quote:

Well, you've said the problem is with American Unions.

Didn't say that ... I said the teachers' unions wouldn't like those changes worth a damn ... and they wouldn't. I did NOT say that teachers' unions were the problem.

However ... if you believe teachers' unions would endorse any modification to our education system that siphoned off a significant portion of public school children into blue collar training based on ability ... or closed out higher education based on lack of demonstrated ability instead of based on ability to pay ... try again.

Excellent idea, they should be fined. The one's who refuse to hve health care are the same ones who would complain and cry when they get ill and need it. The United States citizens need a government sponsored health insurance program, over 70% of American's believe this, and the last time I checked, we are a country that operates on majority rule.

quote:

Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

Well, you've said the problem is with American Unions.

Didn't say that ... I said the teachers' unions wouldn't like those changes worth a damn ... and they wouldn't. I did NOT say that teachers' unions were the problem.

However ... if you believe teachers' unions would endorse any modification to our education system that siphoned off a significant portion of public school children into blue collar training based on ability ... or closed out higher education based on lack of demonstrated ability instead of based on ability to pay ... try again.

Here is your post, pardon the bolding, but it's what struck me.

quote:

IMHO, you shouldn't ... and for damn sure you ought to be complaining, since you ARE paying, about the low return you are getting on your tax dollars from public education. You ought to be up in arms against teachers' unions ... and their stranglehold on the Democratic Party.

I really have a complaint ... I paid for my kids' private education ... and am still paying taxes for the public education of other people's kids. Wouldn't mind if public education wasn't so pathetically lousy when measured against that of other countries. Maybe we should adopt their education systems ... as well as their health care systems ... but hey ... the frigging teachers' unions wouldn't like that worth a damn.

Now on the one hand you are saying we should have an education system which produces results, like the European, and on the other you are ignoring that Unions have more control over education in Europe, not less.

quote:

Originally posted by Grachus:

quote:

Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

Well, you've said the problem is with American Unions.

Didn't say that ... I said the teachers' unions wouldn't like those changes worth a damn ... and they wouldn't. I did NOT say that teachers' unions were the problem.

However ... if you believe teachers' unions would endorse any modification to our education system that siphoned off a significant portion of public school children into blue collar training based on ability ... or closed out higher education based on lack of demonstrated ability instead of based on ability to pay ... try again.

Here is your post, pardon the bolding, but it's what struck me.

quote:

IMHO, you shouldn't ... and for damn sure you ought to be complaining, since you ARE paying, about the low return you are getting on your tax dollars from public education. You ought to be up in arms against teachers' unions ... and their stranglehold on the Democratic Party.

I really have a complaint ... I paid for my kids' private education ... and am still paying taxes for the public education of other people's kids. Wouldn't mind if public education wasn't so pathetically lousy when measured against that of other countries. Maybe we should adopt their education systems ... as well as their health care systems ... but hey ... the frigging teachers' unions wouldn't like that worth a damn.

Now on the one hand you are saying we should have an education system which produces results, like the European, and on the other you are ignoring that Unions have more control over education in Europe, not less.

Only if you equate the role and objectives of European unions with those in the US ... unfortunately, there are significant differences. "Union" is a little word with a broad spectrum of nuances ...

I haven't read all the post but the thread title said folks will be fined for "refusing" to buy insurance....... OK, what about the millions of illegals who 1. don't care, 2. do not want to be part of our country and 3. are more then happy for us, the saps, to continue to pay for thier lack of auto and health insurance..... Oh, thats right, part of Obama's take from me and give to them....... alright, I get it now.

quote:

Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

Originally posted by Grachus:

quote:

Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

Well, you've said the problem is with American Unions.

Didn't say that ... I said the teachers' unions wouldn't like those changes worth a damn ... and they wouldn't. I did NOT say that teachers' unions were the problem.

However ... if you believe teachers' unions would endorse any modification to our education system that siphoned off a significant portion of public school children into blue collar training based on ability ... or closed out higher education based on lack of demonstrated ability instead of based on ability to pay ... try again.

Here is your post, pardon the bolding, but it's what struck me.

quote:

IMHO, you shouldn't ... and for damn sure you ought to be complaining, since you ARE paying, about the low return you are getting on your tax dollars from public education. You ought to be up in arms against teachers' unions ... and their stranglehold on the Democratic Party.

I really have a complaint ... I paid for my kids' private education ... and am still paying taxes for the public education of other people's kids. Wouldn't mind if public education wasn't so pathetically lousy when measured against that of other countries. Maybe we should adopt their education systems ... as well as their health care systems ... but hey ... the frigging teachers' unions wouldn't like that worth a damn.

Now on the one hand you are saying we should have an education system which produces results, like the European, and on the other you are ignoring that Unions have more control over education in Europe, not less.

Only if you equate the role and objectives of European unions with those in the US ... unfortunately, there are significant differences. "Union" is a little word with a broad spectrum of nuances ...

Not for nothing, but European Unions have been far more involved in political issues then all but a handful of American Unions.

Nor are teachers Unions mindless followers of their leaders. They SHOULD have more responsibility for education, not less. European Unions start off with the assumption that THEY are going to have imput into educational priorities AND inplementation. Our educational Unions are never allowed meaningful imput. They are limited to working conditions and salery.

If you think that the Europeans are doing something right, the above is an example of what they are doing right.

Dave

quote:

Originally posted by m551sheridan:
I haven't read all the post but the thread title said folks will be fined for "refusing" to buy insurance....... OK, what about the millions of illegals who 1. don't care, 2. do not want to be part of our country and 3. are more then happy for us, the saps, to continue to pay for thier lack of auto and health insurance..... Oh, thats right, part of Obama's take from me and give to them....... alright, I get it now.

I believe that you have hit the nail on the head. Dig deeper into your wallet because your Government needs to be bailed out. Remember that for every dollar of taxes that you send to the Government you are helping two illegal aliens.

[quote]The United States citizens need a government sponsored health insurance program, over 70% of American's believe this, and the last time I checked, we are a country that operates on majority rule.
{quote]


Where has a vote by the majority suggested 70% want healthcare mandate it’s just a bunch of money grabbing politicians dictating terms to the public. When those elected agree to the same insurance mandates and coverage maybe then we can have a beneficial health plan. I do agree everyone should have health insurance but not unde the proposed plan which seems to copy that of Massachusetts. I have private insurance which I pay for as should everyone by contributing to a plan. Many claim ther cant afford it I wonder about the extras they seem to afford monthly???????

quote:

Originally posted by Frank_A_Valdez:
My guess is everyone here is required to keep car insurance, too, right?
Remember how the sky fell back then?

Oh, and that time we all had to get seat belts in our cars.
All that wailing and gnashing of teeth.
(now where did I put my hair shirt?)

We're required to keep car insurance if we choose to own a car.

I am surprised no one has asked this yet - maybe I missed it somewhere?

What about us veterans with VA health care? Technically, I have health insurance - all honorably discharged veterans do. But it is not private insurance.

So will we be fined the $1,000 for not accepting the private insurance we don't need?

quote:

I am surprised no one has asked this yet - maybe I missed it somewhere?

What about us veterans with VA health care? Technically, I have health insurance - all honorably discharged veterans do. But it is not private insurance.

So will we be fined the $1,000 for not accepting the private insurance we don't need?

I'd think that being signed up and on the books would be covered. It may not be "insurance" but it is your means of healthcare.

I don't see how you could get a fine for using a government run program.

This is rehash of Hillary's thing from back when she was 1/2 President.
Healthcare was, and remains, a secondary consideration. The mandate is universal monetary support of health insurance companies. Either pay them directly or the government will fine you and give that money to the companies.
Economic servitude is alive and well in the neo-socialist regime in foggy bottom.

quote:

This is rehash of Hillary's thing from back when she was 1/2 President.

Now that was funny ...

How the mighty have fallen ... now she isn't even 1/3 of a SEC STATE ... hail Biden ...

quote:

Originally posted by Boospar:

quote:

Originally posted by Frank_A_Valdez:
My guess is everyone here is required to keep car insurance, too, right?
Remember how the sky fell back then?

Oh, and that time we all had to get seat belts in our cars.
All that wailing and gnashing of teeth.
(now where did I put my hair shirt?)

We're required to keep car insurance if we choose to own a car.

There are currently five states that do not require motorists to carry insurance.

New Hampshire does not have a primary or secondary seat belt law.

So there are a few choices still available if you feel your rights are being taken from you.

quote:

Originally posted by stec74:

quote:

Originally posted by Boospar:

quote:

Originally posted by Frank_A_Valdez:
My guess is everyone here is required to keep car insurance, too, right?
Remember how the sky fell back then?

Oh, and that time we all had to get seat belts in our cars.
All that wailing and gnashing of teeth.
(now where did I put my hair shirt?)

We're required to keep car insurance if we choose to own a car.

There are currently five states that do not require motorists to carry insurance.

New Hampshire does not have a primary or secondary seat belt law.

So there are a few choices still available if you feel your rights are being taken from you.

Add to that that in other states, the requirement is for insurance that provides for the victims of your driving ... not for yourself.

Every American WILL be insured, whether it be the Gov't plan or a private plan of their choosing. No American, not a single one, will be without health insurance ... PERIOD ...

quote:

Originally posted by I_M_Qwerty:

quote:

Originally posted by stec74:

quote:

Originally posted by Boospar:

quote:

Originally posted by Frank_A_Valdez:
My guess is everyone here is required to keep car insurance, too, right?
Remember how the sky fell back then?

Oh, and that time we all had to get seat belts in our cars.
All that wailing and gnashing of teeth.
(now where did I put my hair shirt?)

We're required to keep car insurance if we choose to own a car.

There are currently five states that do not require motorists to carry insurance.

New Hampshire does not have a primary or secondary seat belt law.

So there are a few choices still available if you feel your rights are being taken from you.

Add to that that in other states, the requirement is for insurance that provides for the victims of your driving ... not for yourself.

There are some that just do 'no fault'. And no fault is to cover your half of the bill.

quote:

Originally posted by jack_flats:
Every American WILL be insured, whether it be the Gov't plan or a private plan of their choosing. No American, not a single one, will be without health insurance ... PERIOD ...

Really?

The CBO and many Congressional Democrats have already stated that not every American will be covered under the President's plan.

quote:

Originally posted by jack_flats:
Every American WILL be insured, whether it be the Gov't plan or a private plan of their choosing. No American, not a single one, will be without health insurance ... PERIOD ...

So much for the freedom of choice the majority of us fought for...

Welcome to the farce, ladies and gentlemen.

quote:

Originally posted by jack_flats:
Every American WILL be insured, whether it be the Gov't plan or a private plan of their choosing. No American, not a single one, will be without health insurance ... PERIOD ...

Well I would hope it would be "of their own choosing." It would really cause major resentment to make people pay for what they don't want (even though the people that do pay will be supporting everyone else that doesn't pay.

Just what is the cut off for those that get insurance, but don't have to pay? Will it be done on a "sliding scale?" Or will it be all the rich (anyone who makes $40,000 or more) will pay for those that "choose" not to work? (Not to be confused with those that simply can't work.)