I am prior service Navy, going to join the Army very soon and while in the Navy received my Enlisted Submarine Warfare Insignia.
I am wondering if I will be authorized to wear this on my uniform, as this award is not easy to achieve and is a great accomplishment for me.
Also, The Navy has the Expert Pistol Medal
and the Expert Rifle Medal
but the Army does not, will I also be authorized to wear these. I have searched everywhere to find these answers the recruiter says I will be able to, but most recruiters say yes even when they don't even know.

AR 670-1 Page 279

Yes on the Submarine warfare insignia.

No on the marksmanship ribbons.

No on the Markmanship medals....

quote:

d. U.S. service (campaign) medals, and service and training ribbons. U.S. service (campaign) medals, and service and training ribbons authorized for wear on the uniform are listed below, in their order of precedence. Personnel may wear service medals and service and training ribbons awarded by other U.S. Services on the Army uniform, except for the Air Force Longevity Service Award ribbon and Air Force, Navy, and Coast Guard marksmanship medals and ribbons. Personnel will wear service and training medals and ribbons awarded by other U.S. Services after U.S. Army
service and training ribbons, and before foreign awards.

I say no on the SS insignia by virtue of this sentence....

quote:

badges.
(3) Badges from other U.S. Services that indicate career fields are not authorized for wear, such as USAF medical insignia, or badges used to identify the duty, function, or classification of the wearer. Some examples are USAF fire protection, air training command instructor, security police, or the Naval aviation warfare specialist.

Reason I say no is because Enlisted Submarine Warfare insignia (SS) is very close in terms of classification according to the Army as the Naval Aviation Warfare Insignia (AW)...Although I understand that they are awarded for very different things...the Naval Aviation Warfare Specialist Insignia (AW) is an example...I would think that the (SS) insignia would fall under those examples..

..but you do whatever you want to do......but no on those marksmanship medals...those are cut and dry.

The Surface and Submarine Warfare pins aren't specific to a career field though - they're qualification pins that anyone can get much like Airborne or Air Assault.

I base my reasoning on the example in the regulation provided......not whther they are for specific career fields...

AW, SS, SW insignia are all the same in terms of the example provided.....

Not allowed....

quote:

Some examples are USAF fire protection, air training command instructor, security police, or the Naval aviation warfare specialist.

quote:

The Surface and Submarine Warfare pins aren't specific to a career field though

Neither is the AW insignia....an SK can qualify (storekeeper)

OPNAVINST 1414.2A

Would this not be considered a skill badge? If so the 670-1 authorized it's wear as long as no Army skill badges in the same category are authorised. If you were to get an Army badge in the same category then you would not be authorized to wear your submarine badge from what I can tell.



(1) Military combat or special skill badges awarded by other U.S. Services that are similar to U.S. Army combat or special skill badges are worn on the Army uniform in the same manner as U.S. Army combat or special skill badges, only if no Army badges are authorized for wear in the same group. For example, a soldier who had no group 3 badges could wear aviation badges awarded by the U.S. Air Force (USAF) as group 3 badges (as Army Aviation and Aviator badges are worn). However, if the individual was authorized to wear an Army badge in group 3, the soldier would not be authorized to wear the group 3 badge from the USAF.

(2) Skill badges awarded by other U.S. Services that are not similar to Army skill badges are worn as group 4 badges.

quote:

Would this not be considered a skill badge?

I say no since they included the AW badge in the example....

I see it from examples.....

I have seen soldiers wear the AW badge....even after telling them it is unauthorized...I used to get it all the time..

"My command knows, it's cool".

Fugg those shitbagz....those are the soldiers whom I think cut corners for personal gain...

I say allow all badges since there is a Blue to gree program...let em wear whatever.

Whatever, the 670-1 sux as written.

Interesting.

I had wondered about this subject because I have seen a recruiter at my Guard armory wearing this same submarine warfare badge. I wonder if there are any precedents or memorandums regarding the issue. Since it is not specific to a career field it would seem that it would not fall under the rules designated for such whereas as far as I know the aviation warfare specialist badge is career field specific.

OPNAVINST 1414.2A

Anyone in an unit that has aviation assets can do the training for the badge.

see above Navy Reg.

Sometimes I wonder how the military enforces any rules whatsoever. There is so much left to interpretation.

OPNAVINST 1414.1D - Surface Warfare Insignia

Both badges are not career specific....

Both badges have the same eligibility...

Both are for similar types of warfare training....

Both are Warfare "pins"

One is in an example of one that is not authorized on Army Uniforms...

One is an example of another warfare device....

so...both or any warfare device is not allowed on the Army uniform.

quote:

There is so much left to interpretation.

This isn't rocket science.

I know if I was prior Navy I wouldn't wear the badge on my uniform if Army.

but hey...whatevs.

Same here. I'm sure it's a prestigious badge but it looks weird. Plus you will just have people squinting at you all the time and asking you "what the heck is that?"

To Add...

Amry personnel and regulations in general think linear..in terms of badges of other services and their own...the Navy doesn't...those warfare badges (AW, SW, SS) we are talking about badges are for anyone assigned to commands which sponsor those training programs....

Just becuase it says aviation warfare, doesn't mean just people in aviation jobs can receive the pin....

read the Navy regs on the badges...apply their thinking, not Army thinking.

Army thinking (for good or bad)-EIB = infantry are the ONLY ones who can train and receive the badge.

Navy thinking-AW, SW badge = anyone assigned to a surface command or aviation command may train for and receive the badge.

quote:

Originally posted by FormerEmbassyMarine:

quote:

There is so much left to interpretation.

This isn't rocket science.

I know if I was prior Navy I wouldn't wear the badge on my uniform if Army.

but hey...whatevs.

To this response, my Dolphins, as called in the Navy, are not just something you can get in a week or month. It requires alot of time, hard work, and motivation to get these. I'm sure you have some badges of your own being in the marines and if you switched branches you would just give them up seeing as how you worked hard for them?

quote:

Originally posted by JamesG20021:

To this response, my Dolphins, as called in the Navy, are not just something you can get in a week or month. It requires alot of time, hard work, and motivation to get these. I'm sure you have some badges of your own being in the marines and if you switched branches you would just give them up seeing as how you worked hard for them?

Haha, you dont know FEM very well I take it.

quote:

Originally posted by runfuret:

quote:

Originally posted by JamesG20021:

To this response, my Dolphins, as called in the Navy, are not just something you can get in a week or month. It requires alot of time, hard work, and motivation to get these. I'm sure you have some badges of your own being in the marines and if you switched branches you would just give them up seeing as how you worked hard for them?

Haha, you dont know FEM very well I take it.

I'm not saying that Dolphins are the only thing thats hard to acquire, I'm not familiar with FEM, i'm sure that most badges are not easy to acquire. Just when someone does put work into acquiring it and is proud of what they accomplished most don't want to just throw it away.

Also, i'm looking at the AR's right now, and trying to also find out about the Navy Good Conduct medal, because it is obviously not the same as the Army Good conduct medal. How would this case work? Would the navy transfer to an army good conduct, or would i just wear the navy good conduct, and when i receive an army good conduct wear that also.

The things is I have seen people wear that badge in the Guard where there are a lot of prior service from other branches. In the regular Army you might see a chain of command that is more nitpicky about those things.

The thing I would wonder is what would be an example of a badge from another service that IS allowed on an Army uniform...

AR 670-1 page 268

The Navy good conduct medal does not transfer into an Army good condcut medal. You may wear your Navy good conduct medal, however if you are every awarded the Army good conduct medal, the Army medal has precedence and may be worn in addition to the Navy medal.