The following is an article from the current Economist Magazine issue. I would consider the Economist a moderate left magazine, not far left and usually insightful.

BTW-Why are the vast majority of people on here very conservative? Well, I guess it's because statistics show that most people in the military are usually more politically and socially conservative and usually come from more conservative, and religiously devote, families. I guess it all goes back to the theological trend in all three western monotheistic religions that often focus on retribution and punishment for real or perceived amoral behavior by other individuals or groups. I think this primarily comes from the concepts of original sin (people born in sin), and of course Hell as the ultimate punishment.
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Anyway, the follow is said article. The link to it is at the bottom of the page.


LEXINGTON

STILL CRAZY AFTER ALL THESE YEARS

Aug 20th 2009
From The Economist print edition


THE PERILS OF LOSING ONE'S GRIP ON REALITY


NOT long after the assassination of John Kennedy in 1963, the Senate contemplated a bill to tighten federal control over the sale of guns through the post. Three gun-lovers drove 2,500 miles from Arizona to Washington, DC, to protest. One argued that the bill was part of “a further attempt by a subversive power to make us part of one world socialistic government” and that it could “create chaos” and help “our enemies” to seize power. Not much has changed since Richard Hofstadter described this incident in a hugely influential book, “The Paranoid Style in American Politics”. Gun-lovers still argue that the slightest curb on their right to bear arms will make America vulnerable to tyranny. And in other areas, too, the paranoid style is alive and frothing.

Some of Barack Obama’s detractors content themselves with arguing that he is a bad president. Others go further. “Birthers” insist that he was not born in the United States and is therefore constitutionally barred from being president. Yet Mr Obama’s birth certificate says he was born in Hawaii, and there is not a shred of evidence to the contrary. There is even an announcement of his birth in the archive of the Honolulu Advertiser, a local newspaper. Yet the internet crackles with theories as to how all this was faked so that, 48 years later, Mr Obama could impose a socialist state on America. And a YouGov poll for The Economist found that 26% of Republicans think Mr Obama is probably foreign-born.

Other conspiracy theories about Mr Obama are even loopier. For example, some Americans think he is the Antichrist. The evidence for this, apparently, is that in the Bible Jesus is quoted as predicting that Satan will come down like lightning from heaven, and the words for “lightning” and “heaven” in Hebrew sound a bit like “Barack Obama”. Plus, his presidential limo is nicknamed “The Beast”. For those who think this is too far-fetched, there is the theory that Mr Obama is a closet Nazi. He thinks abortion should be legal. Historically, some abortion advocates have also been eugenicists. Therefore he must be one of them. Also, he wants to discourage smoking. So did Hitler!

Hofstadter, writing at the time of Barry Goldwater’s insurgency, argued that political paranoia—a mix of anger, heated exaggeration, suspiciousness and conspiratorial fantasy—was most evident on the extreme right. And there are plenty of examples of right-wingers peddling nutty tales. Isolationists in the 1940s accused Franklin Roosevelt of deliberately letting the Japanese bomb Pearl Harbour to provide an excuse for war. Talk-radio crackpots in the 1990s accused the Clintons of having Vince Foster, a depressive friend of theirs who killed himself, murdered.

But the left is hardly immune to such fantasies. Some people, including Mr Obama’s own former pastor, Jeremiah Wright, believe that AIDS was cooked up by the government to kill blacks. A staggering 18% of Americans think that the government of George Bush probably knew in advance about the attacks of September 11th 2001 but allowed them to proceed anyway. Some even contend that Mr Bush orchestrated the attacks himself, to create an excuse for invading Iraq. To believe this, you have to believe that the Bushies were both wicked enough to murder thousands of Americans and brilliant enough to execute such a mind-bogglingly sophisticated plot without a single leak—in a culture where Richard Nixon could not even hush up a burglary.

Belief in conspiracy theories can be comforting. If everything that goes wrong is the fault of a secret cabal, that relieves you of the tedious necessity of trying to understand how a complex world really works. And you can feel smug that you are smart enough to “see through” the official version of events. But widespread paranoia has drawbacks. For a start, it makes calm, rational debate rather tricky. How can you discuss the trade-offs of health-care reform, for example, with someone who thinks the government is plotting to kill grandma? It does not help, either, that politicians on both sides are willing to fan the flames. Sarah Palin calls Mr Obama’s health-care proposals “evil”. Harry Reid, the Senate majority leader, calls the protesters who loudly oppose them “evil-mongers”. Nancy Pelosi, the speaker of the House of Representatives, calls them “un-American”.
It’s serious

In his book “Voodoo Histories: The Role of the Conspiracy Theory in Shaping Modern History”, David Aaronovitch argues that conspiratorial fantasy can have dangerous real-world consequences. Hitler read and believed The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, a bogus account of a global Jewish conspiracy. So did the founders of Hamas. Timothy McVeigh killed 168 people with a bomb in Oklahoma in 1995 because he thought the federal government was hatching various dastardly plots.

Some people watch the ferment at town-hall meetings in America today and worry that another Oklahoma-style atrocity is brewing. A few protesters are waving placards wishing for Mr Obama’s death. Others are ostentatiously wearing firearms outside his rallies. A recent report by the Southern Poverty Law Centre describes an uptick in the number of “Patriot” militia groups since Mr Obama’s election and frets that some could turn violent.

One should not exaggerate such threats. The Secret Service does not let gun-wielding protesters too near the president. And the vast majority of people who visit crazy websites will never hurt anyone. But there is no cause for complacency, either. Politicians should tone down the rhetoric. Protesters should read some history before making Hitler comparisons. Talk-show hosts should stop pretending that paranoid nitwits are asking reasonable questions. If people are continually told that their government is plotting against them, a few may decide to fight back. And as Lee Harvey Oswald showed, even one man with a violent sense of grievance can do a lot of harm.


++http://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?story_id=14258768

No hot links.. unless otherwise approved. See 'Discussion Forum Basics' top of the form page.



MENTAT ADVISOR
"The spice must flow..."

This message has been edited. Last edited by: pipedreamsandbabies,

Well written like most "Economist" article with a cynical tongue in cheek...being a superior magazine? Or one magazine who loves to the top dog's favorite chew toy?

The latter definetely. They are entertaining as a magazine but never have grasped the realities of "real conspiracy" why? because they are the entertainment magazine for those who are the status quo of the earth...who are the conspirators...

Nes pa?

quote:

Originally posted by dragonflyer04:
Well written like most "Economist" article with a cynical tongue in cheek...being a superior magazine? Or one magazine who loves to the top dog's favorite chew toy?

The latter definetely. They are entertaining as a magazine but never have grasped the realities of "real conspiracy" why? because they are the entertainment magazine for those who are the status quo of the earth...who are the conspirators...

Nes pa?

Yes, I know what you mean, but I don't really agree with it. Of course conspiracies have occurred throughout history, going back to the Romans, Greeks, indeed, since the beginnings of the very first city states. However I believe that that vast majority of conspiracy minded people fall into this category, I quote the article here...

"Belief in conspiracy theories can be comforting. If everything that goes wrong is the fault of a secret cabal, that relieves you of the tedious necessity of trying to understand how a complex world really works. And you can feel smug that you are smart enough to “see through” the official version of events."

I particularly agree with this part.

"...that relieves you of the tedious necessity of trying to understand how a complex world really works. And you can feel smug that you are smart enough to “see through” the official version of events."


Mentat Advisor
The spice must flow..."

quote:

MENTAT ADVISOR
"The spice must flow..."

Hey, the first Dune reference on Military.com!

quote:

Originally posted by shuman14:

quote:

MENTAT ADVISOR
"The spice must flow..."

Hey, the first Dune reference on Military.com!

'fraid not! We had an entire thread on the subject in MODF more than three years ago!

quote:

Originally posted by shuman14:

quote:

MENTAT ADVISOR
"The spice must flow..."

Hey, the first Dune reference on Military.com!

quote:

Originally posted by KJ1110

'fraid not! We had an entire thread on the subject in MODF more than three years ago!

Good, because I'd like to go back to the originally scheduled topic. That is, the current loony conspiracy theories about our proven to be legitimate President, and your Commander-in-Chief. Why are these bogus theories out there? I'll list a few idea of my own.

1. We've had 230 years of white male American president's and that is what our society is used to seeing as the person in office. (Of course, we WILL eventually have a woman as president)

Obama, although born in Hawaii thus being a full American, he has a mixed and multi-cultural background in his family, with a lot of international traveling when he was young, and a short stay living in Indonesia. See, American, having been always very insular and not having a lot of other countries directly surrounding us, are not used to this like they are in Europe and other continents with a lot of smaller counties. I've traveled to Europe and the people there are quite used to encountering radically different peoples and customs.

2. While doubts surrounding Obama is not an entirely racial thing, there is a racial element to it. We all know that America has had a long history of racial conflict and confusion. Again, we've had 233 years of white male presidents, and that was just a result of our historical past. I DO think that while many far-right culturally conservative American's my not "consciously" think that their disbelief in Obama's legitimacy is racial motivated, "subconsciously". I think Obama's mixed racial and cultural background is a motivation for their doubt in him. And perhaps even some subconscious fear of him too.

3. Lastly, while this might not really be very influential, if at all, the fact that this mixed race man that traveled the world in his youth was born in Hawaii, the last State to join the Union (1959, wow, that's only 4 years before Obama was born). Again, this may be a "subconscious" factor in the minds of some far-right individuals that combine this subconsciously with his race as the first black president.

4. Finally, you have the religious evangelical right that in the extreme, thinks that Obama is the Anti-Christ based on some dubious connections they make with Christian biblical prophecy that "they" think is the absolute truth.

Just some thoughts.


Mentat Advisor
"The spice must flow..."

I think he's a Face Dancer planted by the Bene Tleilaxu to take over the government from within.

Good reading, Agree with all of it. Thats so I don't get sent to a labor camp for agreeing with it

quote:

Originally posted by shuman14:
I think he's a Face Dancer planted by the Bene Tleilaxu to take over the government from within.

LOL. Actually, in the 2 book grand finale that Brian Herbert and Kevin Anderson wrote (based on extensive notes and outlines discovered after Frank had died), the Face Dancers become highly advanced and infiltrate every faction of the universe, even the Bene Gesserit with their Truthsayers that can detect any lie or imitation. Hence, the Face Dancers hatch a plot to take over the universe and eradicate mankind. However, Erasmus, the 15,000 year old sentient robot, and defacto leader of the Machines, put a kill switch in all of the cloned and bio-engineered face-dancers, leading to a final and abrupt end to their plot to take over the known universe.

However, I have no such kill switch implanted in my brain..I don't think so anyway..unless George Bush Sr. had a program to implant me (and all liberals) with one last time I was in the hospital???...LOL

__________________________


NOW, has anyone read my last entry in regards to the conspiracy minded nature of many Americans concerning our current President? It's just two replies above this one.


Mentat Advisor
"The spice must flow..."

Shuman...? the complexity of the issue is in the minds of those who love complex creations? Pandora's Box as you recall is an analogy of looking too deeply into a situation and suddenly your overcome by it all and in worse shape than when you began... this is ancient wisdom with today's old saying "let sleeping dogs lie"... both offer the peace of the moment versus taking on the big dogs...and the unknown.

Unfortunately that is where the American public is at this very moment...

quote:

Originally posted by dragonflyer04:
Shuman...? the complexity of the issue is in the minds of those who love complex creations? Pandora's Box as you recall is an analogy of looking too deeply into a situation and suddenly your overcome by it all and in worse shape than when you began... this is ancient wisdom with today's old saying "let sleeping dogs lie"... both offer the peace of the moment versus taking on the big dogs...and the unknown.

Unfortunately that is where the American public is at this very moment...

Yep very strange times indeed

quote:

Originally posted by dragonflyer04:
Shuman...? the complexity of the issue is in the minds of those who love complex creations? Pandora's Box as you recall is an analogy of looking too deeply into a situation and suddenly your overcome by it all and in worse shape than when you began... this is ancient wisdom with today's old saying "let sleeping dogs lie"... both offer the peace of the moment versus taking on the big dogs...and the unknown.

Unfortunately that is where the American public is at this very moment...

Dragonflyer04,

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say in that reply as the language baffles me a bit. However I do make a connection in two of your thoughts.

One, you say, "let sleeping dogs lie"... both offer the peace of the moment versus taking on the big dogs...and the unknown."

Finally you state, "Unfortunately that is where the American public is at this very moment..."

I take this to mean that you think that the American people are currently apathetic concerning the important questions of the day. Particularly, the health care debate, and the sudden move to the left in the "elected" government of the United State.

If that is indeed your meaning, I could NOT disagree with you more! I don't buy into this idea that the Democratic and Republican parties are really the same at their core. Indeed, I see ever greater unrest and disunity in our country between conservatives and liberals that is reaching an alarming degree of divisiveness and animosity. Our country truly does seem split down the middle on ideological lines that have hardened to an alarming degree to where basic civility among fellow citizens is eroding more and more every day. Even though I am not a conspiracy theorist in any real sense, I do fear that this "cultural war" will lead to true violence in our country, and erode both our governmental and social commitment to democracy. That is my concern.

No doubt. Your thoughts are deep and well meant but do not doubt the vigor of patriotism. It is our mainstay.

quote:

Originally posted by bwv988:

quote:

Originally posted by dragonflyer04:
Shuman...? the complexity of the issue is in the minds of those who love complex creations? Pandora's Box as you recall is an analogy of looking too deeply into a situation and suddenly your overcome by it all and in worse shape than when you began... this is ancient wisdom with today's old saying "let sleeping dogs lie"... both offer the peace of the moment versus taking on the big dogs...and the unknown.

Unfortunately that is where the American public is at this very moment...

Dragonflyer04,

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say in that reply as the language baffles me a bit. However I do make a connection in two of your thoughts.

One, you say, "let sleeping dogs lie"... both offer the peace of the moment versus taking on the big dogs...and the unknown."

Finally you state, "Unfortunately that is where the American public is at this very moment..."

I take this to mean that you think that the American people are currently apathetic concerning the important questions of the day. Particularly, the health care debate, and the sudden move to the left in the "elected" government of the United State.

If that is indeed your meaning, I could NOT disagree with you more! I don't buy into this idea that the Democratic and Republican parties are really the same at their core. Indeed, I see ever greater unrest and disunity in our country between conservatives and liberals that is reaching an alarming degree of divisiveness and animosity. Our country truly does seem split down the middle on ideological lines that have hardened to an alarming degree to where basic civility among fellow citizens is eroding more and more every day. Even though I am not a conspiracy theorist in any real sense, I do fear that this "cultural war" will lead to true violence in our country, and erode both our governmental and social commitment to democracy. That is my concern.

Its not apathy. People are just plain scared. This isn't the first time the U.S. has been through something like this. Everybody who could tell us of bad times are either dead or to few in number to be heard. There is a small group of people trying to stir up trouble, but that has been always the case, through out history. Well most of the time.

I am not a fan of conspiracy theories. Most are just a group who are looking for something to blame their failures in life on, not on their own selves.

This country is in transition. We have hard issues that must be addressed. We let banks and investment banks almost kill our country. Houses became investments. Business where bought and sold without solid financial basis. Companies like the Tribune, Clear Channel, Tropicana, Chrysler, GM Finance, and Extended Stay hotels to name a few are either in bankruptcy or in financial trouble.

We need to fix the financial underpinnings of this country. If I buy stock, I must hold 50% of the value in my account. If KKR buys a company, they can borrow it all. The former makes sense, the latter does not.

It is a classic definition of facism... check out Wikipedia.

quote:

While doubts surrounding Obama is not an entirely racial thing, there is a racial element to it. We all know that America has had a long history of racial conflict and confusion. Again, we've had 233 years of white male presidents, and that was just a result of our historical past. I DO think that while many far-right culturally conservative American's my not "consciously" think that their disbelief in Obama's legitimacy is racial motivated, "subconsciously". I think Obama's mixed racial and cultural background is a motivation for their doubt in him. And perhaps even some subconscious fear of him too.

I just have to ask this question... If this president was a Republican, and people disagreed with his/her politics, would they be considered 'racists?' or thought to have sub-conscience racial intent in their motives?

I do get offended when people think that just because I do not agree with the agenda or politics that I'm somehow a racist or home grown terrorist. It's not the man, it's what he wants to do that I don't agree with.

He said that he was going to be the most transparent administration in history. About as clear as mud so far. But, hey, he's only been in for 9 months.