Dave,

Yesterday, I've got in touch with a DAV rep who is 3 hrs away from my city. I'll be dropping my va rep here in town. The DAV rep is helping me obtain everything I need. I have documentation on my broken vertebrae and rib(s) while in the service. They were not sent in with the rest of my evaluation years ago. Also, I have hearing loss which is in the va records and also not included in any evaluation. My VA rep in town was at a loss for words. Seems like I was forgotten. The VA has lost my trust in them once again.

Cheers

rf79756

quote:

I have documentation on my broken vertebrae and rib(s) while in the service. They were not sent in with the rest of my evaluation years ago. Also, I have hearing loss which is in the va records and also not included in any evaluation.

I see that frequently. That is one of the reasons we cannot just give up. Sometimes change helps. I wish you the best and hope you keep on posting here and on Disability Compensation topics as well.
There are two important issues to be found here. One is new and material evidence, the other is clear and unmistakenable error. These can take the effective date back to the first day of the month, following VA's receipt of the original application.
About three years ago, I found an issue was unresolved and the case was adjudicated 10% effective 9/22/1950! Payable back to effective date 10-1-1950, his first 10% check was slightly over $18,000.00!
When we share constructively, we all help one another.
Thanks!

I accessed my medical records, WW11, and a lot of it was deleted, especially the part of service I wanted.

quote:

I accessed my medical records, WW11, and a lot of it was deleted

If you are not seeing a veterans organization service officer you need to do so. Many factors are involved in a 60 year old claim. Normally the Navy service medical records are intact. The NPRC or the VA simply xerographically reproduce them and mail you a copy. The copy could be poor quality. I receive SMR's of poor copy frequently.
Ask your VSO to check your claims folder for you. You may be able to get what you are searching for.

Speaking on missing medical records. I have been trying for 13 years to obtain a Purple Heart that I am due. Was a gunner on PBR and on patrol boat was hit. Buddy seriously injured and medi vacced out. Didn't realize until daylight that I had received injuries from schrapnel. Was seen by ARMY medic in a hootch set up along river bank at a fueling depot. He was to transfer medical record to Navy so it would be in my medical records. He failed to do so! And, now I am told that all these records burned in St. Louis fire. If anyone knows anyway I can proceed further, please let me know. Injury occurred in Feb., 1969 somewhere on Mekong Delta in Operation Slingshot. Hope to hear from someone.
Thanks fellow vets and good luck. John

Navy records were not burned in that fire, only Army and Air Force. Your Navy personnel records should reflect the injury when you were discharged. The exit exam clearly asks if you were injured. The doctor also indicates scars etcetera. If you filed a VA compensation claim prior to 1973, your service medical records will be with the VA.
Statements from comrades will help. You need to see your veterans organization service officer for assistance.

If you have miss placed your dd-214, is there a number you can call to get a copy, or is there a website to request one?

The National Personnel Records Center (NPRC) has provided the following websites for veterans to gain access to their DD-214s online: http://vetrecs.archives.gov or http://www.archives.gov/veterans/evetrecs/index.html

Courtesy of Cider

Dave - I received this from my MCL Commandant via e-mail:

Fact Sheet: Facts About the 1973 St. Louis Fire and Lost Records
August 2004 Word | PDF

The National Archives and Records Administration is the official depository for records of military personnel separated from the U. S. Army, Navy, Air Force, Marine Corps and Coast Guard. The records are housed in three locations: the National Archives Building in Washington, D.C., the Washington National Records Center in Suitland, Md., and the National Personnel Records Center (NPRC) in St. Louis, Mo.

The NPRC in St. Louis contains records relating to:
Army officers separated after June 30, 1917, and enlisted Army personnel separated after October 31, 1912.
Air Force officers and enlisted personnel separated after September 1947.
Naval officers separated after 1902, and naval enlisted personnel separated after 1885.
Marine Corps officers separated after 1895, and enlisted personnel separated after 1904.
Coast Guard officers separated after 1928, and enlisted personnel separated after 1914. Civilian employees of predecessor agencies (Revenue Cutter Service, Life-Saving Service and Lighthouse Service) of the Coast Guard from 1864-1919.

The Fire
A fire at the NPRC in St. Louis on July 12, 1973, destroyed about 80 percent of the records for Army personnel discharged between November 1, 1912, and January 1, 1960. About 75 percent of the records for Air Force personnel with surnames from "Hubbard" through "Z" discharged between September 25, 1947, and January 1, 1964, were also destroyed.



What Was Lost
It is hard to determine exactly what was lost in the fire, because t here were no indices to the blocks of records involved. The records were merely filed in alphabetical order for the following groups:

World War I:

Army

Nov. 1, 1912 – Sept. 7, 1939

World War II:

Army

Dec. 8, 1939 – Dec. 31, 1946

Post World War II:

Army

Dec. 1, 1947 - Dec. 31, 1959



Air Force

Dec. 25, 1947 - Dec. 31, 1963

Millions of records, especially medical records, had been withdrawn from all three groups and loaned to the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) before the fire. The fact that one's records are not in NPRC files at a particular time does not mean the records were destroyed in the fire.

Reconstruction of Lost Records
If veterans learn that their records may have been lost in the fire, they may send photocopies of any documents they possess -- especially separation documents -- to the NPRC. The address is National Personnel Records Center, Military Personnel Records, 9700 Page Blvd., St. Louis, MO 63132-5100. The NPRC will add those documents to the computerized index and file them permanently.

Alternate Sources of Military Service Data
When veterans don't have copies of their military records and their NPRC files may have been lost in the St. Louis fire, essential information about their military service may be available from a number of other sources.
The Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) maintains records on veterans whose military records were affected by the fire if the veteran or a beneficiary filed a claim before July 1973.
Service information may also be found in various kinds of "organizational" records such as unit morning reports, payrolls and military orders on file at the NPRC or other National Archives and Records Administration facilities.
There also is a great deal of information available in records of the State Adjutants General, and other state "veterans services" offices.

By using alternate sources, NPRC often can reconstruct a veteran's beginning and ending dates of active service, the character of service, rank, time lost on active duty, and periods of hospitalization. NPRC can issue NA Form 13038, "Certification of Military Service," considered the equivalent of a Form DD-214, "Report of Separation From Active Duty," to use in establishing eligibility for veterans benefits.

Necessary Information for File Reconstruction
The key to reconstructing military data is to give the NPRC enough specific information so the staff can properly search the various sources. The following information is normally required:
Full name used during military service
Place of entry into service
Branch of service
Last unit of assignment
Approximate dates of service
Place of discharge
Service number or Social Security number

Right!

I have been in 14 years now and as I have been advised that I will be eligible for disability, should I get a copy of my MED records made before they mysteriously end up missing?

Yes, that is a good idea.

What do you do if the NPRC will only give you parts of your record files?

The NPRC will readily send from my 201 File, my 214 and enlistmen/re-enlistment contracts and voluntary/involuntary extensions, but will only send the the first page of the actual personnel record form. They refuse to send the page(s) that shows my duty assignments, job titles, dates of promotions, schools and clearances, TDY etc.

From my Medical File, they will only send an entire copy of my entrance phsyical examination, and the front and back of the first page and the back of the last page (but not the front) of my 5 year physical exam. They won't send an entire copy of the last physical examination, or any of the physical evaluations (the little mini-exams you take when reporting to school or a new duty station or when leaving school or a duty station on PCS). Also missing are hospitalization records (hospitalized 2x) and other emergency room visist (2 aircraft accidents, 4 vehicle accidents and 4 other miscellaneous incidents that required emergency treatment including two broken ankles within 6 months).

They won't send anything from my Dental or Award Record files.

I went to visit the vet rep/social security rep for my congressman in March of 2001, and several months later was told that he was unable to obtain the records and that he was asking both of my senators to help.

I got a letter from them in 2002 saying they couldn't obtain the files, but the matter was being investigated. I got another letter in 2005 saying they were still looking into it.

Now, an attorney tells me that when you make a request for records you are using the Privacy Act. He says I should make a request under the Freedom of Information Act because it is broader in scope and has civil penalties for non-compliance, so I can take legal action if the NPRC fails to comply with the FOIA.

Has anyone used FOIA before or does anyone know if that works?

I have been using NPRC since 1977. I do 4 or 5 requests nearly every week, some times even more. They always send me what they have available. Many times the individuals who work at NPRC will call me to clarify what is needed.
Often records are less than what people perceive. Every thing a service member does is NOT recorded in your file. TDY orders are not usually found in records. When TDY orders are given, it is, or was expected the service member would keep the copy.
As far as your personnel file, did you ask for the DA Form 20? That is the form that has record of assignment, promotions, duty stations etcetera. If you have ever filed a VA claim for compensation, your service medical records will be in your VA Claims folder. Your congressional representative should have special response from NPRC.
Did you go through a veterans service officer? Usually the VSO has no problem getting needed records.

This is a sad state of affairs. Losing medical records. I was in a Veteran's Center support group and there were younger vets who could not file a claim because they were without documentation/proof/medical records. Alot of people nowadays are being told there was a fire at a records staging area somewhere in the Midwest. I think this is all planned because there simply is no money left. They are closing VA hospitals. They can't keep M.D.'s and being a disabled vet, there is no way I would ever have a surgery at a VA because I do believe like one vet said, the government wants people on disability compensation, gone. There is a fiscal budget chart and it shows that most of the pie goes to the VA. The Pres. borrowed billions twice from communist China to keep this "war" rolling and to hell with all of our vets. He just borrowed billions from communist Vietnam. Nothing like a punch in the gut. I too, have received threat letters from the VA and I put up a big stink about it calling congressman, Americans with Disabilities Act group, and I will go to the news I told them. I have not received a letter of threat from the VA for a while now. They do want us vets receiving compensation to be thrown off or gone. It makes no sense that they are closing VA hospitals when there is a greater need for care. They can't keep medical doctors. Very few stay because the VA doesn't pay much. The ones that are there are foreign medical graduates and don't give a rip about US vets and our issues. They are like boo, hoo, and they tell us to go buy off the shelf medications in the drug store. All of them are singing that tune. When we are entitled to free medicines and they have it in their pharmacy, then, they have no right to deny us of our medications. They tell me go buy your own advil or tylenol or benadryl, what do you think this is? And I tell them straight "hey, it's in your pharmacy and I am entitled to it". If you don't have your medical records which seems to be a huge amount of veterans, then, you really cannot dispute a claim rejection without medical documentation. I do believe someone is conveniently getting rid of medical records. Just like informally, all the VA primary care specialists (not M.D.s) are all trying to NOT give us the medicines that we need and are entitled to. I'm sure that if I had surgery at a VA, I would never make it out alive. I believe it's a vast conspiracy and it is sickening. I've had hospital administrators and patient advocates say to me "hey, don't rock the boat because people are getting their benefits taken away". They said mostly because they do not go on VA medical visits for their ailments. Well, some of us just can't make it in but they will cut you off in a heartbeat. Supposedly the VA back to work program which I do receieve letters for all the time, is a program which says they will pay you in full for up to one year and if your job works out, then, they cut you off by a percentage, a great percentage or maybe entirely for some. If it doesn't work out, then, supposedly, they allow you to remain on the benefits. They are playing real bad psych-ops crap on the uniformed servicemembers and veterans. It's all about the lack of money. So, you all take care of yourself when you go to the VA. They can shut your pay down so fast. I feel sorry for all the vets but especially the new ones who are coming home to no benefits from the VA and having to fend for themselves after they put their lives on the line for this pitiful excuse of a "war". It bloody stinks...and I smell a rat. The gov. needs to cut the crap and get the hell out of the sandbox already. I can't bear to hear the news for the next two years and the rising death tolls. And what's up with the blackhawks? If they keep coming down, is it fair to say it is an inferior plane? or does the gov. just want more vets gone? And remember the lack of bullet proof vests and chemical warfare gear? It is sickening and pitiful that our leader doesn't give a rip about the people in uniform and wants to tuck it to the vets who are clearly disabled but without documentation are out of luck. I'd write to my congressman and get ahold of the Americans with Disabilities Act and a good Attorney. The first visit is free and don't give any money. There are lawyers that deal specifically with disability rights. All gave some, some gave all. I hate to see our armed forces getting stuck in the back by our own leader. Then there are alot of service people who return home and get in car wrecks and die. Alot. Call it what you want, but somebody did an investigative report on it. Then there is the rumor of radiation from the sandbox. Hillary Clinton is enraged about it's secrecy and demanded an investigation. One great thing is that we got our democratic country back. The republicans no longer rule the Senate or Congress. There will be lots of new investigations. So write your congress people and let them know. Send them a letter every day and nag them to be sure that you are being heard and that they will act in your best interest and help you. It's their job. You did your job, and now it's time for the leaders to do their job. There is no longer a monopoly in the US government which is a Godsend. Peace to all and I hope we can get out of that mess ASAP.
P.S. We know Vietnam Vets had it bad but there is not even a heroes welcome home to all the caskets that are coming home. So, a group of Veterans with Harleys got together and they raise money and raise hell in Washington to insure that all of our war dead receive a military full gun salute burial because our leader was not doing it at all. There are reports that parents and family of the dead, did not even get notified in person that their loved one died and no details either. They got a letter which was overdue and they had alot of heartache and not one representative from the government came to their door to have a sit down chat. That is what our soldiers are coming home to. And it grieves me to no end that alot of our soldiers are being put in jail for life for doing their jobs!!! They are being falsely accused of crimes and they are being jailed. One more thing, if you are jailed for any reason, you disability compensation is cut off immediately and to hell with your family getting by without your financial contribution. I get compensation, but they are giving me alot of stress because I have it. I feel like I have to watch my back all the time and be very careful when going on medical visits. If they want to lock you up in a mental ward, then, your money stops too. So, they make it a living hell if you do receive compensation. Where is the freedom? I'm not feeling it and I'm not hearing it from the VA healthcare workers. And there are thousands of people who hate us who are on disability and call us degrading names and say we are VA Welfare. It's usually the people who are driving the BMWs, Volvos, and Cadillacs. What are they sqwauking about? they have so much money, but it's never enough. Case in point, Bush/Cheney. Again, be careful, it's a bloody jungle out there. It's no comfort that the American dollar is the weakest currency on the planet too.

Ernest: "In that tour I went to see a psychiatrist in Saigon but no one seems to be able to find the records; I really need this to support a claim for PTSD."
Then Ernest states: "later in 1972 I was incarcerated in Na Trang from H Troop,1st or 7th/17th Air Cav in An Son for attempted murder and fragging but released sometime later because the guys in the company found out who did it and made the person (John Adams or something) turn himself in."

If you saw a psychiatrist in Saigon, that should be in your service medical records. The record of accusation should be in your DA form 20 and personnel file. You may request those records by completion of a SF 180 and mailing it to the NPRC. There are links on this forum to NPRC.
If you have ever filed a VA claim for service connected compensation, your service medical records are on file with the VA. You can obtain a copy by requesting them from the VA Regional Office 1800 827 1000.
There was a fire in the NPRC in 1973. However many of the records have been reconstructed. If your records are not available, you will need the help of a veterans organization service officer to avoid pat answers.

Dave,

On Ernest saying that he had a problem about attempted murder and fragging at An Son...I was there...but, this happened in my 68-69 tour. My problem is Agent Orange...and 5 heart attacks, 1 stroke, diabetes, etc...yes, I am on VA compensation...but, my memory is very spotty now...anyway, hope you can get info to Ernest about my being there...but a few years earlier.

Also, my records of wounds...treatments for those wounds while during Tet...are non-existant. The only war time medal I came away from Viet Nam with...was my Air Medal...I have no purple heart (for shrapnel wounds, phosphorus wounds (large circular burn scar...large scar for the shrapnel on my back)...nothing for the 5 helicopter crashes (spine all messed up...neurosurgeon says my ruptured disc is probably from one of the crashes)...etc, because during Tet...records RPGed with the hospital blown up...I never lost time from combat...always patched up in the field from someone nearby...our motto was 'bandaids are for sissys'...many of us just could not stop...there weren't enough of us to stop during my tour of duty...and, An Son was with the Koreans (who were crazy...and, we supported them ...definitely not a cushy duty assignment)
Anyway, I am rambling...oh, and, once my chopper made a fixed wing landing ...our hydro lines were all shot out...we could only fly straight..so we landed like a plane on the runway of Phu bi airforce base...and, I can't find anyone who remembers that one...about 3 of us were wounded...got the lines fixed...flew back out to our unit and kept trucking...never even seen anyone for our wounds...just licked them ourselves...would really like anyone who remembers the chopper doing a plane landing

sorry for the rambling...

Sgt. Rock...68-69 Tet qhinhon, anson, nahtrang, vung chou, danang, ashau valley (shot down took 2 weeks to get back to our lines)...none of this is hardcopied...no purple hearts...just a friggin air medal....laughing....oh, and 50 cents and the air medal...used to get me a cup of coffee...but, prices have gone up

Thanks Hal. I e-mailed Ernest about your post. I also e-mailed you.
Thanks for your support of your fellow veteran! That is what these forums are all about!
Dave Barker