Intel colleauges, not that many of you reading this are going to be nearing the point in time to re-up or get out, but for any of you that are, well...the times, they-are a changing. So should your thinking about getting out of the Navy or staying in.

Four years ago, I could have found a $60k+ contracting job for just about anybody with a clearance--no experience required. For anybody with real experience, you were looking at $80k+, and if you were willing to go to Iraq, you could make 2 to 3 times that much. Well, those days are comming to a close.

My agency has just been hit with a MASSIVE budget cut, and I can't beleive that other government agencies out there won't be facing similar, probably proportional budget cuts. Moreover, the GWOT funding which has been driving the intelligence contractor industry is also likely to dry up in the near futre. I can also tell you that when there are massive budget cuts, expect contractor jobs to be eliminated....

What this means to you: The pastures aren't all that green on the other side of the fence, and IMHO I think its going to get a whole lot less green. Therefore, may I humbly suggest to anyone to whom this post applies that they take a serious look at staying active duty in the Navy. Being in the Navy has NEVER been a bad option, and staying in the Navy right now may be the best option for many.

I would just hate for somebody, especially somebody with a family to take care of, to get out of the Navy with unrealistic expectations about the current job trends in the civilian intelligence job market. There are still jobs out there, but expect there to be a LOT fewer and the competition to only get tougher.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: XSquidling,

Wonderful. Hopefully this changes by the time my contract expires 4 years from now. I was worried this would happen with the election of Obama, but this is way quicker than I expected. We need to find another country to invade so we can get some more government jobs! Iran anyone? Syria?

Well, I don't think we've seen anything yet. SOMETHING has to give with the deficit, the economy, and the political indicators being what they are. IMHO however, there was a LOT of very wastefull intel spending duing the Bush years, and we are all now going to be asked to do more with less. Unfortunately, I don't see this trend changing anytime in the near term.

When I came into the Navy, a defense contractor built ships, planes, and equipment or did trouble shooting for our IT systems. I think I saw my first intel contractor in 2002 and I remember being shocked at the idea.

The federal government is still hiring, but you absolutely have to have at least a B.A. or B.S. to get hired on in an intel job, so the days of getting out of the Navy without a degree and finding an intel job are probably comming to a close.

Word of advice, "STAY IN"! Until you can get your education, make rank, get experience, etc. The economy is in shambles right now and the best place for you to be right now is to stay in the military right now, for job security at best. Hey, there is always Iran.!

Here's some thoughts from a deckape that's been there done that.

Yes, you may get more taxable income when you go on the beach. However, in the military you can get BAH and COMRATS which at present are non-tax benefits. Also, you get access to medical care, and you get to use a lot of facilities at reduced/no-cost that civilians have to pay a lot more for.

No job is secure - at least with the military you have a job until the end of your contract unless you screw up. A lot of civilians can't say that.

Think long and hard even in good times about getting out - nothing last forever.

The federal government is still hiring, but you absolutely have to have at least a B.A. or B.S. to get hired on in an intel job, so the days of getting out of the Navy without a degree and finding an intel job are probably comming to a close.[/QUOTE]

To add my two cents here, I am not sure if a B.A. is sufficient enough in our times. Academic achievements, military background, extra-curricula activities and internships are some of the ingredients each starter needs to put into his/her resume. Our times have changed. People try for Graduate Degrees. One shouldn't join the military just for financial stability and a pay check. We need to look into the long picture and see how we build our credentials and how we add value to our resume. Uncle Sam is changing habits for better or worse.The job market is adjusting itself too..

Yes, I quite agree with you that an MA is the new standard...it certainly is where I work. The pre-requisit for all of our internship programs is having at least one MA.

Job's across the board are becoming more scarce.

Does this mean that there are no jobs? Absolutely not. What it does mean is a re-alignment of salaries and specifically bonuses, but most importantly salary and job expectations by job seekers. Here in Manhattan it was the norm for 20-somethings to make at least a 6-figure salary entering the job market. Now with the collapse of the banking industry, everything has changed. But much like the inflated property values across the country, many of these salaries were unnaturally propped up.

As for fed jobs and/or contractor jobs, I can address both. There are still plenty of GS and private sector jobs out there for qualified candidates. You might have to be more flexible about location, salary, etc -- but they are still available.

As for MAs being the "new standard," eh I've heard that a thousand times, and it's just not the case. Unless you're coming from a top tier business school it really doesn't make much of a difference. The most important degree is still an undergraduate degree. Without it, you aren't going to even get in the door. People without MAs don't get passed up for jobs, but people without college do.

I don't know where you work, Nabbs, but certainly in my agency MAs ARE the new standard, and this is a trend I have increasingly seen in the civil service world. I agree with you that on the business side, eh...not so much.

My agency got it with a MASSIVE budget cut, and despite cuts to travel, furniture etc I expect us to start losing some (note: not all) of our contractors as early as next fiscal year. From what I hear from the rest of the intelligence community, other agencies are facing the same thing. Particularly with the upcomming draw-down in Iraq, I expect the number of contractor positions nationwide will decrease.

Yes, I agree positions will still be available. My comments, however, were directed at 1st or second term Navy intel types thinking about getting out, especially those without a BA. Even for those with a degree, market conditions are such that I have increasingly seen retired field grade officers taking GG11-12 jobs, and even seen some senior NCOs taking GG-7 positions.

Case in point...at the last command I worked at, the plan was is to convert the majority of the contractor jobs into GG-0132 billets...but at the GG-7 to 11 range. For folks who have grown into $80k incomes, that's going to be a big shock.

Folks are going to have to be a LOT more flexible about location and salary in the future...and all things considered, staying active duty may be a better option for some.

I think we would both agree that staying in or getting out is a highly personal choice.

However, there is no doubt that private, government, and even non-profit industries are hurting. I mean let's face it, we're in a global recession!

I think we also both agree that whole global economic situation means that people can't be quite as picky.

As for the MA thing; it might be a prominent thing amongst your colleagues in your shop, but it's still not a requirement for many of these posts or career-tracks. However, you don't even stand a chance getting in without an undergrad degree. Does an MA hurt? Of course not! It's one of those things that certainly helps open doors in some cases.

JMHO.