loans, it's neighbors shuttering their borders with Honduras, ect.
Isolated. Pariah Nation.

It won't take long of that for Hondurans to see that this is NOT the way to go.

Like I said in a similar thread, if it were myself calling the shots in the oval office, there would be 2 CBG's along with Amphib ships and Boomers parked 15 miles off of of Honduras' northern and southern coastline.

Talk softly and carry a BIG stick, because sometimes the misbehaving child needs to be reminded of the about the belt.

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What you fail to realize ...

Sure I do PD ... the current leadership only has to hold out until elections are held in November (or sooner as is a real possibility). Regardless, I realize (but you fail to) that Zelaya, regardless of what happens, is dead in the water as is a change to the Honduran Constitution. That was and remains the objective of the so-called "coup" ... and it is a done deal. EVEN if Zelaya were to return to serve out his term, the objectives have been achieved. The US, the OAS, and the UN are wasting ammo.

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Like I said in a similar thread, if it were myself calling the shots in the oval office, there would be 2 CBG's along with Amphib ships and Boomers parked 15 miles off of of Honduras' northern and southern coastline.

What a waste of money ... unless you would use that "big stick" ... in which case thank God you are not calling the shots. Would be a terrible mistake and a clear violation of the OAS Charter deserving of international condemnation.

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Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

Originally posted by jack_flats:
Doesn't surprise me the Republican Party Leader Rush Limbaugh would now start coming out with openly seditious statements advocating the violent overthrow of our elected government. Perhaps keeping Guantanamo open for his type wouldn't be a bad investment in our national security.

Glad to see you now favor keeping Guantanamo open ... don't care why you come around ... just so you do. Make sure you write Obama with your recommendation.

In this case Jack is right on the money.

The Coup in Honduras consisted of more than removing the Presdent. It consisted of arresting members of Congress, shutting down the opposition press, and censoring television.

No wonder Rush is in favor of it.

And those who say this Coup was legal, have to ask if shutting down ALL the free Institutions of Honduras are also legal and Constitutional.

Dave

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In this case Jack is right on the money.

That's what I said ... Don't care WHY he wants to keep GITMO open ... enough for me that he wants to. Glad you agree as well. Write Obama and help make it happen.

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And those who say this Coup was legal,...

There is no such thing as a "legal" coup. Coups are either successful ... or unsuccessful. This one was successful.

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Originally posted by Grachus:

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Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

Originally posted by jack_flats:
Doesn't surprise me the Republican Party Leader Rush Limbaugh would now start coming out with openly seditious statements advocating the violent overthrow of our elected government. Perhaps keeping Guantanamo open for his type wouldn't be a bad investment in our national security.

Glad to see you now favor keeping Guantanamo open ... don't care why you come around ... just so you do. Make sure you write Obama with your recommendation.

In this case Jack is right on the money.

The Coup in Honduras consisted of more than removing the Presdent. It consisted of arresting members of Congress, shutting down the opposition press, and censoring television.

No wonder Rush is in favor of it.

And those who say this Coup was legal, have to ask if shutting down ALL the free Institutions of Honduras are also legal and Constitutional.

Dave

quote:

Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

In this case Jack is right on the money.

That's what I said ... Don't care WHY he wants to keep GITMO open ... enough for me that he wants to. Glad you agree as well. Write Obama and help make it happen.

GITMO as a US Navy Base will always be open.

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GITMO as a US Navy Base will always be open.

Right again ... that's two ... unless, of course, Obama decides to vacate entirely.