Check These Out: Buddy Finder | Videos | SpouseBUZZ | My Friend Network | News | Military Equipment


Military.com    Military.com Forums  Hop To Forum Categories  Hot Topics & Current Events  Hop To Forums  Point-Counterpoint    Support Growing for Proof of Citizenship to Vote
Page 1 2 
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
Reply
  
  Login/Join 
Experienced Member
Picture of SgtSchaeffersMom
Posted
Well thank God.

Some folks will have to scramble to get their documentation in order, but it will only be a problem initially.

This is a long overdue COMMON SENSE issue.

Applause


http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/05/28/support-growing...to-register-to-vote/

New legislation being offered in several states aims to make sure people who walk into the nation’s voting booths are, in fact, American citizens.

In Missouri, state Rep. Stanley Cox wants a constitutional amendment that would allow the state to require proof of citizenship when people register to vote.

“That doesn’t seem like an unreasonable requirement because we certainly don’t want people who are not legal in this country deciding our future,” Cox told FOX News.

Missouri is not the only state trying to make it harder for illegals to cast ballots. Right now, 11 states are considering a proof of citizenship law.

Back in 2004, Arizona became the first state in the nation to require proof of citizenship when registering to vote.

“We have an illegal immigration problem here — that’s what triggers these laws.” said Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio.

Arpaio has made a national reputation cracking down on illegal immigration in Arizona.

“Do you think it prevents people from voting? No I don’t. I think it prevents people who are not here legally from voting,” said Jan Brewer, the Arizona secretary of state who says since the bill passed more than 2,000 non-citizens have been bounced from voter rolls. since the bill passed more than 2,000 non-citizens have been bounced from voter rolls.

“I think it ensures those honest voters that they have integrity in the process and that’s what they demand and should be delivered to them,” Brewer said.

Critics say proof of citizenship also deters legal citizens from voting.

“It makes it difficult to vote if you are someone who doesn’t have the documents in hand,” said Claude Piller, a lawyer with Mi Familia Vota, an outreach group that registers new voters in Phoenix.

Piller said that getting documents like passports and birth certificates can be a challenge for the poor or elderly. “We believe the impact will primarily be amongst those who never had to prove they were citizens,” Piller said.
 
Posts: 5379 | Registered: Thu 08 June 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Peace Through Superior Firepower
Picture of SSgtRobertMorris
Posted Hide Post
Try cashing a check without showing any ID.

Which is more important, cashing a check or voting?


"HOW DARE YOU COME INTO MY HOUSE, YOU SON OF A B----!"
Susan Buxton, 66, heard over her granddaughter's 911 call. Arlington, TX 9 Nov. 2005. Aired 10 Nov. 2005, WBAP 820, Mark Davis show. She ended up shooting him in the leg when he tried to take her gun. Good shtuff!
 
Posts: 7089 | Registered: Fri 10 March 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Experienced Member
Picture of SgtSchaeffersMom
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by SSgtRobertMorris:
Try cashing a check without showing any ID.

Which is more important, cashing a check or voting?


I agree.

Besides, it is completely irresponsible in this day and age to NOT have copies of your birth certificates, etc. available.

We had to have copies of birth certificates for my kids to play soccer 15 years ago for pete's sake.
 
Posts: 5379 | Registered: Thu 08 June 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Member
Posted Hide Post
fun fact: there is nothing in the US constitution preventing a 7-year-old illegal immigrant from voting
 
Posts: 2795 | Registered: Mon 02 July 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engine intakes.
Picture of PeteCDR
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by liberal90:
fun fact: there is nothing in the US constitution preventing a 7-year-old illegal immigrant from voting

...Except the 26th Amendment!
 
Posts: 3867 | Registered: Wed 14 March 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
DEAD MEAT - Love, Fate
Picture of Tomcatt
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by liberal90:
fun fact: there is nothing in the US constitution preventing a 7-year-old illegal immigrant from voting
is there anything that even comes close to allowing it?


Forget the dog, Beware of Owner
 
Posts: 3415 | Registered: Mon 11 October 2004Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engine intakes.
Picture of PeteCDR
Posted Hide Post
Oh, and I almost forgot - Section 2 of the 14th Amendment addresses citizenship to vote. Sorry.

"But when the right to vote at any election ... is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such state, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States..."
 
Posts: 3867 | Registered: Wed 14 March 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Far East Ambassador and Cultural Liason

Has Been 4
Picture of GunnyRet03
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Tomcatt:
quote:
Originally posted by liberal90:
fun fact: there is nothing in the US constitution preventing a 7-year-old illegal immigrant from voting
is there anything that even comes close to allowing it?


lib90 thinks its ok for illegals to vote, so cut him some slack. He's a world citizen. Roll Eyes


All these people before were asking for proff non-citizens were voting, well above there are 2000, which is also 2000 citizens that had their vote negated.
 
Posts: 12806 | Registered: Fri 05 September 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
DEAD MEAT - Love, Fate
Picture of Tomcatt
Posted Hide Post
you will probably have someone come in and say there is not proof that those 2000 actually voted. why would they register if they did not intend to vote?


Forget the dog, Beware of Owner
 
Posts: 3415 | Registered: Mon 11 October 2004Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Member
Posted Hide Post
During the last election as I stood in line, I took out my ID. When I got to the table, all I was asked was my name and address, no proof of who I was.

I always thought that it was strange that anyone who knew my name and address could vote for me. Of course, I live in heavily democratic Maryland where everything is just peachy. Except the cries of disenfranchised voters from the democrats. I never could figure out who was supposedly disenfranchising them.

You should need to provide proof of citizenship to register and proof of who you are to vote.
 
Posts: 2565 | Registered: Fri 22 September 2000Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
"Sarcastic Member"
Picture of thorin001
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by SgtSchaeffersMom:
Well thank God.

Some folks will have to scramble to get their documentation in order, but it will only be a problem initially.

This is a long overdue COMMON SENSE issue.

Applause


http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/05/28/support-growing...to-register-to-vote/

New legislation being offered in several states aims to make sure people who walk into the nation’s voting booths are, in fact, American citizens.

In Missouri, state Rep. Stanley Cox wants a constitutional amendment that would allow the state to require proof of citizenship when people register to vote.

“That doesn’t seem like an unreasonable requirement because we certainly don’t want people who are not legal in this country deciding our future,” Cox told FOX News.

Missouri is not the only state trying to make it harder for illegals to cast ballots. Right now, 11 states are considering a proof of citizenship law.

Back in 2004, Arizona became the first state in the nation to require proof of citizenship when registering to vote.

“We have an illegal immigration problem here — that’s what triggers these laws.” said Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio.

Arpaio has made a national reputation cracking down on illegal immigration in Arizona.

“Do you think it prevents people from voting? No I don’t. I think it prevents people who are not here legally from voting,” said Jan Brewer, the Arizona secretary of state who says since the bill passed more than 2,000 non-citizens have been bounced from voter rolls. since the bill passed more than 2,000 non-citizens have been bounced from voter rolls.

“I think it ensures those honest voters that they have integrity in the process and that’s what they demand and should be delivered to them,” Brewer said.

Critics say proof of citizenship also deters legal citizens from voting.

“It makes it difficult to vote if you are someone who doesn’t have the documents in hand,” said Claude Piller, a lawyer with Mi Familia Vota, an outreach group that registers new voters in Phoenix.

Piller said that getting documents like passports and birth certificates can be a challenge for the poor or elderly. “We believe the impact will primarily be amongst those who never had to prove they were citizens,” Piller said.


The problem is not the idea, it is the implementation. The only peole who think that voting should not be restricted to adult citiens are either criminals (illegals) or mentally defective. The problem is how to do that without creating an undue burden on legal citizens. So far the proposals I have seen would disenfranchise more citizens than illegals.
 
Posts: 5824 | Registered: Thu 22 March 2001Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Experienced Member
Posted Hide Post
quote:
“It makes it difficult to vote if you are someone who doesn’t have the documents in hand,” said Claude Piller, a lawyer with Mi Familia Vota, an outreach group that registers new voters in Phoenix.

Maybe ... but they sure manage to do it when their food stamps and/or social security/medicare are on the line. Smokescreen.
 
Posts: 3488 | Registered: Mon 09 July 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Member
Picture of L0A1
Posted Hide Post
Yep, it is a smokescreen.

So the ole saying goes. "Vote early and Often."

quote:
Originally posted by Jade_Gate:
quote:
“It makes it difficult to vote if you are someone who doesn’t have the documents in hand,” said Claude Piller, a lawyer with Mi Familia Vota, an outreach group that registers new voters in Phoenix.

Maybe ... but they sure manage to do it when their food stamps and/or social security/medicare are on the line. Smokescreen.
 
Posts: 1768 | Registered: Sat 03 March 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Super Member
Picture of outlaws93
Posted Hide Post
yes good idea indeed.... everyone must prove who they are when voting... Applause


 
Posts: 32802 | Registered: Thu 18 August 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Experienced Member
Picture of SgtSchaeffersMom
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Jade_Gate:
quote:
“It makes it difficult to vote if you are someone who doesn’t have the documents in hand,” said Claude Piller, a lawyer with Mi Familia Vota, an outreach group that registers new voters in Phoenix.

Maybe ... but they sure manage to do it when their food stamps and/or social security/medicare are on the line. Smokescreen.


Applause
 
Posts: 5379 | Registered: Thu 08 June 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Member
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by PeteCDR:
Oh, and I almost forgot - Section 2 of the 14th Amendment addresses citizenship to vote. Sorry.

"But when the right to vote at any election ... is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such state, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States..."


that's right, there are sections preventing the right to vote from being denied to citizens and those 18 years of age or upwards; there is nothing preventing non-citizens or those below 18 years of age form voting

This is how some states allowed women to vote in federal elections before the passage of the 19th Amendment: there was never any language preventing them from doing so.
 
Posts: 2795 | Registered: Mon 02 July 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Super Member
Picture of outlaws93
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by liberal90:
quote:
Originally posted by PeteCDR:
Oh, and I almost forgot - Section 2 of the 14th Amendment addresses citizenship to vote. Sorry.

"But when the right to vote at any election ... is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such state, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States..."


that's right, there are sections preventing the right to vote from being denied to citizens and those 18 years of age or upwards; there is nothing preventing non-citizens or those below 18 years of age form voting

This is how some states allowed women to vote in federal elections before the passage of the 19th Amendment: there was never any language preventing them from doing so.


so something that was used for women to vote you want to exploit so illegals can vote???


 
Posts: 32802 | Registered: Thu 18 August 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Member
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Tomcatt:
quote:
Originally posted by liberal90:
fun fact: there is nothing in the US constitution preventing a 7-year-old illegal immigrant from voting
is there anything that even comes close to allowing it?


In this country, anything that is not explicitly prohibited is allowed.
 
Posts: 2795 | Registered: Mon 02 July 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Member
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by outlaws93:

so something that was used for women to vote you want to exploit so illegals can vote???


I didn't say we should let illegal immigrants vote in federal elections. I said there's nothing stopping a state from allowing them to do so.
 
Posts: 2795 | Registered: Mon 02 July 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Basic Training
Picture of USNR_2006
Posted Hide Post
A bit off-topic...

Wouldn't it be awesome if, instead of focusing on who shouldn't vote, we found a way to get more of the people who ARE allowed to vote to actually get off their arses and...well, VOTE??? Sorry, I'm feeling a bit cynical today. Wink

http://elections.gmu.edu/Voter_Turnout_2004.htm
 
Posts: 78 | Registered: Mon 02 October 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engine intakes.
Picture of PeteCDR
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by liberal90:
quote:
Originally posted by Tomcatt:
quote:
Originally posted by liberal90:
fun fact: there is nothing in the US constitution preventing a 7-year-old illegal immigrant from voting
is there anything that even comes close to allowing it?


In this country, anything that is not explicitly prohibited is allowed.

Tell that to the judge at your sentencing if you really want to test that theory.

However, that being said, check out 18 USC section 611:

"(a) It shall be unlawful for any alien to vote in any election held solely or in part for the purpose of electing a candidate for the office of President, Vice President, Presidential elector, Member of the Senate, Member of the House of Representatives, Delegate from the District of Columbia, or Resident Commissioner, unless—
(1) the election is held partly for some other purpose;
(2) aliens are authorized to vote for such other purpose under a State constitution or statute or a local ordinance; and
(3) voting for such other purpose is conducted independently of voting for a candidate for such Federal offices, in such a manner that an alien has the opportunity to vote for such other purpose, but not an opportunity to vote for a candidate for any one or more of such Federal offices.
(b) Any person who violates this section shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than one year, or both.
(c) Subsection (a) does not apply to an alien if—
(1) each natural parent of the alien (or, in the case of an adopted alien, each adoptive parent of the alien) is or was a citizen (whether by birth or naturalization);
(2) the alien permanently resided in the United States prior to attaining the age of 16; and
(3) the alien reasonably believed at the time of voting in violation of such subsection that he or she was a citizen of the United States. "

The Constitution allows this law because paragraph 2 of the 19th Amendment and Section 2 of the 24th and 26th Amendments make the following statement:

"The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation."

That makes denial of illegal immigrants constitutional. Further, as stated in the statute, the states have the authority to disallow all illegal immigrants from voting in any and all elections, even the ones a