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Posted
In recent months, we have discussed the state of our Polar rollers(Grin) and their state of readiness.

If you have been reading the news, Russia has now declared the North Pole and the seabed to be Russian Property.

In view of the fact that only the Coast Guard has the ships capable of reaching the polar area, what are your impressions of the new need to bring ALL our polar assets up to speed and if necessary arming them with more than simple light machine guns?????????????

Capt. Wheeler, I'd be most interested in your views.

Thanks.

Jack
 
Posts: 619 | Registered: Sat 23 September 2000Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
<M_Wood51>
Posted
This article appeared today at Bloomberg.com:

U.S. Rejects Russian Claim to Mineral-Rich Seabed at North Pole

And this article from the Hisdustan Times (India) appearing in today's edition (Aug 3):

US to send icebreaker to North Pole after Russian mission

"A United States icebreaker will leave Seattle on August 6 for an Arctic research mission, just after Russia attempts to symbolically lay claim to a huge section of the region, the US Coast Guard said on Thursday.

News of the Healy vessel's trip came as two Russian mini-submarines started the first-ever dive 4,200 metres (14,000 feet) under the ice near the North Pole to take soil and fauna samples on the ocean floor, and back the country's claim to a vast swathe of the hydrocarbon-rich Arctic territory.
"
 
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Oil again! If we could solve that problem, we could have a peaceful world. Well, perhaps . . .

...george
 
Posts: 9988 | Registered: Thu 11 July 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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One of the missions of the icebreakers the last few years has been as a platform for the mapping of the Arctic seabed in order for the US to lay claims to parts of the polar region.

As a historical note, some people from the U.S. once laid claim to Wrangel Island--above Siberia--for this country. No one took it seriously until oil showed up in the Arctic. However, the Soviets had put landing party form a gunboat in the 1920s and took off the island some US trappers and their native helpers. The Soviets then laid claim to the island. At least one to two U.S. citizens died while held by the Soviets. The natives were released in China. The island for many years was a KGB detention camp, better known as a part of the Gulag.
 
Posts: 607 | Registered: Sun 27 May 2001Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Hoof Hearted
Ice Melted
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From an article in Harpers Magazinem Nov. 1886, " Our Coast Guard" by Lt. Worth G. Ross, USRM

"A vessel that has gained a distinctive public reputation for her various expeditions to the arctic is the steam-cutter Thomas Corwin. She sailed from San Francisco May 4, 1881, destined for Alaska and the northwest polar sea. The object of the cruise was, in addition to revenue duty, to ascertain the fate of two missing whalers (Mount Wollaston and Vigilant), and to communicate, if possible, with the exploring steamer Jeannette.

During the previous year five ineffectual attempts were made by the Corwin to reach Herald Island. On this trip a landing was made, after a hazardous run through the drift ice, and Wrangel Land was at the same time sighted to the westward. To convey a partial idea of the perilous nature of navigating the waters (or rather the ice) of the arctic, the following incident, taken from the report of Captain Hooper, affords a graphic illustration:

The wind had increased to a moderate gale, and the snow fell so thick that observation beyond the length of the vessel was impossible. Shortly after midnight we found ourselves entirely surrounded by heavy ice, and were compelled to use the engine to work out of it in doing so the rudder was broken and unshipped, every pintle being carried away. The situation was anything but pleasant, caught in the end of a rapidly closing lead, 120 miles from open water, in a howling gale and driving snow-storm, and without a rudder. It at first appeared as if the destruction of the vessel was inevitable. However, after several hours of hard work, steering as best we could by means of the sails, and giving the vessel a great many hard bumps and nips, we succeeded in getting into the open lead again, and by six o'clock we had prepared a jury-rudder.

One of the most eventful features of the cruise was the first landing on Wrangel Land (north latitude 71 ~ 04), August 12. After much difficulty in pushing the Corwin through the floating and grounded masses of ice, an open space was reached a short distance from the island, where the vessel was anchored, and a party succeeded in getting on shore in a small boat. Lieutenant W. E. Reynolds, of the party (which included Captain Hooper, Dr. I. C. Rosse, Assistant Engineer F. E. Owen, Mr. John Muir, Mr. E.W. Nelson, of the Signal Service, and the boats crew), planted the United States flag on a cliff, where were secured a copy of the New York Herald and a record of the Corwins cruise, and possession was formally taken of the newly acquired ice clad territory amid enthusiastic cheers and a salute from the guns of the cutter. In an extract from the Bulletin of the American Geographical Society (No. 3, 1883), Dr. Rosse says, regarding the first landing on Wrangel Island: It may be remarked with pardonable pride that the acquisition of this remote island, though of no political or commercial value, will serve the higher and nobler purpose of a perpetual reminder of American enterprise, courage, and maritime skill.
 
Posts: 2394 | Registered: Wed 14 June 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Masters Mate:

I did fail to mention that it was the Corwin that made the first claim for the U.S. Should not have slipped up on that one, as Healy was XO the first time the island was sighted by the crew of the Corwin, but no one landed at that time.

The actual landing came the next year.
 
Posts: 607 | Registered: Sun 27 May 2001Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Basic Training
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Possable GM's back on Polar Rollers?

Where do I sign up? Cool
 
Posts: 219 | Registered: Sun 20 July 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Prong the Rooskies. They had to save their gas money up for a year just to get up there.
 
Posts: 726 | Registered: Tue 15 June 2004Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Basic Training
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Oh yeah! Waiting for billets to open up!
 
Posts: 1421 | Registered: Fri 14 December 2001Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
<M_Wood51>
Posted
Don't hold your collective breaths. The U.S. Treasury barely holds enough money to fund the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan without having to go to Japan and Red China to borrow more money.

Maybe the Coast Guard could outsource the job to one of Russia's super icebreakers.

Naw, either the law of paradoxes or the law of entropy would kick in somehow.

Unless the government finds a way to raise enough revenue to adequately arm and equip the small fleet of U.S. Coast Guard icebreakers, we shouldn't expect much action from the big red ones - unless they are hijacked...err, I mean acquired by the Navy.
 
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i thought that the north and south pole lands couldnt be claimed, like a world agreement or something, that were named to be only used for research of " stuff " or something...
 
Posts: 125 | Registered: Sun 08 July 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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I think that might only be the antarctic. I believe that the arctic will belong to the country that can prove that their continental shelf is connected to the area they want to lay claim to. For now it is not possible to prove which shelf connects to what but it is thought that within the next decade it should be.
 
Posts: 21 | Registered: Sat 06 August 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Another view of this issue is found here.
The North Pole is Ours.
 
Posts: 619 | Registered: Sat 23 September 2000Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Basic Training
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With all the oil coming out of Northern Alberta, and Canada's history with the NW PAssage I have a feeling they might have something to say about all this.

http://thetyee.ca/Views/2006/01/30/DefendNorthwestPassage/
 
Posts: 119 | Registered: Tue 14 November 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Cutterman,

I think that your article brings the point in to focus.
Who is going to protect US interests in the Arctic? Should there be and incident in the Arctic, the State Department will probably write a sharp note of protest. If you even bother to read sharp notes of protest.

The US Coast Guard is the only military branch, that has the current ship capability to project US military power into the Arctic Ocean, yet those ships are ill armed to beat off armed attack, by natives in a whale skinned canoe.

This is not an attack on the crews. They just don't have the equipment to defend themselves, least of all US property and interests.

NOAA nor NSF will protect the US. We are a branch of the US Armed Forces, and as such have a military preparedness mission. I wish I was convinced that the Polars were ready.

Jack
 
Posts: 619 | Registered: Sat 23 September 2000Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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Aude et Effice!
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Posts: 1575 | Registered: Sat 05 May 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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1110

While Canada may protect their interests with either Polar Class 5 vessels, or Arctic Patrol Vessels, has not yet been settled. The key here
is IMHO they will IN THE FUTURE.
Remember that just this year, the RCN didn't have the money to patrol their own east coast, until public pressure forced the Defense Minister to transfer monies to the Navy.
They Can Patrol.
Jack.
 
Posts: 619 | Registered: Sat 23 September 2000Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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