I graduated HS A school a couple weeks ago. I am in transit to my next duty station. However, I got a call today saying that I need to show up before my leave expires to find a place to live. I was told by someone else who is going there with me, that we get 10 days of leave after we report in. I'm asking this because I had plans of going up there and staying in a hotel until I found a place to live. I was also going to take my 2 cats with me. What is the rule for house hunting leave?

HH leave is Convalescence leave, meaning that it is non-chargeable absense. You are allowed UP TO 10 days and is up to the commands discretion wether you are able to take it or not.
You cannot take it in conjustion with leave en route. You have to take it before your departure date from last unit or after check-in to new unit.
You can be reimbursed for a hotel on your own leave time before you actually check in while in the area of your new unit with TLE.
In a nut shell, you should have been counseled at TRACEN before you departed, when they gave you your original orders.

I'm sorry. The yoemen at TRACEN did not go over the original orders with me, infact they sent my originals with the PDR to my next duty station. Anyways, it is as long as I'm in the area of my next duty station that I get reimbursed. I'm a little confused about that part.
Thank you!

Kirt13 I don't think you are explaining that right.
TLE can be taken in the vicinity of the old or new duty station.

From the PCS departure worksheet

TLE may be used before departing the old PDS, during the elapsed time between PDSs (not including travel days for which per diem is payable), after arrival at the new PDS, or a combination equal to the authorized total. (See JFTR U5700 for more information.)

Yes, the hotel must be in the area of your new unit. Just as I said on my first post.
Flynn, I was only explaining for this mbrs specific circumstance since they are looking for a house at the new duty station.
So yes, I did explain it right.

you did not explain it right, this statement is wrong

quote:

You have to take it before your departure date from last unit or after check-in to new unit.

The rules say you have to take it in the vicinity of your new or old duty station. Nothing about after departure or check in it just is not paid for days when you are collecting travel Per Diem.

Flynn,
You cut some of my quote out. Specifically the part at the beginning where I said that this was for House Hunting Leave.

I don't want to turn this in to an arguement, but I was right. You need to read the post a little better before you stear someone in the wrong direction and possibly cause a haradship due to miscounselling. this could be the only counseling they get before they check in.
The part where I was talking about before departure and after reporting was for HOUSE HUNTING LEAVE.
After that I answered the question about TLE having to be taken in the area of new unit.

11807324,
Please just go by the first post a wrote to you. It is correct.[/QUOTE].

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Kirt13,

If I may...

I think the confusion may be coming from what appears to me to be a combination of TLE and House Hunting Leave. Although they could potentially occur at the same time, they aren't the same and there are different rules governing both.

I know we all understand that here and I'm not saying anything that people don't already know. But just because they happen to occur at the same time in this instance doesn't mean that the separate rules still don't apply.

Make sense?

Yes you are correct.
The mbr was told that he had to find a place to live BEFORE he reported in. That would make it TLE.
They are also asking about the rules for house hunting leave, which can only be taken AFTER the reporting date, or before departure date.

Kirt13,

Mr. Flynn is correct, you get paid TLE before you depart your previous unit or after you check in at your new unit and member is not receiving per diem. You also stated you can get reimbursed for hotels on you own leave time which is incorrect. Members are paid per deim for their travel days, not leave. The only way they get reimbursed is if they have to use TLE before the depart the previous unit (for example moved out of housing), or after checking into the new unit (and housing is not available). House hunting is not convelesant leave, it is an administrative absence or permissive orders to be at the cost of the member.

YNC

Man, I give up. This is my last post on here and I'm done.
Maroontide88,
1. You misquoted Mr. Flynn. I suggest you read his post fully.
2. You left out the part on the worksheet that says "during the elapsed time between PDS's, while not being paid Per Diem".
So yes, you can be reimbursed for a hotel while on leave ONLY IF you are in the vicinity of your new/old PDS. I just did this myself and was reimbursed correctly.
3. The PERSMAN will explain this better than reading from a worksheet. Shame on people that will counsel someone just by reading a worksheet and not checking with the manual.
4. The YNC thing doesn't mean much. It's a pay grade, not a wisdom meter. I have given alot of YN training to my Chiefs in the past because they didn't know the answers to simple YN questions.
Just because someone is a YNC doesn't mean that they know everything. I will use your above post as an example.[/

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Kirt13,

Kirt13,

Yes you can get paid TLE in the vicinity of the new and old PDS. This problem is, you have to use it before you depart/checkout of old PDS, and after you check in to the new PDS. It is not paid in between. You do not get TLE if you are on leave enroute. This is in the JFTR, not the PERSMAN. Not trying to argue, but the checking in and out of units is an issue that cost people their reimbursments of TLE. I never said I knew everthing, and I read the manuals. YNC maybe a pagrade, but I did not disrespect you or your statements, I am just trying to make the point, that TLE couseling has been a problem for many of those who have checked into my unit and some of them have been counseld wrong and did not receive TLE payments becasue they stayed in a hotel before they checked into the unit.

First off, there is some confusion in Kirt's first post because he is talking about house hunting first and then TLE second.

I'd like to point out the error of those who talk about checking in and/or out of their unit in regards to TLE. This is not a requirement to be eligible for TLE.

Lastly, Kirt you are out of line calling out a Chief like that. No one was disrespectful to you, whoever you are. You don't even have the guts to identify yourself. It's easy to take pot shots when you can hide behind your anonymity. And, though your information was correct (if a little confusing), you eliminated any credibility with a) your lack of respect and b) not even knowing where information on TLE is. Giving out correct information has nothing to do with your pay grade, it's about being in the books. When it comes to policy, that has nothing to do with wisdom, it's looking it up, every time. When is the last time you read about TLE in the JFTR? Not knowing where you work, I'd like to know if you have ever used the PCS Entitlements worksheet. If you did, you would have seen the TLE information on the last 4 pages, which breaks down TLE very well and makes it understandable. I should know - I wrote it and got the green light from PPC (tvl) to send it out via the YN Microsite, and PPC (tvl) decided to add it to the entitlements worksheet.

Btw, I would have sent most of this to you in an email, but I couldn't find an Alan Alan in global.

Have a nice day.

Amber is right... Both about Kirt and TLE. I would worry too much about old Kirt. People like that have ways of eliminating themselves from the orgnization. I've had to work with those like that from time to time.

Perhaps an example... (Oh, by the way, the only requirement for TLE is to be in the vicinity of your old or new PDS. The check in / check out requirement doesn't exist anymore.)

If a mbr reports on Friday and he had two days travel. That means Thursday and Friday are travel days for which he received per diem. (You can't receive TLE and Per Diem on the same days.) If the member checked into a hotel in the vicinity of the new PDS on Monday thru Monday, then Mon, Tues, and Wed and Saturday, Sunday, Monday would all be payable as TLE (assuming he hadn't exceed his ten day max).

Actually, there never was a requirement to check in. It was just a re-interpretation of the old rules.

And just for Kirk.... YNC R. Tullos sends.

Maroontide88,
I will appologize for the disrespect. When I saw the "YNC" at the bottom of your post I took that as "I'm a YNC, so you should except what I say" I took it the wrong way....... my fault.
I have had a bad run of suervisors in my past.
On another note, I take this website as a public internet site. Not a work environment. I tend to talk as though we are all civilians becuase who knows who you really are unless you leave a name that someone looks up in global.
Bottom line, Everybody that said I was wrong has been mis-counselling mbrs. Maybe even telling them that they can't claim TLE on their travel claim, thus causing the mbr to be underpaid for what they were entitled to.
I just get really agree when someone has been mis-counseled. I see it first hand all the time and it just pushes my buttons.
This is a very serious issue that's not fair to the mbr or their family.

I don't agree with the way in which Kirt13 projected his response to Maroontide88, but he is right about the public website we have here.
This is not to be used as a workspace, just a handy tool to help each other out and such.
It was discerning to see E-7's jump on this E-5 for being disrespectful because the bigger picture at hand here is that Kirt13 was right the entire time about the question that was asked originally about the house hunting and TLE. He seemed to be just trying to counsel the person asking the question.
From what I have read from Maroontide88, they may have been counseling people incorrectly for probably years. And as a YNC and YN1 his word has probably been taken as the final word in his workspace.
What I picture is a YN3 coming to the Chief with a travel voucher for a reimbursement of TLE for 10 days and the Chief saying no, they cant be reimbursed for the $1,000 because they stayed in the hotel before their check in date.
The YN3 then goes back to the person and repeats the same thing back to them and then takes the TLE time and hotel receipts off of the travel claim without looking up the information because heck, the Chief knows because he or she has been doing this job for a long time.
Now the person just lost $1,000 and their TLE perdium.
Who holds the YNC accountable for this awful mistake??
I commend Kirt13 for standing up to someone that out ranked them because they were wrong.

just my two cents...... YNCS, Retired

YNCS, Kirt13,

I did not explain myself to well with this issue. You can get TLE within the area of the departing PDS and reporting PDS as long as you are not being paid for travel time. The problem comes in is when members are not counseled on how travel time is calculated. I spoke without thinking first and I am sorry. Travel time is the big issue with this entitlement. I will explain with this. If per diem for travel time is not being paid, TLE may be paid for NTE the number of days authorized (ordinarily 5 or 10 days), regardless of how those days are labeled (e.g., leave, proceed, etc.). For example, if you are authorized TLE has 8 days elapsed time (e.g., proceed, delay, travel, etc.) between PDSs and the allowable travel time is 7 days, you may be paid for one day. If you have 22 days elapsed time between PDSs and the allowable travel time is 7 days, you may be paid the maximum TLE allowance. I got off track because of the house hunting and the rules state when house-hunting is performed after the member completes PCS travel to the new PDS (i.e., ICW a PCS after arrival at the new PDS). This is where I meant to state that member mus complete PCS travel to the new unit before TLE is authorized. Sorry for the confusion.

So Kirt, by your statement of this being a public internet site, not a work environment, you feel that our core values are only to be followed in a work environment? If you saw ADM Allen at the grocery store, would you say "What up, Thad?" Of course not! This site is no different. And shame on you, YNCS (ret) Anonymous/Profile Deleted for encouraging the lack of respect just because Fred's Place is "not to be used as a workspace".

If you read my post, I said that Kirt was correct. It is unreasonable for someone to be disrespectful and then expect not to be "jumped on". If you make a mistake, expect to be corrected, just like anyone who posts bad information.

All that being said, I commend Kirt for wanting to make sure that people get their entitlements and counselled correctly. I was often on the receiving end of people who had been miscounselled and it was too late. That is why I worked to put the information out to everyone about TLE.

Peace out.

Interesting string.

Couple of thoughts:

When a person asks a question that is worded so obviously that they have no understanding, the experts need to correct inaccurate assumptions first. They asked nothing about TLE. They asked about House Hunting Leave. It is LEAVE which is up to the command if they can take it or not. They also mentioned staying in a hotel. Also did not mention is single or married, which should be addressed. Also didn't ask about what unit type. Maybe a Cutter and the Command was telling them they will be expected to be aboard unit when they keave for patrol the day after their report date.

Anyways, lot's more info needed about their actual question and their circumstances to understand what they really need to know.

As for the attitudes expressed towards others, if you posess a DD-2 form or equivilant, you are not a civilian, period! Not until you trade it in for a DD-214. Act like it. If for nothing else, your own good. Several folks incorrectly addresed COMMANDER Flynn, (not MR Flynn, not Flynn) a Guardian who has been doing this stuff since before I was born (or damn close to it). (By 'this stuff, I mean Pers Admin. He is a YNC, a PERS, a formwe XO, Admin Officer, etc. He probably still has the stone tablet version of the JFTR signed by King George that he got at A-School and knows it as good as the change from two days ago! ) (See, you can poke fun, without being disrespectful too!) He may very well be YOUR next CO. More importantly. he will never be disrespectful to you, don't be to him. Same goes for the other folks. It is very easy to correct someone (when you know you are right and can cite the correct reference) without being disrespectful to a fellow guardian, senior or not. Shape up, shipmates.


DANG, I just got corrected! He was not a YNC/Pers, but was a Chief & CWO and all of the others, and really is as old as dirt!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Mightyz90_93,

I was a CWO (F&S) when travel and transportation was a part of that community.

Where the travel days based on the number of oxen you had then?

quote:

Originally posted by Amber777:
If you saw ADM Allen at the grocery store, would you say "What up, Thad?" Of course not! This site is no different. And shame on you, YNCS (ret) Anonymous/Profile Deleted for encouraging the lack of respect just because Fred's Place is "not to be used as a workspace".

Peace out.

That example was a bit extreme. I highly doubt Kirt would have done that!

I don't believe this is Fred's place. I thought it was military.com.

Yes Z you were expected to get 15 miles per day by OX. 25 if on horseback.

Of course the example was extreme - I was trying to make a point, one you may have missed because my example wasn't realistic enough for you.

How about this? You can be right, but if you are disrespectful then you are wrong. Please stop encouraging or enabling Kirt's disrespectful behavior.

Of course I did not miss your foolish point. It was the exaggeration that was unnecessary.

The only encouragement I see on this "house hunting" thread is one anxiously waiting for a response by all and one's "two cents" thrown into everyone's thoughts. I thought I would throw one in to feed the wolf!

One last final thing, if you read above Kirt explained why he acted the way he did.

Wow, so now my point is foolish? Ok, thank you for opening my eyes.

So, YNGirl, you are saying that because Kirt has had some bad supervisors he doesn't have to be respectful? If we all acted like that the CG wouldn't be a very fun place. You can say your piece when you know someone is wrong, however you still have to be respectful in the way you handle it. There are many things I'd like to say on this post right now, but I refrain because it's not right AND it would only make me look bad.

Once again, I would have addressed this with just you, I couldn't find YN1 Coastie in the global. Have a nice day.

There are many things I'd like to say on this post right now, but I refrain

-Of course you do and of course you'll refrain b/c your name is on your profile.

Once again, I would have addressed this with just you, I couldn't find YN1 Coastie in the global.

-It's called privacy.

No, I don't refrain because my name is on my profile. I refrain because of this: just because you have something to say doesn't mean you should say it, especially if it's disrespectful. I don't preach respect and then turn around and disrespect people, at least I try hard not to.

quote:

There are many things I'd like to say on this post right now, but I refrain because it's not right AND it would only make me look bad.

I'll quote you again Amber777, "it would only make me LOOK bad."

Later!

I've been thinking about this, and you know what, YNGirl? You are right. And that is why you can say whatever you want, because you choose anonymity. However, I'd like to believe that even if I was hiding my identity, I would still be respectful to others. As far as you telling me my point is foolish? I don't think respecting others is foolish.

Now, do you think you could ever be humble enough to admit you were wrong (or that someone else was right)?