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"So long and thanks for the fish."
Picture of Hooligan1972
Posted
While watching the noon news here on the south shore of Lake Erie, I heard some news that really upsets me. The Coast Guard has had to take a back seat to local fire and LE agencies because they have better equipment that the Coast Guard.

The story:
A Cleveland firefighter disappered while swimming from a boat off of Sandusky, OH. Unfortunatly, it is now a search and recover operation instead of a SAR. According to the news report, the Sandusky FD and Huron PD have better equipment to locate a body under the water. Station Marblehead was the Lead during the initial response.

Comments?
 
Posts: 344 | Registered: Mon 16 April 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Experienced Member
Picture of Mightyz90_93
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This is the best news since before some jerk coined the phrase "Search and Recovery"!

Wouldn't you RATHER that locals take over the job of recovering bodies once the likelyhood of survival is past? Let our folks take a breath and wait for the next risk of life/property damage case to come up.
 
Posts: 6574 | Registered: Sun 15 June 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
"So long and thanks for the fish."
Picture of Hooligan1972
Posted Hide Post
I understand that. It's just the idea of locals having better equipment. Kind a makes us sound like a third world navy.
 
Posts: 344 | Registered: Mon 16 April 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Member
Posted Hide Post
Better equipment for a recovery is not the same as better equipment for SAR
 
Posts: 1935 | Registered: Sat 13 July 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Experienced Member
Picture of Mightyz90_93
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by FlynnPatrick:
Better equipment for a recovery is not the same as better equipment for SAR


How true. The former is NOT OUR RESPONSIBILITY and the later is.
 
Posts: 6574 | Registered: Sun 15 June 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Experienced Member
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Locals have a lot better equipment for a lot of things. It doesn't mean we are a third world Navy, it only means our focus is different. How many locals do you know that have multimillion dollar aircraft and boats with integrated search pattern programs, rescue equipment etc.? Once it becomes a recovery mission it is passed to the locals as soon as possible.
 
Posts: 3401 | Registered: Thu 01 March 2001Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
New Member
Picture of eaclark
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I think the key word in the story is "Locate a body under the water". Fire/Police have more training, people, and $ for those types of operations.
 
Posts: 207 | Registered: Tue 27 June 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
New Member
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It's not necessarily better equipment, it's appropriate equipment. I was once a volunteer EMT and we had dragging equipment. The main piece was a large metal triangle with several large treble hooks on it. Nasty stuff.

Be very glad that we don't have to fool with that sort of stuff.
 
Posts: 242 | Registered: Thu 04 September 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Member
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While on active duty (1957-78) I had the experience of recovering bodies. It was part of the job. At that time search and rescue/recovery was at the top of our list of missions.

With all respect, it was gruesome work.
 
Posts: 2895 | Registered: Mon 19 March 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Experienced Member
Picture of chief74Ret
Posted Hide Post
We use to use body drags like the above poster said but for some reason they quit the body search with the drags,may be a good thing. Eek

But most were floaters.
 
Posts: 4724 | Registered: Fri 22 September 2000Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
"So long and thanks for the fish."
Picture of Hooligan1972
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by FlynnPatrick:
Better equipment for a recovery is not the same as better equipment for SAR


I disagree. The same equipment can be used for both. It still make the CG look like a third world navy. It was probably too late by the time our boats arrived on scene. Should they have left because we would have just pulled a floater out instead of a sinker?

medicjm, that was the same equipment we used in the '70s. Not pretty. Better equipment is available. The CG won't get it because it's not 'Homeland Security' type equipment.

sanrayo, I echo your comment.
 
Posts: 344 | Registered: Mon 16 April 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Experienced Member
Picture of Mightyz90_93
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I too have seen a recovery via a strokes go wrong too, but no, equipment used to find a body under water is not the same as used to find one on the water. With our 11 mission areas we have now, we don't need to be in the bussiness of dragging for bodies.
 
Posts: 6574 | Registered: Sun 15 June 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Member
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Are the 11 missions prioritized?
 
Posts: 2895 | Registered: Mon 19 March 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Experienced Member
Picture of Mightyz90_93
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yes, on a daily, hourly and minute by minue basis.
 
Posts: 6574 | Registered: Sun 15 June 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Member
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Good answer. That's completely understood.

During the budget process given to Congress is there a prioritized mission list?
 
Posts: 2895 | Registered: Mon 19 March 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Experienced Member
Picture of Mightyz90_93
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It is intimated that PWCS and Search and Rescue will normally take precedence in cases of mission conflicts and that those two are wieghed specifically case by case. Haven't seen anything directly list them out 1-11.


PWCS=Port, Waterway & Coastal Security
 
Posts: 6574 | Registered: Sun 15 June 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Member
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Another good answer. Thank you.
 
Posts: 2895 | Registered: Mon 19 March 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
I intend to live forever. So far, so good.
Picture of Wray
Posted Hide Post
quote:
The Coast Guard has had to take a back seat to local fire and LE agencies because they have better equipment that the Coast Guard.


Does that surprise you? I bet you remember back in your day, as well as my early days in the CG the way we looked for a body was to drag for it.... Fortunately I never hooked one... granted that was years ago, but our main purpose then was search & rescue.. you won't rescue many if you are draginf for them with trebble hooks.

While I was working the Air Florida crash the first divers there were the Atlantic Strike Team.. They were good, but the equipment brought in by the Navy (yes, I hate to say this) Harbor Clearing Unit was much more extensive. I venture to say they had more experience, but not positive of that....

I'd agree with MightyZ & Pat on both of their posts.....

Wray.. Cool
 
Posts: 14485 | Registered: Fri 22 September 2000Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Member
Picture of CommsChek78
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SAR and Body recovery are 2 different things

LANT SAR Plan:
• Availability of adequate resources on scene from local agencies.
• Nature of the searching being done by the responsible local agencies. If in body
recovery mode, the SAR aspects of the incident may be considered ended. Further
Coast Guard participation may take place at the discretion of the local unit or higher
authority, but only as providing non-SAR assistance to local agencies.
 
Posts: 524 | Registered: Sat 24 August 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
Member
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So, what's your point? The Book leaves wiggle-room that has defined Semper Paratus for almost 218 years.
 
Posts: 2895 | Registered: Mon 19 March 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message
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