RE: http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,159231,00.html

This message has been edited. Last edited by: DaveBarker,

One gets what one pays for.

Hopefully they won't get labeled as being weak or overly emotional. I do have to say, when I saw this picture, it looked like a little kid holding the gun

I think shes cute,....war is a mans world,....sure, our female veterans are doing an outstanding job,....but, is it worth the obvious damage to them? I do not intend to demean them,...I am just old fashioned, and feel they serve better as medical, and other non-combat related fields.

I speak from experience,...not from a book.

wow.. that was about as informational as a preview to a made for TV movie...

could they get just a little deeper into the story, or are they running low on Computer ink?

quote:

Originally posted by Elesso:
wow.. that was about as informational as a preview to a made for TV movie...

could they get just a little deeper into the story, or are they running low on Computer ink?

Even reporting of critical issues as this get short shrift here, IMO not due to any apathy of those covering/reporting. Merely the necessity to "get to the point" and not exceed a given amount of space. Not an excuse by any means, only an explanation from my writing experience. About the subject, we must be prepared and educate ourselves to best respond and support our loved ones (& each others) struggles with PTSD and TBI. The future of our families & communities are at stake.

From a Veteran's Son, Brother & Father.

I really would have appreciated a little more depth to the story as well. If these stats are true, they merit our attention. We should address the problem at hand, honestly and without political agenda or pride.

Are women inherently more prone to PTSD? Are we simply more likely to report it and seek help? Will our higher rates continue at the five, ten, and fifteen year mark, or will they level off to comparable male levels? How much of this PTSD is due to, or exacerbated by sexual assault and trauma? ( A separate issue entirely, but it has to be controlled for for this data to make any sense.)

Is there something actual combat units (Infantry, Armor, etc) do, which we women cannot serve in, which support units are not doing to support their troops and prevent full-blown PTSD? Is there some aspect of training, either at the entry or unit level, which needs to change in order to grant women more emotional resiliance? IE should we train in all-women Basic Training Battalions, should we undergo an extra measure of desensitization over and beyond our male compatriots?

I mean, I know all these questions cannot be addressed in one measly article based off one study! But I'd appreciate if a few of the questions were addressed, or at least acknowledged, and a few more quotes were gathered from actual women sufferers of PTSD.

"I do not intend to demean them,...I am just old fashioned, and feel they serve better as medical, and other non-combat related fields.

I speak from experience,...not from a book."

The article was a little dishonest. We DO serve in official support duties only. The problem is that there are no defined front lines, and merely travelling between camps puts you in the combat zone. There are precious few job categories which exempt you from danger entirely, and in order to ensure women had only these safer jobs, we'd have to have quite a few more men to fill the roles you took from the women who served in them. We started this deal when we started the all-volunteer military nearly 30 years ago, and it will be very difficult to backtrack now, even IF solid proof of rampant psychiatric troubles comes to light.

As far as medics go, they see far more death and dismemberment and chaos than most Infantrymen. They are the ones who patch up people with the worst imaginable injuries, and then go home to deal with the psychological consequences, and many of them serve in the line of fire on convoys. I would hardly call their job "safer" either psychologically or physically. Give that little label to certain categories of us intel types, maybe.

quote:

Originally posted by 6145060:
I think shes cute,....war is a mans world,....sure, our female veterans are doing an outstanding job,....but, is it worth the obvious damage to them? I do not intend to demean them,...I am just old fashioned, and feel they serve better as medical, and other non-combat related fields.

I speak from experience,...not from a book.

Yeah, too bad she's not a guy, because guys don't get PTSD ... oh, wait ...

This article does not give any comparative analysis between male and female soldiers suffering PTSD and seems to suggest that only women suffer from this problem when we all know that ain't true. So I'm not sure what the author's point is, except maybe to say that even the so-called rear echelon types are getting PTSD, but that's true for everyone in an exposed occupation such as convoy driver, transportation specialist, MP, etc. Since anyone can be blown up at any time, no matter what their MOS or location in country, maybe the point of the article should have been that even people - male and female - in positions that ordinarily would have been deemed less stressful are instead experiencing great stress because of the nature of the conflict. I think added to this, too, is the fact that a lot of military women have complained about sexual harassment by their fellow soldiers and commanders. This adds to their stress in a completely unacceptable and controllable fashion.

Alright, y'all. Maybe they just truncated the article for some reason (why should space be a premium online??)

Here is a fuller treatment from USA Today, a fairly decent paper, if somewhat generalist in its treatment of issues:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-01-01-womenvets_N.htm

quote:

Originally posted by 6145060:
war is a mans world,......

I am just old fashioned, and feel they serve better as medical, and other non-combat related fields.

I speak from experience,...not from a book.

BRAVO ZULU, My feelings exactly...

quote:

Originally posted by GoldenSabers:

quote:

Originally posted by Elesso:
wow.. that was about as informational as a preview to a made for TV movie...

could they get just a little deeper into the story, or are they running low on Computer ink?

Even reporting of critical issues as this get short shrift here, IMO not due to any apathy of those covering/reporting. Merely the necessity to "get to the point" and not exceed a given amount of space. Not an excuse by any means, only an explanation from my writing experience. About the subject, we must be prepared and educate ourselves to best respond and support our loved ones (& each others) struggles with PTSD and TBI. The future of our families & communities are at stake.

From a Veteran's Son, Brother & Father.

I've seen less critical stories get way more column space. I think a subject such as this warrants a little more space.

quote:

Originally posted by IC2SS19Z50C5:

quote:

Originally posted by 6145060:
war is a mans world,......

I am just old fashioned, and feel they serve better as medical, and other non-combat related fields.

I speak from experience,...not from a book.

BRAVO ZULU, My feelings exactly...

No point in debating the pros and cons concerning women in combat. Theory is over. This is reality. I don’t necessarily see PTSD and TBI as more or less tragic in female soldiers as in male soldiers. The point that needs to be made IMHO is that we are not only unprepared to deal with these combat related maladies in the numbers of male soldiers returning, we are way unprepared to deal with them in women. Just the number of resident treatment beds available to female vets alone is totally unrealistic. This Country needs to take action now, rather than expecting the problem to go away. Our experience with previous conflicts indicates it won’t go away. We need to take care of our wounded warriors regardless of sex.

quote:

Originally posted by Ruanne:
Alright, y'all. Maybe they just truncated the article for some reason (why should space be a premium online??)

Here is a fuller treatment from USA Today, a fairly decent paper, if somewhat generalist in its treatment of issues:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-01-01-womenvets_N.htm

Bravo Zulu for getting the whole story for us to read...Mil-Dot-Com should have done a much better job at reporting this story, hack job stories with sensational titles are for US/Enquirer etc.
The 'problem' is not about women in combat, it goes back to recruiting, and honesty about what the military is really designed and maintained for. Too often the military is treated as a social program for wayward youths, as a government funded incentive program to pay for college, as a Peace Corpish entity.
The military is for war. That's a period after war.
There's plenty of women that have served in the service of this country just as good as any a man. As someone stated, PTSD does not discriminate with the sexes.
The end of this article on USA says something Washington politicians and the Pentagon had better heed: Nearly a year after being "sucked out of a vortex" in Iraq, Rathbun is on the mend. She knows there are thousands of other women who need help.

"We went over there and did a job, but it affects you," she says. "There's going to be a flood when we drawdown in Iraq."

What branch was MarineAuntie in,....?

My post was not meant to demean women, nor state that men are not susceptible to PTSD,...I speak from actual military experience, and current work experience,...women, as a rule, are not physically, or emotionally as strong as most men. That is a medical fact,....thus, they are NOT allowed in actual COMBAT roles.

Womens liberation has both helped women, and in cases such as these, as well as female police, and firefighters, HURT them, because they just do not NORMALLY pack the gear to fully perform the jobs they are assigned.

By the same token, most men are not qualified to fullfill roles historically performed by women.

power to any woman who wants to be in the front lin, but dont ask for any special treatment. becareful what you wish for...

To: 3501762, a former Marine,....I agree with you. Excellent example: I am a former Marine also,....and am eligible to retire from my civilian job now,.....however, if I were allowed to return to active duty, ( im almost 49 years old, and still in excellent shape)I would eagerly return. I realize that though I am still in excellent condition, I am "old" concerning the current conflict,....that is a YOUNG MANS GAME.

I realize my limitations, and would NOT expect special treatment, ...but would most likely receive it anyhow from the young troops, out of respect,..as well as the fact that those terrible conditions would adversely affect me much faster than say a 25 year old.

Realizing limitations,...that is all I ask of people such as MarineAuntie.

You can get PTSD from other things other than War! War is hard and even the so called strongest can get it. Loss of legs, arms, etc... Male or female you may get PTSD. It can come tomorrow or 30 years from now. How you decided to deal with it is yours and yours alone. VA and other medical folks will try and give you a pill. Watch out for this type of treatment. There is a role in war for females, it is here to stay. Like all military, training and the desire to win from the political leaders is a must. CSM Ruley

I like that shade of lipstick.

It certainly doesn't make any difference whether one is toting a weapon at an FOB, driving a truck or vehicle in a convoy, doing guard duty at an operating base, flying a chopper, or doing time at sea (brown water, littoral, or blue water); or whether you are male or female...these psychological traumas are happening, & must be dealt with, most honorably & fairly, by our Nation. It should be well remembered that; all who have served, are serving, & who will serve should & must be accorded whatever needs to be done in order to deal with this affliction, & to be able to get on with their lives. After all, they most certainly have extended themselves for their Nation, "light years" more so than those who whine or complain & not serve; & those who pacify & lend apologies & defenses to our enemies. May the Good Lord always bless& protect our Great nation, along with our brave & courageous men & women in uniform serving it....

Boughtwaprice,
I was thinking the same thing. Seriously though, I think we are going to see the floodgates open over the next decade in the VA system. Anyone who serves now though deserves the very best when they return and I sincerely pray that these brave female soldiers struggling with PTSD find the peace they so richly deserve.