Hey can I bounce a question off you guys in the National Guard SF units?


What do you guys do for full time jobs and what do your employers think about the commitment it takes to be SF?

I totally and completly understand the notion of being committed to the team and being there and what not. I also echo what was said in another post about guys doing it "just to do the training" or however it was stated and not needing those types but rather needing real SF operators.

I'm just curious b/c I would love to have an opportunity to try for one of the 20th groups units that is not far from here.

But I could be 10000% commited to the unit but at the same time as a husband and father I also have to be commited to things like paying my mortgage and putting food on the table. I have to be commited to NOT losing my job in the process.

I'm a firefighter/paramedic with good County pay and benefits and I've spoken to my battalion chief about getting back into the reserves(I'm prior active duty USMC) and yes they have been supportive of the idea but I don't know how supportive they would continue to be if I had to leave for 76 weeks of training to become an SF medic.


Do people strictly go into the NG as SF coming from active duty? That way they are already trained and operational? Or are the people that join are (pardon how I put it) early 20s types with empty resumes and no real jobs that can afford to take a year and a half off.


I dont mean to come off wrong. I'm just wondering how professional people pull it off in the NG.

Thanks ya'll

-Matt

Yes, when I went to the Q course, I was 23, fresh out of college with a nursing degree and an empty resume. That definitely made it much easier to handle than if I tried to go now at age 33 with a wife, kid, and job.

My first job after the Q course was as a trauma nurse. They loved my experience but hated that I was going away for training and JCETs. (this was pre 9/11) I turned down a lot of training at the time because my hospital was so short staffed. Then I deployed. I felt that I was not as well-trained as I could have been. Then I got a job as an ER nurse. They, likewise, loved my experience, and were a little more supportive of me going away. I made it pretty clear to them that I had been in situations where people depended on my training to save lives and I was not going to turn down training again. The key to having support in that environment was simply to do the absolute best job possible all the time. Whenever they would complain about me being in the military I would calmly explain to them that all of the qualities that they loved in me, like punctuality, discipline, being calm under pressure, being able to train new employees effectively......these were all qualities from the military. Then I deployed again.

I am now a Federal LEO. The department's overall policies are very supportive of the military. I have run into individual supervisors that hate my experience. Others love it.

Here is how I handle it. #1 I don't do more training per year than I can cover with leave. I use all my military leave, all my annual leave, and all my sick leave for training with the NG. Conversely, I do not take vacations, and I do not call in sick. The end result is that I get about 9 weeks/year that I can train without having to take leave without pay. So I am only gone 3 weeks more (15 days of military leave) than an agent that uses all of his vacation and sick time every year.

#2 The last time someone complained about how me going away for training messes up the staffing, I very calmly and professionally explained that we are at war. War has required me to be gone 2 of the 6 years that I've been married. War caused me to miss 11 months of my baby son's life. War has caused us to lose friends in combat. So I very much appreciate his wartime sacrifice of juggling some numbers on an excel spreadsheet. We all do our part.

I didn't have too many problems after that.

#3 I've grown used to the fact that I will be passed over for some positions because I go away a lot. I've grown secure with the fact that I may be promoted behind my peers because I am deploying again. My time with the team makes it all worthwhile.

There are people who think that you cannot adequately balance the two. Our unit is full of Local, State, and Federal LEOs, Firefighters, PAs, Paramedics, Intel Analysts, Engineers, Private Military Contractors and a slew of other jobs that bring a lot of very valuable skillsets to the table.

Here is the deal: You will never be able to attend as much training as the Guard bums who do nothing but go to schools. So when you do go to training, you have to bust your a*s and get the most out of it. In your professional job, you will be gone more than any other employee, so when you are there, you have to bust your a*s and be the best employee possible.

In your situation, I would completely and totally sell my fire department on all the high speed training that I would get and bring back to the station. Then, in the Guard, I would take extra opportunities to teach the team how to use breaching tools, collapsed structure work, high angle rescue, whatever. Make both the Guard and your job appreciate the experience gleaned from the other.

Here is another prespective for you. First off my team sgt and our medic were both Paramedics. Tm Sgt in a sleepy old persons town where he got about 4 calls a day, which gave him endless amounts of time to think of things for us to do and torture us. Tm medic was paramedic in a large city, 10 years in 5th group, and prior to 9-11 probably saw more trama than most 18D's on active duty. Neither had any issues with employeers etc. at least that they mentioned; while I am sure that there may have been issues, working in a govt. job they are extra careful when it comes to NG/Reserve guys with all the laws there to protect us etc.

As far as me prior to 9-11 I worked in technology for a fortune 1000 company and the job I had never was very supportive but being a major corp. they had little they could do other than give me dirty looks, but I also was a solid employee when I was there. Interestingly enough when I applied for one job (I got the job), the VP actually said " you should get this military crap off your resume", I think he was just jealous. Anyways when 9-11 happened I was gone by Dec and my company was very supportive, paid me the pay loss difference for the entire year I was gone.

I decided to start my own business when I got back from my first tour. Now this was brutal as I was the only employee and every call up basically put my business on hold, except for what my father in law and wife could hold together (God Bless them). However after my last tour I had to decide if I wanted to own a business or stay in SF NG as being called up and owning my own business did not mix. I left SF NG and moved to a training unit in the Reserve. Miss the crap out of SF, but we all have decisions to make and I will make SGM this year, so I guess it all worked out.

Bottom line is from my experience (22 years active and NG) most guys in SF NG had jobs like cop, fire fighter. FED LE, etc that were very condusive to SF NG and very supportive. I even had a tm cmdr that was a federal prosecutor and he had 21 days a year of military leave on top off all other vacation and sick days. I think part of what you might put up with also depends on the size of your dept. If you are in a small dept. it hurts alot more when you are gone, if you are part of a large dept. losing one guy is not as bad. I will also say that I started to notice the farther away from 9-11 the less supportive employeers were, the whole newness and patriotic thing wore off after a while.

As far as pay while you go through the training the pay loss may hurt; however once you get tabbed you will be an E-6 in no time and when you factor in jump pay, BAH, SDAP, Family separation pay, hazard duty pay, tax free etc. you actually make pretty good money when on active duty. I don't knwo what your dept pays but I would be surprised if it is more than what an E-6 over 8 years or so makes on active duty.

Hope this helps and good luck, if it is what you want go for it. I would advise you to keep the Marine thing quite as they might think you are not smart enough to handle SF HA/HA.

By the way which company in Fl I was in A/3/20 for 10 years, still have alot of buddies there I stay in touch with. Even planning a reunion for early next year, actually it is a Guniess party in Sav as all but one guy on my old team was in Rgr Regt, mostly at the same time and a couple of us were in 1/75 at the same time and knew each other.

What they said.

Thor

quote:

I'm a firefighter/paramedic with good County pay and benefits and I've spoken to my battalion chief about getting back into the reserves(I'm prior active duty USMC) and yes they have been supportive of the idea but I don't know how supportive they would continue to be if I had to leave for 76 weeks of training to become an SF medic.

Government jobs are the best for this, less chance of getting screwed over because of your military assignments. Civilian jobs may give lip service to supporting the GWOT (and the law) but there are a million ways to do you over without overtly admiting it's because of a deployment.

quote:

Do people strictly go into the NG as SF coming from active duty? That way they are already trained and operational? Or are the people that join are (pardon how I put it) early 20s types with empty resumes and no real jobs that can afford to take a year and a half off.

All kinds of ways. From REP-63 straight off the block to prior service 18 series looking to finish up their 20.

You are in a good position ref: job and taking time off to go to SFAS, SFQC, etc... The questions you need to answer are how will your family take you being gone for 12-18 months for training much less the (very high) chance you will deploy to the box for 12 months every couple of years? I'd also do the math and see what your income will be like in training as well as deployed. It won't matter so much now or not if your wife is supportive when six months into a 12 month deployment she finds can't pay the mortgage.

Years ago I had an acquaintance who was Guard SF and worked for UPS. From his comments I got the impression his employer was relatively supportive. He wouldnt advance as quickly as his peers but at least he didnt have to worry about UPS trying to pull a fast one to fire him.

While my experience with SF (reserve or otherwise) is limited, I have some fairly significant experience with the reserve components in general. This is from ROTC friends who went in the reserves, a failed attempt to affiliate with the reserves after ETSing and living close to a large joint reserve base. From what I have seen most successful reservists either work for a government agency, or defense contractor. You'll occasionally see them employed by hospitals, moderate to large sized family businesses or very large companies.

What happens to the rest? Dont know in general. However, a number of my USAR and NG friends working in private enterprise will early on hit a stumbling block. Either someone gives the a "Come to Jesus" talk or they see the writing on the wall that they have a choice between the reserves or civilian employment. It sucks, but there it is.