Pre-departure advice:

Most of what I say may have already been mentioned, but we were the most recent class to graduate, so here goes:

1. Wear a comfortable set of clothes and PT (running, not basketball or trail) shoes. Bring one large bag but don't fill it up. Leave some room for uniform stuff when you go to and leave White Sands. Make sure you have basic toiletries (soap, shampoo, deodorant, toothbrush, toothpaste, floss, prescription medication, sunscreen, and razors), a change of underwear and white socks (or two), and paperwork (your contract, bank routing info, social security card, prior service military ID card, copy of your DD-214, dependents worksheet/copy of birth certificates, most recent LES, and orders from MEPS should be a good start), prescription eyewear, bath towel, about $100 cash, and cell phone.

2. Don't bring any gear that was previously issued to you. You will have an initial issue of everything at Ft. Sill.

3. You can bring a laptop, but you won't have Internet connectivity until White Sands. Same with a camera. You can take pictures at White Sands during training.

4. Make sure you start to PT at least 2 months before your ship date. Your recruiter should have you run a PFT before you leave.

5. Memorize the soldier's creed, Army song, general orders, and NCO creed. While you wait you'll be doing a lot of reading in the "smart" books (Warrior Skills book).

6. Remember your military bearing and how to march.

My post will be divided into two parts: Ft. Sill and White Sands.

Ft. Sill:

We took chartered buses from the airport to Ft. Sill. It was 2.5-3 hours, and we started processing as soon as we arrived. It was mostly paperwork, PT gear and linen issue.

Formation was very early and days were at least 14 hours long.

During our 8-10 day stay we took care of immunizations, finance, ID cards, DEERS, initial uniform issue (including Class A's), AER loans, and grooming. If something didn't get done, it was taken care of at White Sands. The IET soldiers had priority, so sometimes we were bumped off schedule and had to wait on the bleachers.

We stayed in a historical building, where Geronimo died. There was over 250 of us; 2-6 people per room depending on its size. Males stayed on the 2nd and 3rd floors. One common latrine with 6 sinks, 6 toilets, 4 urinals, and one washer and one dryer on each floor. Someone made up a sign up sheet for the washer and dryer which worked out pretty well. Some people got to stay in the overflow barracks, which was closer to everything and newer.

The cadres (who was in charge of getting us processed) were holdovers from previous classes waiting for the next White Sands slot to open. They were E-1 to E-5, but wear E-6 or above patches given to them by the drill sergeants. I think this was one of the more difficult things for some people to deal with.

It was hot, humid, and rainy at times. Our uniform for the first couple of days was the PT uniform.

We had several opportunities after working hours to go the PX via bus (free) or shuttle (not free). It's a pretty good size. We were "issued" a $250 (deducted from our pay) card that was only good for that PX. Some people didn't want to take the chance of losing the money on the card when they left Ft. Sill so they used it to buy the AMEX $100 gift cards that didn't expire. There was a limit on how much you could cash out, but I forgot.

The chow was pretty good, though you have to wait a long time sometimes. We had to eat fast though. The port-a-potties sucked. Avoid them if you can.

There was no group PT until White Sands. We could PT on our own by signing out the reflective vests and running around the barracks. The gym was only available to us once.

We got yelled at quite a bit, by cadres and drill sergeants, but it's all part of the game. Even the civilian staff would get into it sometimes. People who kept their mouths shut and did what they were supposed to do flew under the radar. Most of the time people were yelled at for talking or sleeping while in line for something. Some people got in trouble for bringing cigarettes and cell phones with them.

I'll post about Whites Sands tomorrow.

Dont bring cell phones to WTC or bring them and leave em in the locker? Also I heard you had to take a PT test in Sill is that correct?

Are you saying that at some point you will have internet access?? And I have a dumb question....because these cadre are treating you like boots...will we have to stand fire guard...or did you? lol

Woobes - bring a cell phone if you want (don't forget the charger), it will remain in your locker for most of the day but you will be authorized to use it during Soldiers time.

ocalavader - the WSMR portion of the WTC does have internet access at the barracks, not the best but its there; plus there are 3 computers in the main common area of teh building for student usage (during Soldiers Time of course)

Cool thanx, Hey is there a pt test before WSMR?

Wow have things changed!!! My daughter is at basic right now and she calls us all the time...on her cell...lol. Oh well, what about the fire watch...lol. I dont mind it just curious.

I'm sorry, I completey forgot about yesterday.

For the cell phone and laptop questions, as stated above, yes you will be able to use them at White Sands, during Soldier's time which, on average is between 2100-2200. There is wireless connectivity on the first floor at the CQ. Cell phone signal strength is a bit iffy depending on your provider; I have AT&T and had to walk around the barracks to find a good spot.

The staff from White Sands did visit Ft. Sill to evaluate the process. I believe there are going to be some changes in the future, i.e. some of the classroom instruction (powerpoints on things like Army values, wearing the Class A's) that happened at White Sands may be taught at Ft. Sill to maximize the time spent on actual training at White Sands and to make use of the time sitting on the bleachers at Ft. Sill.

woobes- There was no PT test at Ft. Sill. Your recruiter should give you one before you ship out.

On to White Sands:

We took chartered buses from Ft. Sill to White Sands. It was about 8 hours I believe. We arrived at night and the fun started again. The WTC program is run by the 515th, "C" Co., a NG unit so the cadres are NG and e-4 and above. Once the yelling started again we were rushed off the buses and lined up in front of the barracks. We turned in medical and dental records and had a shakedown for contraband (anything aerosol, supplements except vitamins, anything with alcohol, all food products, etc.) All civilian clothes and unnecessary items were packed into our personal bag and locked up until after graduation. Since we didn't need our Class A's, we stuffed them into the bag to be locked up. Though we were to wear the patrol cap for the next 4 weeks, we kept the beret for graduation.

We were then randomly divided in 4 platoons with 4 squads each. The cadres chose (based on rank, unless someone volunteered or was voluntold) who was going to be the student platoon sergeant and squad leaders. Then we received linen and went to our rooms. E-5 and above shared the room with one other person and shared a latrine with the room next door. E-4 and below sometimes had 4 to a room while still sharing a latrine with the room next door.

A typical schedule for us was that we got up at 0420, did PT, then personal hygiene, breakfast, classes/training until lunch, more classes/training, dinner, more classes/training, PT (if we didn't do it in the morning), FREE time (which is different from Soldier's time because during free time you are not allowed to sleep, smoke/dip, or talk on your cell phone; you can do personal hygiene, laundry, clean your weapon, barracks, or room), then Soldier's time, then lights out at 2200. For the first two weeks we followed this type of schedule.

The barracks were a great improvement over Ft. Sill. The third floor was under construction so no one lived there. There were 4 washers and dryers on each floor (2 of each on each wing). 3rd and 4th platoons lived in some trailers nearby, which I heard were actually nicer. Females lived on the first floor. There are juice and Powerade machines ($1 each), 4 computers, and a TV on the first floor by the CQ desk. There's also a storage closet down there with cleaning supplies and toilet paper (one roll per latrine). No food or drink was allowed in the rooms, and though there was a kitchen on the 2nd floor it was off limits. There was also a TV room on the second floor that had cable. In our rooms we had equpiment laid out (TA-50 vest, canteens, PT mat, duffel bag, Kevlar helmet, relflective PT belt, E-tool/shovel, poncho, rucksack, kneepads, elbow pads, etc.) for later use.

For each week a platoon was assigned duty (KP, work details, watches, etc.). For watches they were very easy; fire watch in the building or outside rover, all one hour long, and with a battle buddy. Fire watches could be done in PT gear.

Chow was good for the most part, and the wait wasn't nearly as long as at Ft. Sill. Sometimes out in the field we ate MRE's, but most of the time for lunch we had sandwiches. Get used to eating a lot of ham or turkey or pastrami, on wheat or white, with chips, a piece of fruit, trail mix or granola bar, cheese and peanut butter crackers, a bottle of water, and a can of Gatorade. The porta-potties were far cleaner than Ft. Sill's.

PT tests were conducted 3 times. The first one was during the 2nd week. The rest are second chances for failures. Some cadres will stick around during Soldier's time to work with those who are having trouble. Acclimation to the higher elevation was not as bad as I thought (after the first run). The test was conducted on a big field that we took a bus to and the 2 mile trail is a dirt road with some very slight incline and decline. It is not the same as the road that leads to the bayonet course and the FOB (you'll run PT on this course sometimes).

Weapon issue came on the 3rd or 4th day. Don't leave you weapon anywhere and always keep it in the low ready position on SAFE and finger off the trigger. Clear it every time you pass it to someone (ex. your battle buddy if you are going to use the latrine, or to a cadre for demo purposes) or when you enter a building. You will sling it is if you are waiting in line for chow or in the DFAC getting chow. The M-16's were old and abused, but I highly recommend cleaning them thoroughly after each use (you'll know why when you have to turn them back in).

The first two weeks consisted of classes with powerpoint presentations. It was tough to stay awake. Classes by individual platoon were much better than battalion classes, unless it was in the theatre. Combat Life Saver, Basic Rifle Maintenance, IED's, Army Values, Army rank and structure, Class A wear, Marksmanship positions, hand signals, radio communications, land navigation, etc. There was some practical applications mixed in the CLS, weapons, and combatives classes. We had races between platoons for the different types of combat drags and carries for the CLS class. Some people had issues with getting stuck with an IV and/or sticking someone else with an IV. Find a partner who isn't afraid of needles and has good veins.

The initial field exercises were bayonet drills, pugil sticks, weapon zeroing, shoothouse, land nav, and combatives. There were obstacle courses for the bayonet and positioning drills (low crawl, high crawl, wall climbing, etc.) Can be tiring with full battle rattle and the heat. Make sure you get a godd zero on your weapon; it will make a difference once you have to qualify.

Water quality: I'll put it this way, once you have the water at Camp Stallion, you'll enjoy the water at White Sands. Most of the time it was warm, but the staff did their best to throw ice in the water buffaloes whenever possible.

We were allowed to go to the PX to pick up essentials, get haircuts, and to prepare for the major field exercises. Buy the PX brand non-scented baby wipes. One pack should be enough for just yourself for both Camp Stallion and the FOB. Also buy the stronger sunscreen (SPF 50 or higher). And buy a washcloth so that you can wipe off your sweat and swat flies with (they are aggressive).

The last two weeks was where things really got interesting. 6 days were spent out at Camp Stallion, run by "B" Co. but our cadres were there. We lived and ate in big tents. On the way there and back you'll be able to see the Trinity site where the first nuclear bomb tests were conducted. Most of the training was on weapons (M-16 qualification, LIVE grenade throwing, M-249, AT-4, and M-203 familiarization; though with the latter two sim rounds were used). You will spend the most time qualifying (23 out of 40). There were 16 lanes; most preferred the higher number lanes because they were slightly above the pop up targets. Targets were 50, 100, 150, 200, 250, and 300 meters. The 300m was either white or light green so it was hard to see. All the other ones were black. Classes on squad movements and tactics were also taught, then applied in the field under a battlefied simulation both at day and night. We simulated movement towards an enemy position, setting up security to cross a danger zone, checking for traps, taking incoming fire and mortar rounds, assaulting the enemy position, and taking casualties (dragging 180lbs. is much harder than it looks). We also did convoy drive-bys. Make sure you bring a lot of baby wipes and a flashlight. Or learn to take a canteen shower. We were lucky; we got to shower every other day in the shower trailer and there was enough water. Sometimes we PT, but it was short. Don't expect to do laundry; I packed all 4 of my ACU's along with enough socks, underwear, and t-shirts to change each day.

After returning from Camp Stallion, we rested for one full day before rucking it at night to the FOB. This was our 5k march. Since it was only 3 days I packed lighter, but no shower facilities were available at the FOB. You will also have watches here, one fire watch in the tent, about 6 at the front gate, 2 in the TOC manning the radios, 2 rovers outside of the FOB, and 2 in each of the 4 towers (one spotter, one on the big machine gun that uses 7.62 rounds). We were attacked repeatedly by cadres (and sometimes other platoons) with simulation artillery and gunfire. You know once you hear that whislting sound. So if you weren't on some kind of guard duty you manned the berms. The duty platoon provided a primary and secondary quick reaction force to seek and destroy the enemy. At the FOB we practiced squad tactics and movements with land nav and radio communications. This is where we started to put everything together. We received op orders at the FOB to gather intel on an enemy bunker, but we ended assaulting an enemy machine gun nest as well, meeting up with friendlies, and arriving at a casualty sight. After that exercise we went to the shoothouse to learn how to clear a building without killing each other in the process. We used paintball guns. Communicate, communicate, communicate.

Once that is all said and done, we cleaned up the FOB and proceeded to start our 8k ruck back. Along the way we were attacked. At the end there is a ceremony and then back to the barracks, where the next 3 days will be spent cleaning and returning gear. On the day before graduation we received our travel orders and plane tickets, and had a good dinner at the bowling alley. On the last day there is a graduation ceremony and rehearsal. You will be asked ahead of time if you are planning to invite family to come. They (and only they) can sign you out on the night before but you have to be back at 0430 before graduation.

Overall White Sands was a very good experience. The cadres were pretty professional and organized, and they treated you with much more respect than the drill sergeants and student cadres did at Ft. Sill. That's not to say that there weren't some people who didn't deserve to get yell at. The WTC program was quite smooth. I am prior service Navy so I didn't know what to expect. I can only imagine what the combat vets thought.

Thanx for the detailed info. I leave on the 9th and your posts got me hyped. I cant wait to train. HOOAH

Thanks again for the info. I'm looking forward to the training and learning alot of things I've either forgot or never was taught. Being ex-Air Force I've got alot to learn...

Good luck to the two of you. Some things may change when you get there; before we left the CO held a gripe session in the theatre. Major complaints were about water quality, more time needed on practical exercises, platoon sized classes (especially land nav in the DFAC), student leadership assignment, and almost everything about Ft. Sill, lol. I don't know if people are still being sent to Sante Fe; the CSM liked the idea of everyone being in one place. He also said that the WTC program is still in its early stages but is slated to expand and take off within the next 2 years.

Roughly from the time you signed your contract, to your ship date was how long?? I am asking because I am trying to get an idea of how long I will have after I sign up!!!!

Bring your cell phones people!! You will have plenty of time to use them after training (at least at Sill, you will). Some people might argue with that one but if you get your "chores" taken care of after training, then personal time is in abundance most days. Several hours sometimes.

Basic trainees are now being allowed to sign their cell phones out from their Drill Sergeants to make phone calls and then turn them back in afterward.

Wow, Great post clear and detailed info we all wanted. Thanks for the post I will save this one and re-read it a few time while I wait till Jan for my class. Thanks!!

ocalavader- In April at MEPS the person I talked to who did my contract and showed me what MOS was available asked me when I wanted to ship to WTC. She said a July slot was open, so I took that. Some people were in their unit for over a year before getting sent out.

On the cell phone thing, at White Sands you are allowed to use the cadre's cell phone for any type of important call you need to make during training hours. I believe what brndnvargas said about Ft. Sill is accurate.

Remember, if something admin related doesn't get taken care of at Ft. Sill, it can be taken care of at White Sands. When it comes to pay though, you'll want to verify with your bank.

SSF1342 is this Fung?? Hi it's Younglood! I just wanted to say that you really let people know about what it's going to be like... great posts man!

Hey, SGT Youngblood, how are you? What are you up to? I figured at least one person from our company checks out this forum.

Some folks were complaining that there wasn't any detailed info on WTC. Got anything to add?

This is an awesome post ssf1342. I've read it over several times now and I just wanted to say something to bring it back to the top of the string list. I finally, after three months of training, have cleared MEPS (over forty physical and all) and will be heading down on Monday to pick a job and swear in. They say I'll be heading out before the 30th of this month (the official Army accession deadline for fiscal year 08) so it looks like I'll be attending the Ft. Sill WTC. At least I hope so cuz that is the only class showing for October on the ATRRS web site. Report date 20081006 Start date 20081010 End date 20081113 Class 501..

The site is:

https://www.atrrs.army.mil/atrrscc/course.aspx

for anyone who hasn't found it yet. Just put in Course # 750-AT and you'll find scheduled class dates for both WSMR and Ft. Sill.

Anyway, thanks again for the in depth information. I'm getting jacked up for training! Looking forward to kicking off my new career! HOOAH !!

I seemed to have missed this post. What a great post. I was reading it and thought "wow, I wish I had went the WSMR route." But, Ft. Sill was not that bad. It does seem like the WSMR route gave you more training though. No, disrespect DS Vargas, but every post about how things were in NM shows me that they did more "stuff" than we did. We were the third class at Sill, so it makes sense that they didnt have their hands around the whole schedule. Often we were supposed to do something, but itgot cancelled. Likely that was due to a conflict with the BCT classes. But the DS's used this time as best they could. I felt the FTX/FOB time for us was a waste of time. It should have been longer, but in that heat, hmmmmm, maybe not. The heat always played a major role in what we did and how we did things.

I am anxious to see how things change at Sill when they are doing everyone.

Just thought with the loss of good info from the loss of key prsnl on this board this excellent post should be kept at the top for all to use

quote:

Originally posted by ocalavader:
Roughly from the time you signed your contract, to your ship date was how long?? I am asking because I am trying to get an idea of how long I will have after I sign up!!!!

I signed my contact 2 Oct and and ship on 5 Nov. I don't think that is typical though.