I was hoping to get some information from someone who might have some knowledge on this subject.
Here's a little info on me (I apologize for the length) which I feel will provide a background on the matter:
I am currently in the New York Army National guard at an MP unit. I was previously in the Active Duty Air Force as a Security Forces member. I did 4 years active duty with two deployments: first one in Ali Al Salem AB, Kuwait and the second one in Tallil, Iraq with a forward deployment to Kandahar, Afghanistan. I got out of active duty and transferred into the USAF reserve and after a few months in the reserves I decided to go Army National Guard and got a conditional release from my AF commander to go into the Army. During this process my NG recruiter told me I would NOT have to attend AIT or MP school since my AFSC (MOS) in the USAF supposedly directly translates to 31B Military Police.
I went to MEPS and enlisted and the counselors there told me I do not have to attend basic training but they do not know about AIT or MP school since they "don't award MOS's" at MEPS. I contacted Fort Leonard Wood and spoke to the National Guard POC over there and he told me that he wasn't sure and maybe a waiver could be granted but referred me to my unit's training NCO. My training NCO told me that I have to go to MP school but it is not AIT at Fort leonard wood but a month long (2 weeks LE, 2 weeks combat) reclass MP school up in Camp Smith, NY for prior service soldiers and is pretty much a "watered down" version of traditional MP school.
I accepted this as something I have to do and didn't think twice about it until I met a soldier in my unit who was also prior AF Security Forces. He told me that he did NOT have to attend any MP school or extra training and was awarded the MOS immediately when he joined the guard. I went to the training NCO and told him this and he said that he was pretty sure that I had to go because he already sent soldiers to MP school who were also prior AF Security Forces. He said he would look into it though.
Does anyone know if there are other avenues I can go to in order to figure out if I could be exempt from it? I am not trying to get out of my duties as a soldier and get out of training - if I have to go, obviously I'll have no problem with it. It would just be convenient if I am able to be exempt from it since I am a full time student and there are no class dates during the breaks inbetween semesters and if another soldier with the same exact background didn't have to go then maybe it will be the same for me. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
|"Ride the Lightning"|
Have you ever completed Army BCT? If not, your training from the AF is not only vastly different, it is not up to Army standards.
The same can be said about Army MPs vs AF SPs. Your missions are not the same as ours. Standards are different. Procedures are different. I'm not sure how you expected to NOT have to go through Army MP school.
Conversely, our training is not up to USAF Security Forces standards either, as they require folks going from green to blue to attend their course at Lackland...silly, I know.
No, I have not completed Army BCT. I didn't have to. According to Army Directive 2011-02 (Initial Entry Training for Prior Service Personnel) Prior Service USAF Security Police and Special Operations Forces are EXEMPT from Army BCT. So according to Army leaders all the way up to the Secretary of the Army, my training and experience both stateside and at deployed locations as a Security Forces member was well up to Army standards (at least in regards to Basic Training).
I know a few NCO's who have spent significant amounts of time on both sides (AF Security Forces and Army MP) and they have said that they are both almost identical career fields; the only major difference being that AF Security Forces place more emphasis on flightline, aircraft and restricted area protection (MRSOC's, Munitions and Nuclear storage facilities, PL1 PL2 and PL3 resources).
But yes, I know that there will be some differences being that they are different branches.
Like I said in my original post, my recruiter told me that I did NOT have to attend AIT or MP School since I was prior service Security Forces. I asked him multiple times and he responded with, "NO, you do not have to." He even showed me this AFSC/MOS conversion program on his computer at the recruiting office where he typed in my previous AFSC: 3P0X1 - Security Forces, hit submit and then 31B - Military Police showed up on the screen. But that is probably my fault, I should have known better than to listen to a recruiter. Plus the soldier in my unit who was prior Security Forces that slipped through the cracks and DIDN'T have to go to MP school didn't help much either.
Anyways, I just found out at the last drill that I do in fact have to go to re-class MP school which is only one month long (two weeeks of LE, two weeks of field training). I do not have to attend full blown AIT down at Fort Leonard Wood.This message has been edited. Last edited by: kobrakai,
In my last AF unit before I switched over to the Army, we had a brand new E-5 who was a prior MP in the Army National Guard. When he joined the AF as Security Forces, he just showed up to our unit and immediately got issued his uniform with the SF shield and function badge and beret. He didn't have to go to tech school or any extra training.
I don't know, maybe things have changed...
|"Ride the Lightning"|
I figured you would need something. If nothing else than to learn Army terminology. Also Army MPs are Soldiers who have a combat mission than AF SPs do not. You will need to learn that.
AF Security Forces have a combat mission as well and are trained on and have been conducting tactical security escorts, patrols, convoys, building clearing and PTT missions among many other things and have been working side by side with Army MP's in Iraq and Afghanistan for quite a while now. I myself have participated in some of these activities while overseas before I switched over to the Army. In my current unit, all the soldiers that recently came back from the last deployment to Iraq have stated that there were AF Security Forces working right alongside them doing the same exact tasks.
However, I'm aware that AFSF's combat mission is not on the same breadth and scale as Army MP's which is why I can't really disagree with you. It's not supposed to be the Air Force's mission to conduct convoys and combat patrols through cities in Iraq and Afghanistan but SF members are doing it anyways; and numerous airmen have been killed in the process.
I was Air Force Security Police and then went Army. The Army Regulation clearly states that you must go to Army MP School at Fort Leonardwood. No exceptions. I know that we AF SPs or SF now know that we are better than the rest, but the Army wants to train thier MPs thier way. The Army is easier than the AF.
Now THAT's funny...
I don't remember seeing any zoomies in any of the fun places I went except for the flight line at Ramstein. They watched from their vehicles while we froze or got drenched hauling nukes.
SF and MP do the same damn thing.
Both are trained in infantry tactics, and police tactics/operations.
although SF does also have flight line/resource protection. So they actually have an extra "job" as opposed to the MP.
Ive been SF and its not a joke no matter what you Army guys think just cause its the air force. I see a lot of prior army and marines that have trouble adjusting to AF life thinking their way is the right way. Stay outta my air force if you dont like it.
just an extra side note:
Went to to civian police academy with an "MP" and well he didnt know what the hell he was doing, failed out. hahaha
(I know not all MPs are bad, just hadto get that jab in.
last part of my little rant:
The air force doesnt meet army standards comment posted is absurd. First off the air force recruiter will refer your ass to the army when your asvab score doesnt make the cut.
I love you
I have to weigh in again. I went to USAF SP Academy in 1992. I went to Army Basic in 2010. After being in the Army for two plus years I can still say.... The Army is easier, makes less sense to me but easier than the USAF as an SP was.
Here's a quick update for anyone who is interested.
I graduated from the Basic Military Police Reclassification course a week ago and I can safely say that prior-service AF Security Forces/Security Police should NOT be required to attend this course to receive the 31B MOS. The training was 99.9% identical to Security Forces training. The only difference was the firing and familiarization of the MK19 which we didn't do in Security Forces - and this is something that could be accomplished within the soldier's parent unit.
If anything, Security Forces training dealt with more fields in comparison to Military Police - in addition to Law Enforcement and Combat movements & tactics, SF training encompassed airbase & ground defense, flightline security, restricted areas and munitions and weapon storage area defense - duties that I have yet to see mention of so far since I have transitioned into Army MP.
When I arrived to inprocess for Phase II (I did Phase I & Phase II of MP school seperately) and the MSG in charge of the course found out I was prior active duty AF SF he said, "honestly man, I don't know why they are making you go through this course... you shouldn't have to."
Don't get me wrong - it was excellent training with knowledgable and experienced instructors. Plus I got paid for attending the course so I can't complain about that. I had a good time - especially during the FTX. However, this was all training that I have done before. The Army can save money by not sending prior-SF members to this course.
It doesn't make sense that a prior Army MP can transition to AF Security Forces and immediately get their 3P0 AFSC (MOS in AF lingo) without any extra training while a prior AF Security Forces member must go to MP school in order to become a 31B - especially when SF requires more knowledge and training in comparison.
My claim that Army is easier than AF has been validated. Any doubters can see this old man in person for a beat down in any event of your choosing.
|"Ride the Lightning"|
Lol, not overconfident or anything are you?
If you ever make your way to the Columbus, Ohio area. I'll go old man to old man with you on most anything. Win or lose you must agree to head to the bar later for a beer.
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