Hey, this is Cpl. Williams, cadre at White Sands. I wanted to take a minute to give some info on the WTC program. The course consists of three phases. Phase one is classroom instruction and a few practical exercises i.e. rifle bayonett training, modern army combatives and the like. Then it's off to phase two which is the range week. Here you will qualify with your M-16 series rifle, fire the M-203 grenade launcher, AT-4 anti-tank rocket, M-249 machine gun, convoy live fire exercise, and throw two live hand grenades. Phase three is FOB (Forward Operating Base) Operations. Kind of like ground base defense. There are three ruck marches, 3K, 5K, and 8K. Not hard, but depending on the weather they can be uncomfortable. PT is done here and we would like you to be able to pass the army pt test before getting here as the amount and type of pt done is not enough to help you if you are way off. There are times that you will feel like you are in basic training, but there is a method to our madness. This is the army and we do things differently than the air force, navy and marine corps way you are used to. Our leadership models and motivational tactics are different, but they are tried and true. This course is not hard. It can be alot of fun if you come here with an open mind, motivated, ready to learn. If you come closed minded and with an attitude, be prepared for a looooong 28 days. While it is true that some trainees slip through the cracks and graduate after shamming the entire time, we expect 100% effort and will accept nothing less. We will recycle you for missing training, failure to display the army core values, un satisfactory performance and things of that nature. The cadre here in New Mexico are here to teach you how to be a soldier and have a vast well of experience to draw from. We love what we do and take pride in watching you walk across the stage on graduation day. As long as you don't give up on yourself we will help you reach that point. The only personal electronics you will be allowed to keep is your cell phone for use during your personal time. Laptops, ipods, PSP's and such, leave em' at home. Tobacco is allowed during personal time and ONLY during personal time. Don't be caught with it during the duty day. You are allowed to wear your badges and tabs if you have them. Combat patches are authorized, unit patches are not. *Note to former Marines :Unless you were in the army assigned to a marine unit, you are not authorized to wear a marine division combat patch.* I hope this has been somewhat helpfull. I look forward to training you and wish you luck.
"Beyond the Standard"
CPL. Williams
B Co. 1/515th RTI (WTC)

Just out of curiosity if someone was to just barely fail the pt test would the recruit be given a second chance at the pt test and just be recycled threw the course?

Barely fail?
you either pass or you dont
there will be 2 test and possibly a make up

I can understand that.. My husband is fixing to go to WTC and we are both so excited about him getting to get to serve in the army... I understand that if you fail you fail... I was told so many different things i guess i just wanted to be assured that if there is any probility of him failing in push ups that he would be given a 2nd chance instead of being sent straight back home, and just wondered if he fails if he would be recycled threw the wtc course again then be tested again

Howdy CPL, just a couple quick question for ya. What's the deal with iPhones down there? Is there any issue with the fact that they have iPods, internet browsers and the like or are they okay because they are phones? There's no way I'm going back to Verizon or Sprint and I'd hate to be without my phone, lol. Also, how do they deal with POVs? I've read on this board that some people bring theirs to Ft. Sill, but that folks are bussed to WSMR. How exactly does that work? Am I best off just picking up the POV after WTC? Thanks for the help!

the way the situation here is , the best thing to do is not EVEN CONSIDER bringing your pov, if your even authorized.
there are 3 training stations to get to and one is STALLION RANGE.
IF YOU GO TO Sante fe, then Stallion, then WSMR, you will have to find your own way back to Sante Fe to get your POV.
Your phone is only allowed on personal time.
not allowed at the fob.
The Cadre have phones if case of family things
and you need to call.

I actually did have a specific question. Barring anything unusual, would personal time be enough and unrestricted enough to meet some family? I was thinking I will have more pressing issues on my mind, but was wondering all the same.

Hmmmmmm,
that would be NO.

Hey CPL Williams...

Good post...

CPL Williams was my (4th platoon) cadre and he is a straight shooting guy, head the advice, the course is easy but you can make into a very looooongggg course also. Don't let the S*** bags frustrate you, they got to me at times and made some days longer then others, be the best soldier you can be. Forget that when you were in before (whatever branch) that you used to be a E5, E6 or whatever. You are what you are right now...

As was said on this board before (oldervet I think) stay in your lane and do what you are told and not try to do the job of those over you because you think you can do it better...

I found it interesting CPL Williams your comments on the Marine Division Combat patch, I have told many a former Marine that same thing.

As prior service Navy I received two Combat action awards for a action during the gulf war, I AM NOT allowed to wear my ships patch though with my ACU's

So the rule makes sense to me...

For those about to go to WTC, let me summarize my advice.


1. Make sure you can pass the PT..it's part of your job requirements now!!


2. Your in the Army now, the Army leadership is different then the NAvy, Air Force & Marines.

3. For the NCO's. It's leadership, not Likership (Stole that from WLC/PLDC)

4. Here is the tough one for many....

Learn to follow orders...it's pretty simple.


Thanks again for your leadership and the others leadership at WSMR throughout the phases.

Really wish you could have been there at the end when SFC Cobb dropped the Cadre was we were graduated..it was a nice ending....

Why is the color of the sky blue????

Hooah!!

quote:

Why is the color of the sky blue????

Hooah!!

Good to hear that God still loves the Infantry.

this says no laptops although all other research and whatnot says they are ok whats the deal? and is the next start date for wtc def july 18? and just verifing also once the soldier begins at white sands it is an additional 28 days.

Hey there SFC Spicer... Good to know you are still alive and not expired... I mean retired...

You arent even as old as me so it makes sense you are still knockin heads around down there. Hows the family? My oldest heads to UCLA this fall... only 3 more to go... then maybe I go active duty??? doubt it.

I really like the CPL's post. Only one comment about the Marine Corp combat patches. Yes, there are presently two that can be worn on the army uniform, but there are several restriction. I know one is the 1st division, the other I believe is the 2nd and was only recently added. Best to ask your command. I had a SPC at AIT in my platoon who was a former marine, even has a star over his jump wings. Awesome soldier. He was allowed to wear his 1st division patch.

I can reiterate the statements made here about staying in your lane. I am a SSG whether you like it or not. I am your platoon sergeant whether you like it or not. Even the Cadre (or DS's at Sill) know and respect my rank. It matters not that I was prior Navy, it matters not that you used to be a SSG in the Army. You are what you are now. Reach down on your chest and rub that little patch there... if mine outranks yours I want and expect your attention when I speak to you. I want and expect a respectful tone in your voice. Not giving this respect only hurts the Army, me, and more importantly you. Others see that you do not respect rank. That is all, carry on...

quote:

Originally posted by Oldervet:

I can reiterate the statements made here about staying in your lane. I am a SSG whether you like it or not. I am your platoon sergeant whether you like it or not. Even the Cadre (or DS's at Sill) know and respect my rank. It matters not that I was prior Navy, it matters not that you used to be a SSG in the Army. You are what you are now. Reach down on your chest and rub that little patch there... if mine outranks yours I want and expect your attention when I speak to you. I want and expect a respectful tone in your voice. Not giving this respect only hurts the Army, me, and more importantly you. Others see that you do not respect rank. That is all, carry on...

Well said, I took that to WTC with me..

You may bring your iphone, however at FOB Stallion, there is very limited cell phone reception. The FOB is out in the middle of nowhere. Also if you have a camera, you may bring it to take pictures for a video to be shown at your graduation.

quote:

Originally posted by lindsaykrug:
this says no laptops although all other research and whatnot says they are ok whats the deal? and is the next start date for wtc def july 18? and just verifing also once the soldier begins at white sands it is an additional 28 days.

Laptops are not allowed and we will make you pack it away if you bring it. I'm not sure of the next start date as that won't be Bravo company. The 28 days is the length of the course once you get to the training company. It does not include any time spent at Ft. Sill.

[QUOTE]
I really like the CPL's post. Only one comment about the Marine Corp combat patches. Yes, there are presently two that can be worn on the army uniform, but there are several restriction. I know one is the 1st division, the other I believe is the 2nd and was only recently added. Best to ask your command. I had a SPC at AIT in my platoon who was a former marine, even has a star over his jump wings. Awesome soldier. He was allowed to wear his 1st division patch.
QUOTE]

Regardless, the regulation on Former Wartime Service Sleeve Insignia (FWSSI) States that a soldier must have been in the army assigned to a marine unit to wear the marine division patch. It is retroactive, so all the former marines out there need to take it off. I know it is a touchy subject, and I personally think it is bogus, but the reg is the reg. I think that a lot of cadre throughout the army just don't want to open that can of worms.

I would have to agree with you in principle on this. Its not fair to have marines wearing a patch and not navy or AF from wartime service. One thing I personally dislike is the way the army uses deployment stripes on the class A and you cant wear any from deployments in non-army service. But, it doesnt matter, just ask I will tell you all about my 6 deployments...

When I got out a few years ago, there weren't any deployment stripes at all. Interesting change. I have to admit I'm far more surprised that there are now Drill Sergeants and Army Service School cadre who are scared to enforce Army regulations. Do they still make Soldiers get haircuts and do PT or has that taken a back seat to special treatment and people's feelings too?

quote:

Originally posted by SGTLockwood:
When I got out a few years ago, there weren't any deployment stripes at all. Interesting change. I have to admit I'm far more surprised that there are now Drill Sergeants and Army Service School cadre who are scared to enforce Army regulations. Do they still make Soldiers get haircuts and do PT or has that taken a back seat to special treatment and people's feelings too?

Your close

quote:

Originally posted by SGTLockwood:
When I got out a few years ago, there weren't any deployment stripes at all. Interesting change. I have to admit I'm far more surprised that there are now Drill Sergeants and Army Service School cadre who are scared to enforce Army regulations. Do they still make Soldiers get haircuts and do PT or has that taken a back seat to special treatment and people's feelings too?

Don't worry, for every one cadre that over looks the regs on these sort of things, there are five that don't. Everybody wants a "combat patch" but the measure of where you've been and what you've done is told on your chest, not your shoulder. As long as I have my Iraq Campaign medal, who cares what's on my shoulder. Speaking of which, I heard (still need to research it) that NAtional Guard is no longer allowed to be authorized the active duty unit patches when they deploy. So no more legs running around with 82nd Airborne patches and never served a day at Ft. Bragg. I think thats good. You should be proud of the unit you went with, not chasing the "cool" patch. Hell, mine ain't that cool (58th Infantry brigade) but It is who I was with over there. At any rate, be assured that there is one cadre who is enforcing the standard regardless of feelings