.

I like the idea. Perhaps make the pin differences you show there between the temp and the permanent (5-yr)... instead of the 10-yr mark. That's a good way to show the differences between me (7-Yr) and the joker who's barely got 2-yrs on board that boat. Whatever suits my needs ... And perhaps name it the "Salty Dog Pin". For people over 10-yrs ... "Master and Commander Pin"

All kidding aside, I think it's a great idea. Submit it now. The worst they'll say is NO.

.

I'm perplexed. The Coast Guard is a sea going service. So, why the hell give someone a ribbon or badge for going to sea?

The permanent Cutterman pin I can understand, but the Sea Service ribbon and the temp pin.......? No, I just don't get it.



Standing by for incoming......

quote:

I'm perplexed. The Coast Guard is a sea going service. So, why the hell give someone a ribbon or badge for going to sea?

From the past, just an opinion;

The Cuttermans Insignia originally recognized 5 years sea duty. The temporary wearing was allowed for crew with 6 months aboard a cutter, but it was removed when they went to shore duty.

The idea of insignia "pins" probably had to do with the shift to the new uniform. Qualification distinguishing marks wouldn't quite look right sewn on the sleeves of a suit.

The sea duty ribbon and that new batch of ribbon only awards started in the early 1980s when, other than decorations that had set criteria for award, there wasn't a whole helluva lot of "stuff" to throw above the left breast pocket.

The sea duty, special operations, restricted duty, for a start, were developed so that something with a touch of color could be worn. Other than the Good Conduct, for enlisted, the shooting ribbons, blended right in to the uniform. New officer types didn't have a whole lot of "stuff" to sport.

By the 1990s, the Cutterman seems to have evolved into a "qualification insignia" with a sea time requirement attached. The sea duty ribbon was supposed to be the indicator of years sea time.

The sea duty ribbon and subsequent stars are military service ribbons to recognize sea time. The cutterman has evolved into a quals device, and probably should be earned, much like aircrew, and then permanently worn once the "quals" process is completed. Kind of like the USN enl. surface warfare.

The 25+ years ago timeline for seatime recognition was;

6 months aboard a cutter - temp cutterman insignia only while attached

1 year CONTINUOUS (not cumulative) sea time - sea duty ribbon
3 add'l years sea duty (4 yrs total) - 1 small bronze star device

5 years sea duty - permanent cutterman

7 yrs sea duty - 2nd small bronze star

10 yra sea duty - 3rd small bronze star

Guns;
I can't argue your point about the SS Ribbon, but when done as it is suposed to be done, the Temp Pin (which is only worn on dress uniforms, while at that unit, which means pretty much not worn) can be a great tool. It is a way to take that fledgling sailor and give that little tiny something for a pretty amazing accomplishment of getting fully qualified as a 'sailor.' That includes all of the DC PQS and any qualifications commensurate with their rate. If we can just get it on them, they might not want to take it off.

Truth is as it stands today, "Sea-Going" doesn't describe us as well as maybe it used too. Very few people need to be 'cutterman' to be succesful and valuable. One of the better descriptions going around is that we are a "Maritime" service. Very direct connection to sea-going, but more broadly encompassing.

DISCLAIMER: I earned my permanent pin across three different rides before I even got a land unit. Was at my first land unit for 17 months before I went back afloat. So I am not some land-lubber bashing the great things about going to sea!

quote:

The cutterman has evolved into a quals device, and probably should be earned, much like aircrew, and then permanently worn once the "quals" process is completed. Kind of like the USN enl. surface warfare.

Couple of thing there that I have a small issue with. First is equating it to an A/C pin. That pin designates the very MINIMAL qualification, not the higher level of professionalism required currently for the Cutterman Pin. Secondly, permanent wear of those pins require 1/10 of one second experience.
Secondly, I would say the ESW pin should maybe strive to be more like what is currently required of the CM Pin. Not only a 'PQS,' but sustained time in the 'profession.'

(Rest of the post was excellent)

Phil, are you referring to the Cutterman INSIGNIA?

I thought an INSIGNIA was one of those typewriter things the Germans used to encode messages in WWII, when YOU were a BM3!

That is the confusing part of this, time & quals for permanent wear.

There is in the system a military ribbon award to indicate "sea time".

The permanent cutterman also an CG indicator of "sea time", with the addition of quals.

Double recognition for the same thing ?? Either eliminate the sea duty ribbon award, and the cutterman retains the prestige indicator of "sea time", or the cuttermans becomes that "sea duty" quals device, and the sea duty ribbon attains some prestige as a " sea time " recognition tool.

As far as the A/C wings. Am finding bits of information that, up until the very late 1960s, the A/C wings were worn by aviation personnel only when attached to flying duty.

Just my thoughts, one or the other

Totally off the wall example, but it sure would be nice to see a person with SS Ribbions that showed over 5 years sea time and NO Cutterman Insignia.
Ireally see the 'time' associated with the CI as just part of the 'quals' of the professional achievment.

It has evolved then, from its original intent into an insignia, of the same appearance, but with a newer, different significance.

May be just the thing to do. Send the suggestion along to the board. Differing seniority levels may suit the present. Can't hurt.

Different ships, different long splices.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Mastersmate,

On the lighter side of this, on one ship I was on in the middle of a yard period the CO had to have a personal inspection. I went to the PI with string tied to my Cuttermans Pin. When the CO asked WTF I told him they were mooring lines. He didn't know what to say or do and got a good chuckle out of it.

I, like MC, earned my Cuttermans Pin across three rides, two PB's and a fast attack tug. As for quals, had it all on the PB's, and at one time on the FAT, was one of three strikers on the bridge gang, with a 3rd (MC), a PO1 and a Chief. Good gang, too. We all earned it on the Tam.

We should incorporate these....

I have 15 years of sea duty and would rather see permanent sea duty pay for those sailors over 10 years of sea duty weather they are attached to a ship or on land. Sea Pay entitlements should become permanent after 10 years....
Just my 2 cents...
On a side note, dont airdales get flight pay after so many years of flight even if they are on land and not flying???

quote:

On a side note, dont airdales get flight pay after so many years of flight even if they are on land and not flying???

Not Enlisted!

uscggonzo,

looks as though your idea is being enacted.

On one of the other sites was an item announcing the presentation of the first Master Cutterman certificate to someone Down East at their retirement.

Stand by for those with lots of sea time to hit small stores again. Supposedly gold tone seas with pewter compass rose/wheel.

Should be a predominantly enlisted/warrant insignia, no doubt.