I know there is another forum for the Presidential Decision 2008 New & Views.

Been there and just get the quips, rips,
personal attacks...

I have become an undecided voter. I will express the reasons in a later comment. The main one is the title of this Post.

Please keep your comments based on facts or sound reasons.

Leave the race card out.
Leave ancestry out.
Leave the birth certificate and place of birth out.

Comparisons of policies, their agendas etc.

You want to get a serious discussion about National Security.

OK, Senator McCain is the candidate with military and national security experience. Senator Obama, has none.

One of the military.com members has a tag line that sums it up very well, it says,
Don’t listen to what they say, watch what they do.
______________________________________________________________________
I’m asking “ALL” military.com members to carry this number with them. Be ready to give it to any vet you meet who may need someone to talk to. You could be a life saver.

Thank you, Bruce
______________________________________________________________________
[/color] [/b]

quote:

Originally posted by OldArmyWOPA:
You want to get a serious discussion about National Security.

OK, Senator McCain is the candidate with military and national security experience. Senator Obama, has none.

One of the military.com members has a tag line that sums it up very well, it says,
Don’t listen to what they say, watch what they do.
______________________________________________________________________
I’m asking “ALL” military.com members to carry this number with them. Be ready to give it to any vet you meet who may need someone to talk to. You could be a life saver.

Thank you, Bruce
______________________________________________________________________
[/color] [/b]

With all due respect, neither candidate is a "threat" to National Security.

I can easily make "arguments" about either one of them having opinions that I disagree with - How does that equate to a threat?

A loaded word if ever there was one.

Dave

quote:

With all due respect, neither candidate is a "threat" to National Security.

I can easily make "arguments" about either one of them having opinions that I disagree with - How does that equate to a threat?

Dave I didn't start the thread I added fuel to the fire. Nieither on is a threat. I believe McCain is better equiped to handle a threat than Obama is. I hope we don't have to find out either way. I'm an American, I salute the flag and support the POTUS - who ever the the people elect.

Give the pup and hug for me.

quote:

Originally posted by OldArmyWOPA:

quote:

With all due respect, neither candidate is a "threat" to National Security.

I can easily make "arguments" about either one of them having opinions that I disagree with - How does that equate to a threat?

Dave I didn't start the thread I added fuel to the fire. Nieither on is a threat. I believe McCain is better equiped to handle a threat than Obama is. I hope we don't have to find out either way. I'm an American, I salute the flag and support the POTUS - who ever the the people elect.

Give the pup and hug for me.

I wasn't trying to sound "belligerant," sorry if it came off that way.

Believe it or not, I regard the biggest "threat" to America as our continued adherance to the WTO, NAFTA, etc - And since both of them have the exact same positions, well...

I'm voting for Nader...

Chato, is doing better, and his biopsy was negative. He rides around all day with me, and for a dog, has it made...

Dave

I decided it was time I found the meaning of the name of that beautiful pup. I know that you already knew it, but most of us outsiders didn't know.

Spanish Dictionary

Chato
chato, -a
adjective
1. snub (nariz); snub-nosed (persona); flat (superficie, objeto)
masculine or feminine noun
2. snub-nosed person (persona)
3. love, dear (informal) (apelativo)
masculine noun
4. = small glass of wine

chato [chah’-to, tah]
article
1. Flat, flattish: flatnosed.
• Embarcación chata -> a flatbottomed vessel
2. ¡Oye chata!
3. mean, wretched. (Caribbean)
4. Dejar chato a uno, to crush somebody (anonadar); to embarrass somebody; (Mex.) To swindle somebody (estafar). (Ante Meridian & Latin American) (m)
noun
5. Wine glass. (m)
• Tomarse unos chatos -> to have a few drinks
, hey, beautiful!

The biggest threat to national security is apathy and neglect.We pay too much attention on being polite to the world than securing our own borders.
Allowing illegal aliens to come and demand rights they have never earned in the first place.Allowing our politicians to interfere in our attempts to fight terrorism in Iraq and Afghanistan.The one of many ways to remove the threat is to put our country first.
your country before your race.
your country before your politics.

You’ve heard the old question,

The wife asked her husband:
Which is the bigger problem ignorance or apathy?

The husband replied:
I don’t know and I don’t care!

quote:

Originally posted by OldArmyWOPA:
I decided it was time I found the meaning of the name of that beautiful pup. I know that you already knew it, but most of us outsiders didn't know.

Spanish Dictionary

Chato
chato, -a
adjective
1. snub (nariz); snub-nosed (persona); flat (superficie, objeto)
masculine or feminine noun
2. snub-nosed person (persona)
3. love, dear (informal) (apelativo)
masculine noun
4. = small glass of wine

chato [chah’-to, tah]
article
1. Flat, flattish: flatnosed.
• Embarcación chata -> a flatbottomed vessel
2. ¡Oye chata!
3. mean, wretched. (Caribbean)
4. Dejar chato a uno, to crush somebody (anonadar); to embarrass somebody; (Mex.) To swindle somebody (estafar). (Ante Meridian & Latin American) (m)
noun
5. Wine glass. (m)
• Tomarse unos chatos -> to have a few drinks
, hey, beautiful!

Whine....

I've been naming all my dogs after Apache Indians. How was I to know that "Chato" was a Mexican nickname, because the human Chato got kicked in the nose?

I still haven't told my Chato, what his name means...

Dave

You really want to tick him off, tell him some guy named Love on the internet told you what his name means.

quote:

Originally posted by Grachus:

quote:

Originally posted by OldArmyWOPA:
I decided it was time I found the meaning of the name of that beautiful pup. I know that you already knew it, but most of us outsiders didn't know.

Spanish Dictionary

Chato
chato, -a
adjective
1. snub (nariz); snub-nosed (persona); flat (superficie, objeto)
masculine or feminine noun
2. snub-nosed person (persona)
3. love, dear (informal) (apelativo)
masculine noun
4. = small glass of wine

chato [chah’-to, tah]
article
1. Flat, flattish: flatnosed.
• Embarcación chata -> a flatbottomed vessel
2. ¡Oye chata!
3. mean, wretched. (Caribbean)
4. Dejar chato a uno, to crush somebody (anonadar); to embarrass somebody; (Mex.) To swindle somebody (estafar). (Ante Meridian & Latin American) (m)
noun
5. Wine glass. (m)
• Tomarse unos chatos -> to have a few drinks
, hey, beautiful!

Whine....

I've been naming all my dogs after Apache Indians. How was I to know that "Chato" was a Mexican nickname, because the human Chato got kicked in the nose?

I still haven't told my Chato, what his name means...

Dave

quote:

Originally posted by lavender2008:
I know there is another forum for the Presidential Decision 2008 New & Views.

Been there and just get the quips, rips,
personal attacks...

I have become an undecided voter. I will express the reasons in a later comment. The main one is the title of this Post.

Please keep your comments based on facts or sound reasons.

Leave the race card out.
Leave ancestry out.
Leave the birth certificate and place of birth out.

Comparisons of policies, their agendas etc.

Daniel Pipes Says It All

With Colin Powell now repeating the lie that Barack Obama has "always been a Christian," despite new information further confirming Obama's Muslim childhood (such as the Indonesian school registration listing him as Muslim), one watches with dismay as the Democratic candidate manages to hide the truth on this issue.

Instead, then, let us review a related subject – Obama's connections and even indebtedness, throughout his career, to extremist Islam. Specifically, he has longstanding, if indirect ties to two institutions, the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), listed by the U.S. government in 2007 as an unindicted co-conspirator in a Hamas-funding trial; and the Nation of Islam (NoI), condemned by the Anti-Defamation League for its "consistent record of racism and anti-Semitism."

First, Obama's ties to Islamists:


The cover of one of Khalid al-Mansour's books, "The Mind and the Mindless - Will the West Rule Forever."

The Khalid al-Mansour connection: According to former Manhattan Borough president Percy Sutton, Al-Mansour "was raising money for" Obama's expenses at Harvard Law School. Al-Mansour, a black American (né Don Warden), became advisor to Saudi prince Al-Walid bin Talal, CAIR's largest individual donor. Al-Mansour holds standard Islamist views: he absolves the Islamist government in Sudan of sponsoring slavery, he denies a Jewish tie to Jerusalem, and he wrote a booklet titled "Americans Beware! The Zionist Plot Against S. Arabia." (Both Obama and al-Mansour deny Sutton's account.)

The Kenny Gamble (also known as Luqman Abdul-Haqq) connection: Gamble, a once-prominent pop music producer, cut the ribbon to the Obama campaign headquarters housed in a south Philadelphia building he owns. Gamble is an Islamist who buys large swaths of real estate in Philadelphia to create a Muslim-only residential area. Also, as the self-styled "amir" of the United Muslim Movement, he has many links to Islamist organizations, including CAIR and the Muslim Alliance in North America. (MANA's "amir" is Siraj Wahhaj, an unindicted co-conspirator in the 1993 World Trade Center bombing.)


Kenny Gamble

The Mazen Asbahi connection: The Obama campaign's first Muslim outreach coordinator resigned after it came to light that he had served on the board of a subsidiary of the Saudi-sponsored North American Islamic Trust, with Jamal Said, another unindicted co-conspirator in the 2007 Hamas funding trial. Asbahi has ties to CAIR's Chicago and Detroit offices, to the Islamic Society of North America, yet another unindicted co-conspirator in the Hamas funding trial, and to other Islamist organizations.

The Minha Husaini connection: The campaign's second Muslim outreach coordinator has an Islamist background, having served as an intern in the Muslim Public Service Network. Immediately upon her appointment by Obama, she met with a group of about thirty Muslims including such notorious figures as CAIR's Nihad Awad; the Muslim American Society's Mahdi Bray, who has publicly supported the Hamas and Hezbollah terrorist groups; and Johari Abdul Malik of the Dar Al-Hijrah Mosque in Falls Church, Va., who has advised American Muslims: "You can blow up bridges, but you cannot kill people who are innocent on their way to work."

Second, Obama's ties to the Nation of Islam:


Louis Farrakhan, who calls Obama "the Messiah."

Obama's long-time donor and ally Antoin "Tony" Rezko partnered for nearly three decades with Jabir Herbert Muhammad, a son of NoI leader Elijah Muhammad, and says he gave Jabir and his family "millions of dollars over the years." Rezko also served as executive director of the Muhammad Ali Foundation, a rogue organization that, without Ali's permission, exploited the name of this CAIR awardee.

Jeremiah Wright, Obama's esteemed pastor for twenty years, came out of a Nation background, recently he accepted protection from an NoI security detail, and has praised Louis Farrakhan, the NoI's leader, as one of the "giants of the African American religious experience." Wright's church celebrated Farrakhan for his having "truly epitomized greatness."

Farrakhan himself endorsed Obama, calling him "the hope of the entire world," "one who can lift America from her fall," and even "the Messiah."

That Obama's biography touches so frequently on such unsavory organizations as CAIR and the Nation of Islam should give pause. How many of politicians have a single tie to either group, much less seven of them? John McCain charitably calls Obama "a person you do not have to be scared [of] as president of the United States," but Obama's multiple links to anti-Americans and subversives mean he would fail the standard security clearance process for Federal employees.

Islamic aggression represents America's strategic enemy; Obama's many insalubrious connections raise grave doubts about his fitness to serve as America's commander-in-chief.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oct. 21, 2008 update: For follow-up on this article, see "More on the links between Obama and extremist Islam."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Related Topics: Muslims in the United

The threat to National Security comes from those who in their desire to protect the US would erode our Constitutional protections. They are the ones that promoted the "Patriot Act" that permitted wire tapping and surveillance of citizens without a court order and the jailing of US citizens who were declared "enemy combatants" without court oversight, etc. They are the ones that OKed torture of "enemy combatant" prisoners and the denial of the Geneva Convention protections.

The greatest threat to National Security comes from those who would remove our freedoms so as to "protect" us. As Abraham Lincoln said, "America will never be destroyed from outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves".

Thank you for your comments.

I realize the Post title wasn't worded the way I was thinking. Maybe it should have been: "Which candidate will maintain national security"? The point of this was more to find out without being judged, who to vote for.

I appreciate the honest comments and information.

The reason for starting this Post is as follows:

Then something from my past, about 25 years ago, having "religious" discussions with former and current "cult" or "fundamentalist" members came into my mind. Their beliefs in their various leaders was blind devotion. Common sense or any type of reasoning was useless.

After reading a blog (not here) about Pastor Wright and Obama having at least a 20 year relationship. I won't go into the details about Pastor Wright as his statements, beliefs, etc. are well known.

Just because Obama cut off his association with Pastor Wright does not end Obamas beliefs. A person does not and can not transform their beliefs overnight. This is fact.

The Nation of Islam is a radical based form of Islam. I will be commenting later on more current discussions and information on Islam in the Post: Islam is not a violent religion.

Thank you again.

I am off to go and vote for John McCain.

quote:

Originally posted by lavender2008:
Thank you for your comments.

I realize the Post title wasn't worded the way I was thinking. Maybe it should have been: "Which candidate will maintain national security"? The point of this was more to find out without being judged, who to vote for.

I appreciate the honest comments and information.

The reason for starting this Post is as follows:

Then something from my past, about 25 years ago, having "religious" discussions with former and current "cult" or "fundamentalist" members came into my mind. Their beliefs in their various leaders was blind devotion. Common sense or any type of reasoning was useless.

After reading a blog (not here) about Pastor Wright and Obama having at least a 20 year relationship. I won't go into the details about Pastor Wright as his statements, beliefs, etc. are well known.

Just because Obama cut off his association with Pastor Wright does not end Obamas beliefs. A person does not and can not transform their beliefs overnight. This is fact.

The Nation of Islam is a radical based form of Islam. I will be commenting later on more current discussions and information on Islam in the Post: Islam is not a violent religion.

Thank you again.

I am off to go and vote for John McCain.

Well I was disenfranchised because ACORN, Obama's little voter fraud empire, refused to get it where I could vote fifty times for my candidate, and gosh darnit, my candidate lost by 44 votes. Obama, you are a one-sided voter fraud character. I needed this candidate in bad too. I guess it would be so counterproductive to actually let Republicans get registered at all, let alone fraudulently.

quote:

Originally posted by SP_Five_O:

Well I was disenfranchised because ACORN, Obama's little voter fraud empire, refused to get it where I could vote fifty times for my candidate, and gosh darnit, my candidate lost by 44 votes. Obama, you are a one-sided voter fraud character. I needed this candidate in bad too. I guess it would be so counterproductive to actually let Republicans get registered at all, let alone fraudulently.

You have proof that you were disenfranchised? You mean Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck voted?

There is absolutely no proof that more than a relative handful of voters were fradulently enrolled, and of those handful, the States kicked em off.

However, I can see that this is going to be the new sour grapes of the right. Lose in a blowout, and blame ACORN...

Sounds right.

Dave

quote:

Originally posted by Grachus:

quote:

Originally posted by SP_Five_O:

Well I was disenfranchised because ACORN, Obama's little voter fraud empire, refused to get it where I could vote fifty times for my candidate, and gosh darnit, my candidate lost by 44 votes. Obama, you are a one-sided voter fraud character. I needed this candidate in bad too. I guess it would be so counterproductive to actually let Republicans get registered at all, let alone fraudulently.

You have proof that you were disenfranchised? You mean Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck voted?

There is absolutely no proof that more than a relative handful of voters were fradulently enrolled, and of those handful, the States kicked em off.

However, I can see that this is going to be the new sour grapes of the right. Lose in a blowout, and blame ACORN...

Sounds right.

Dave

So if ACORN is charged (the leadership, but not Obama since he has been gone a few years), then will you say ACORN has made the voting system lose its trustworthiness of Americans, or is voter registration and voter fraud acceptable to you because Obama won? Had McCain won because of ACORN, all the liberals would be burning the White House, not just walking around it. You know it. And Bill Ayers would lead them in the burning of the White House.


Oops! I really did not mean to say that about our country's next US Attorney General. Well, he can fight terrorism better than anybody our country has ever had since he was and is a terrorist. Good selection by the Obama Team.

quote:

Originally posted by Grachus:

You have proof that you were disenfranchised? You mean Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck voted?

There is absolutely no proof that more than a relative handful of voters were fradulently enrolled, and of those handful, the States kicked em off.

However, I can see that this is going to be the new sour grapes of the right. Lose in a blowout, and blame ACORN...

Sounds right.

Dave

quote:

Originally posted by SP_Five_O:
So if ACORN is charged (the leadership, but not Obama since he has been gone a few years), then will you say ACORN has made the voting system lose its trustworthiness of Americans, or is voter registration and voter fraud acceptable to you because Obama won? Had McCain won because of ACORN, all the liberals would be burning the White House, not just walking around it. You know it. And Bill Ayers would lead them in the burning of the White House.

Did you hear McCain an Palin talk about voter fraud? Did you hear about any arrests for voter fraud?

And with all the Republican poll watchers, I still haven't heard about voter fraud. It's a phony issue from top to bottom, and no offense, you're just repeating talking points. Obama got 7 million votes more than McCain - Live with it.

quote:

Originally posted by SP_Five_O:
Oops! I really did not mean to say that about our country's next US Attorney General. Well, he can fight terrorism better than anybody our country has ever had since he was and is a terrorist. Good selection by the Obama Team.

Once again, but where did you hear this? Bad dream? Nightmares? I recomend eating strawberry ice cream to settle yourself down before going to sleep.

Dave

The biggest threat to national security is Barack Obama. It's pure and simple active measures. You can decipher his way of disparaging America by remaining neutral in Bagram but persistent in indicting Cheney and Bush in Guantanamo and providing material support to Cuba by way of propping it up with dollar remittances. Dollar remittances would be used to finance foreign espionnage!!!A complete sell-out. You don't engage with the terrorist!! THE MOST DAMNING IS THAT WE DON'T "HAVE A HEALING RIFT WITH THE MUSLIM WORLD". NOT WITH KING ABDULLAH!! NOT WITH THE MUSLIMS OF DUBAI! NOT WITH KING ABDULLAH OF JORDAN! NOT WITH THE PRESIDENT OF YEMEN WHO REMAINS AN ANTI-TERRORIST.THEIR 'ARAB TERRORISTS' ARE THE ONES WHO SHOULD APOLOGIZE TO US. WE IN USA AND UNDER OUR CONSTITUTION GUARANTEE FREEDOM OF RELIGION!! OBAMA IS A REAL SELL-OUT! HE IS EMBOLDENING THEIR RESPECTIVE TERRORISTS !!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: kipfer,

noecon are a trhreat to America ,look at what they have done

quote:

Originally posted by lavender2008:
I know there is another forum for the Presidential Decision 2008 New & Views.

Been there and just get the quips, rips,
personal attacks...

I have become an undecided voter. I will express the reasons in a later comment. The main one is the title of this Post.

Please keep your comments based on facts or sound reasons.

Leave the race card out.
Leave ancestry out.
Leave the birth certificate and place of birth out.

Comparisons of policies, their agendas etc.

I believe according Pelosi & homeland security we all are!
Americas WatchTower
If it is right, it will serve as a guide to direct; if wrong, as a beacon to warn

Homeland Security Classifies Returning US Veterans as Potential Terrorist Threat
*americaswatchtower.com/2009/04/14/homeland-security-classifies-returning-us-veterans-as-potential-terrorist-threat*