I don't think so.

I read a recent news article that stated there were veterans outside of a McCain rally with signs that stated, "McCain: Good for Veterans Because He is a Veteran"

Considering his opposition to the 21st Century GI Bill he is the veterans' enemy. He proposed competing GI Bill legislation that would leave four and out guys with $20,000 in student loans and lifers with $5,000 in student loans.

Read this for details: GI's Guide to the New GI Bills

The 21st Century GI Bill has been endorsed by EVERY major veterans organization but McCain still opposes it.

Not to mention he has some of the worst grades from DVA, VVA, and IAVA.

There was no GI bill for me, only VEAP...did'nt stop me from joining then- now if I joined I "would" get a GI Bill.

Then: no GI Bill
Now: GI Bill

Something is better then nothing at all..

It's kinda like asking someone if our troops deserve a full course meal(21st Century GI Bill) or a $0.99 frozen dinner(McCain bill)

quote:

McCain: Good for Veterans Because He is a Veteran???

Maybe not the ideal but have you considered the alternative????

Do you really think Obama is your man???? A fuc-ing socialist and who has detailed his plans to dismember the US military and defense systems??

quote:

Originally posted by BobTate:

quote:

McCain: Good for Veterans Because He is a Veteran???

Maybe not the ideal but have you considered the alternative????

Do you really think Obama is your man???? A fuc-ing socialist and who has detailed his plans to dismember the US military and defense systems??

Well full course meal guy will vote for that regardless, and end up with food stamps instead...

quote:

Originally posted by Shaneo:
Well full course meal guy will vote for that regardless, and end up with food stamps instead...

With that, I am not sure what side of the issue you are on, Shane...

I am no more a McCain lover as I am not a Bush lover...

However, despite his faults, Mc Cain has served as one of us....he has suffered as much, if not more, than many of our brothers whose names appear on the black Wall in DC.... he was just "lucky" to have to lived to tell it...

I may disagree with him on several issues but I realized I had better not be a single-issue candidate. I really believe McCain believes what is best for the country... a man of convictions and beliefs... tho I may not agree with all of them...

Can Obama even name a single brother on the Wall?? Does he even know what/where the Wall is???

I have always said I would never vote for a Socialist (Gore..Obama..Clinton).. a Communist (nothing nore than a declared Socialist) or a traitor...Kerry)

quote:

It's kinda like asking someone if our troops deserve a full course meal(21st Century GI Bill) or a $0.99 frozen dinner(McCain bill)

Almost right. The $0.99 frozen dinner from McCain will cost $0.99. The Full course from Obama will cost $5,000, in socialist dressing? Obama "saying" he will do one thing, is not the same as "beliving" he will actually do anything. He's a socialist and his agenda is socialism.

There's no doubt in my mind who is better for veterans and who is better for America. McCain in '08.

Bob,

My remark was directed at the OP, on this issue. In that the candidate that gives him the menu plan for the "deserved" full course meal, will probably get his vote.

I am not affected by the issue of GI Bill, as stated in the past I would serve regardles. I will defer to McCains decision on this issue though, whatever it is.

Regards

quote:

However, despite his faults, Mc Cain has served as one of us....he has suffered as much, if not more, than many of our brothers whose names appear on the black Wall in DC.... he was just "lucky" to have to lived to tell it...

My sentiments exactly.

I am a registered Democrat, but I voted for Sen. McCain in the primaries. I didn't know much about the candidates, but I figured out of all the choices I had; and given Sen. McCain's exemplary military record, he was the right choice.

Then several months later I heard about this new GI Bill bill. And shortly after researching it I found that Sen. McCain opposed it. I could not for the life of me understand why a veteran ,like myself, would oppose something like this that would help fellow veterans.

I quickly realized he didn't necessarily oppose benefits for veterans, but that the only reason he even proposed competing GI Bill legislation was for political reasons

Now, I am not an Obama supporter. I wouldn't vote for either of them in the elections. I am only an advocate for the 21st Century GI Bill.

Consider this:

1)January 2007: Sen. Jim Webb D-VA(Vietnam veteran) and Sen. Chuck Hagel R-NE(Vietnam veteran) introduce the 21st Century GI Bill or the formal bill title: Post 9/11 Veteran's Educational Assistance Act (S.22)(click for link to bill)

2)For 13 months Sen. Webb D-VA(Vietnam veteran) and Sen. Hagel R-VA(Vietnam veteran) explain that the 21st Century GI Bill will not only provide for the cost of a 21st Century college education, but it will also revitalize our economy like the GI Bill did when it was first created in 1944.

It is worth mentioning that the post-WWII GI Bill not only paid for college at any trade school, community college, public university or private university; but it also provided veterans with 12 months of unemployment comensation until they were gainfully employed and a low-interest zero-down homeloan.

Several studies state that for every $1 spent on the post-WWII GI Bill anywhere from $5-7 was returned in the form of increased tax base.

Many economists say the post-WWII GI Bill effecively re-created the middle class after the Great Depression

3)During those thirteen months Sen. Webb and Hagel rally 57 other Senators to sign-on as co-sponsors of the legislation; including two WWII veterans, Sen. Warner R-VA and Sen. Lautenberg D-NJ, many other Senators from both sides of the aisle.

4)At the time of March 2008 Sen. McCain still had not co-sponsored the 21st Century GI Bill when he was asked this question:

McCain at Townhall Meeting March 24, 2008

5)ONE MONTH LATER HE INTRODUCED HIS COMPETING GI BILL

All because he couldn't let the Democrats say their candidates supported the GI Bill while he did not.

Unfortunately he is in the back pocket of the President, and the priorities of the Republican party come before the well-being of our men and women of the Armed Forces.

This bill will allow our veterans to compete with 18 year olds who have not had to sacrifice anywhere from four years to decades of their life for the United States of America

Click here to send a letter or e-mail to your US Representative or Senator: New GI Bill Contact Center

It only takes 5 minutes. The bill is coming for a vote this week in the house and there are many republican Representatives who voted against it as well as a handful of "Blue Dog" Democrats.

Click here to find out if your Representative voted against it:

Traitors

We owe it to the young men and women who are in Iraq fighting to contact our Representatives TODAY!!!

quote:

I could not for the life of me understand why a veteran ,like myself, would oppose something like this that would help fellow veterans.

Are you aware that DEMOCRAPS stuffed $50 billion in "pork" that had exactly ZERO to do with veterans. Like Katrina aid and many other things, totaling more than the G.I. Bill part? I mean, do you realize that? Or, do you just see G.I. bill and automagically think it's a good bill? Or are YOU just playing politics?

I emailed my representatives to vote "against" the bill, as written.

What does any of this have to do with the GI Bill?

• —Extend unemployment benefits for workers whose benefits have run out. The extension would cover up to 13 weeks nationwide and an additional 13 weeks in states with unemployment rates of 6 percent or greater, including Michigan, Alaska and California. The cost is estimated at $11.1 billion over 10 years.
  
  
• —Provide $8.7 billion in foreign aid and international food assistance over 2008-2009, including $450 million for Mexico to combat drug trafficking.
  
  
• —Provide $5.8 billion to strengthen New Orleans levees, plus $3.1 billion to help Louisiana "match" federal contributions,
  
  
• and $1 billion for Mississippi coastal protection.
  
  
• —Provide $1.2 billion for science and health programs, including $200 million for NASA, $200 million for the National Science Foundation to bolster U.S. competitiveness, and $400 million for the National Institutes of Health.
  
  
• —Provide $400 million for rural schools.
  
  
• —Provide $451 million to rebuild roads and bridges damaged by natural disasters.
  
  
• —Provide $490 million in anti-crime grants to states and local governments.

All of this socialist pork is in the bill.

When you look at the cost of the bill, there is nearly as much liberal pork as there is for money for GI Bill.

This is a political stunt by Democrats and nothing else.

YOU say you are not for either McCain or Obama, yet you ONLY attack McCain. Hardly sincere.

Why don't you attack Democrats and Obama for supporting a bill that has over $50 billion in it, that has ZERO to do with the G.I. Bill? Why don't you attack Democrats and Obama for not putting up a "passable" bill?

Oh wait! YOU'RE a Democrat... Nevermind!

Fort couch potato,

What about the men and women fighting in Afghanistan and elsewhere in the GWOT ? I would hope they are included in your paste like post above to contact your Reps...

quote:

This bill will allow our veterans to compete with 18 year olds who have not had to sacrifice anywhere from four years to decades of their life for the United States of America

And I don't understand this red herring one little bit. How are veterans NOT able to compete? There are ONLY 2 obstacles to getting an education. "Smarts" and "money". Both a high school kid, who hasn't served and a veteran are both equal on the "smarts" side of this equation. Neither has an advantage or disadvantage. On the "money" side of the equation, an 18 year old is out of High School and has to pay for college with NO G.I. Bill. You act like the 18 year old, who hasn't served, has some sort of magic pot he can dig into for money. ANY G.I. Bill gives veterans a leg up over those who have not served.

Red Herring.... but I guess it's a good sound bite for liberals.

quote:

sort of magic pot he can dig into for money

Federal loans...sux, but hey its money.

I agree with ips tho, I once thought I was once at a disadvantage until I received vet preference for some jobs...in some areas, the gov recognizes there is a disadvantage, in others it does not...but...I knew at 25 I was going places when I got out...unlike some other people who think military service put them at a disadvantage...

This gov job will pay me pretty good....and still let me serve.

quote:

Originally posted by FORTLIVINGROOM:
It's kinda like asking someone if our troops deserve a full course meal(21st Century GI Bill) or a $0.99 frozen dinner(McCain bill)

Fort, did you read that GI Bill? A full 1/3 of it is Socialist Pork! I would have voted it down, and I'm a DAV!

quote:

Originally posted by ipscone:

quote:

I could not for the life of me understand why a veteran ,like myself, would oppose something like this that would help fellow veterans.

Are you aware that DEMOCRAPS stuffed $50 billion in "pork" that had exactly ZERO to do with veterans. Like Katrina aid and many other things, totaling more than the G.I. Bill part? I mean, do you realize that? Or, do you just see G.I. bill and automagically think it's a good bill? Or are YOU just playing politics?

I emailed my representatives to vote "against" the bill, as written.

What does any of this have to do with the GI Bill?

Mr. Scone,

Perhaps in your haste to discredit the GI Bill as simply Democratic propaganda you considered that the "Post 9/11 Veteran Educational Assistance Act"(21st Century GI Bill) is actually an amendment to the war supplemental that can be voted on seperately from the "pork"???

Or perhaps you "automagically" assumed it was a bad bill because Sen. McCain didn't support it?

The fact is, the 21st Century GI Bill was one of three amendments to the war supplemental that could all be voted on seperately.

THEREFORE, one could vote in support of the 21st Century GI Bill while not voting to support the "pork" you speak of. INSTEAD, Sen. McCain chose to attend a fundraiser in California vs. giving a vote of confidence in support of our veterans.

ADDITIONALLY, Democrats have since dropped the most expensive add-on to the bill for unemployment. So now you really don't have an excuse for your candidate to not support this bill. (As mentioned earlier I support neither candidate. I simply oppose those who oppose the 21st Century GI Bill, including Blue Dog Democrats)

FINALLY, Sen. McCain has opposed it from the beginning. Before it was even attached to the war supplemental.

The facts are obvious. Sen. McCain is not the veterans advocate he would like you to imagine.

I mean, it's pretty simple. EVERY MAJOR VETERANS SERVIE ORGANIZATION HAS ENDORSED THE WEBB BILL OVER THE MCCAIN BILL!!!

To write your congressman/woman in opposition to this bill is incomprehensible. Please take a closer look at the facts.

quote:

Originally posted by Shaneo:
Fort couch potato,

What about the men and women fighting in Afghanistan and elsewhere in the GWOT ? I would hope they are included in your paste like post above to contact your Reps...

Well of course. I can't make every post PC.

This bill would enable every veteran since 9/11 to have a shot at a first class education.

McCain is running for President of the United States, not President of American Veterans.$50 billion for the "do nothing" of society. I don't think so. Don't try to bullsh** us bullst**ers. You'll be in line to vote for O"mama" before the polls open.

How do we spell liberal Democrat? F O R T L I V I N G R O O M

McCain seems to vote on the whole bill on all issues (take a look at his voting record in the congressional record). It doesn't matter to him that he may get a little something for veterans or active duty people if he votes for some pork in a bill. He tends to throw the baby out with the bath water in that regard. Now think of him as president with the ability to veto. How may bills do you think he'd veto following his conscience...especially from a democrat controlled congress? I foresee many government shutdowns and fed employee furloughs if he's elected. And you know what? I don't care. I'm voting for him because he's a man of conscience and has the interest of the country at heart instead of being a political hack.

quote:

Originally posted by Flamethrower53:
McCain seems to vote on the whole bill on all issues (take a look at his voting record in the congressional record)

His voting record should raise the brows of ALL veterans:

— Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America gave McCain a grade of D for his record of voting against veterans.

- Disabled Veterans of America noted McCain’s dismal 20 percent voting record on veterans’ issues.

– In a list of “Key Votes,” Vietnam Veterans of America (VVA) notes McCain “Voted Against Us” 15 times and “Voted For Us” only 8.

I even left the comparison of Obama's grades out. Just to appease those of you who think it's all leftist propaganda.

quote:

Originally posted by Flamethrower53:
I'm voting for him because he's a man of conscience and has the interest of the country at heart instead of being a political hack.

If he had the interests of the public at heart he would support the 21st Century GI Bill just like 75 Senators did a few weeks back; 25 of the 75 were Republicans. I guess those 25 Republicans were political hacks?

quote:

Originally posted by 031153:
McCain is running for President of the United States, not President of American Veterans.$50 billion for the "do nothing" of society. I don't think so. Don't try to bullsh** us bullst**ers. You'll be in line to vote for O"mama" before the polls open.

How do we spell liberal Democrat? F O R T L I V I N G R O O M

Why don't you explain what you mean by $50 billion to the "do nothings"???

How do you spell "bitter Vietnam veteran who wants to see all veterans get **** on by the US Government"?

There's two answers: M-C-C-A-I-N and 0-3-1-1-5-3

There's more to supporting our troops than wearing a flag pin on your suit and attending fundraisers in California. Supporting the 21st Century GI Bill is a step in the right direction.

quote:

Why don't you explain what you mean by $50 billion to the "do nothings"???

Because in addition to the $50 billion aimed at veterans, there is another $50 billion for other things that have ZERO to do with veterans. $50 billion stuffed in the bill by Democrats. Like "aid to Katrina victims". If Democrats (and you) were honest, they'd recognize that Democrats are loading the bill with their pork, in hope of either getting the pork or killing the bill. They don't give a sh** about veterans.

quote:

His voting record should raise the brows of ALL veterans:

This is the most horses*** comment from a liberal I have ever heard.

Totally disingenuous. Obama's record (an most liberals) is abysmal. He's only supporting this bill, because of the pork and because his own socialist voting record is pathetic. And it's only SPIN by liberals that he voted against veterans. When someone votes "against a bill" because of all the other crap (by liberals) aimed at killing the bill, that is a vote "against the liberal version" and not a vote "against" veterans.

You need a double-dose of honesty my friend.

I oppose this bill, as written, and have asked my representatives to vote "against" it, in it's current form. It has too much pork in it, and provides excessive benfits that aren't necessary. What McCain proposed was MORE than fair, and provided plenty of benefits to get a great education at top universities. What is telling is "why" you don't hear liberals saying what was "wrong" with McCain's bill. They don't say, because there wasn't ANYTHING wrong with it. That is the hallmark of a disingenuous commentary. It just wasn't their port laden bill.

No one, not even McCain opposes giving veterans a fair bill. It's just that Democrats are intentioanlly putting a bill forward that will be vetoed. They are doing this for one reason only... to have political fodder agaisnst this adminsitration and McCain. They don't give a rip about veteran benefits. Everyone should demand a "fair" and non-political bill, leaving out all the socialist crap.

Proof it's about politics:

Watch all those pitching this bill. Watch how they pitch it.

• Are they pitching how it's a great bill OR are they pitching how McCain is against it.
  
• Are they talking about "what all" is in the bill or are they avoiding or playing ignorant about the excesses (Katrina aid, highway funding, etc) in the bill.
  
• Does it appear they are more interested in bashing McCain or supporting veterans.
  
• McCain offered a perfectly "fair" bill with a great increase in benefits. Are they discussing what was wrong with the bill (there wan't anything wrong) but do they acknowlege McCain's bill
  
• Do they question why Democrats didn't support McCain's bill. Why didn't we hear from these liberal whiners when Democrats voted "against" that veteran's G.I. Bill?

Everyone "opposing" the bill does so by sticking to what's in the bill. Those supporting it, more often than not, are merely using it to attack McCain. This is easy to spot in their rhetoric. If they were "for" veterans, they'd be pitching the bill and wouldn't even need to mention McCain. But their "real" agenda is to politic "against" McCain, instead of putting forth a "fair" passable bill.