I spent five years in, '78-'83 working on BISS, TDY at Keesler or on remote comm sites in Europe. Any Wideband people here??

I'm sure there are plenty of us here. We are Satellite and Wideband now though and most of us rarely see the wideband side.

Wow -- been a long time I saw anything regarding Wideband career field

Spent 18 years as a 304x0: TRC-97, 486L Tropo/Micorwave, BISS-SafeNest, Project Silk Purse, SAS comm sites, GLCM comm, etc.

I've worked with few 304s since I retired, traveling around the world installing, integrating and testing telecom system.

I'm a current BISS instructor down at Keesler. Of course BISS combined with TV and Imagery maintenance to for Visual Imagery and Intrusion Detection Systems (VIIDS) 2E1X4. A lot of the BISS stuff stateside and overseas is being getten rid of or outsourced so are jobs are dwindling down. That's why we're rumored to be merging with the new RF Systems career field that is being created next year by the merger of Ground Radio and Satellite Wideband. Any of you guys miss the old GSS-29? We still got some running out in the career field. They're about on their last legs though.

Was a 304x0s at Keesler for school and mtc at the school. Went to Gorramendi Sp.
the Longest mil shot to Ringsted Eng. When I started at the School the first thing thay gave me to work on was a 193X's navy radio. Short wave.. now working with equp that can handle 720 OS3's. Now I see the light. Does any one remember the mountain in Italy that the 486l shot into Germany From?

Wideband '73 to '94. Thailand to Turkey, the long way.

486L, TRC's. FRC's, 486L Tropo/LOS, BISS, 3CCG, OTEC, HF, SatCom.

Ran into some old 304X0's in TX. Most were single-termers, got out after 2nd remote. One had 4 remotes in 8 years, retrained each time he returned CONUS.

Did the jet fuel get cleaned out of the well at Izmir, TU? No smoking near running water!

quote:

Does any one remember the mountain in Italy that the 486l shot into Germany From?

If you are talking about the 248 mile Tropo shot to Schwartzwald, it was Savona. There was also a fairly long LOS shot from Cima Gallina to Zugspitze.

What kind of equipment/frequency were you using at Gorramendi (Bilbao)?

Hey Bush, how ya been. Haven't heard from you since W-P.

I in and out of Ringstead 65-68 (other end of Gormendi) The equip there was modded FRC 39 with the addition of 75 KW Amps being driven by 10Kw Eq at reduced power.120 Foot billboards. While In England I was also Stationed at the HF Transmitter site at Barford St John (10 miles west of Croughton) Later I was also at Mt Limbara(Sardinia) 69-70 and was on a special maint team that traveled through out Italy, mostly the southern Tropo sites. These were Mt Virgine, Coltano(Located on Pisa Airport) Mt Nardello ,Sigonella Sicily, Martina Franca and Brindisi. I also worked the Microwave site at Naples navy. There was also an old Big rally 2 site near Rome that I helped dismantle. Most tof the southern Italy sites were FRC-39 operating in the 900MHz freq band. There were some FRC 96 operating in the 2.4 Ghz band. The site I was most famaliar withe was Mt Limbara(Sardinia). There were three Octoginal Diversity Shots to/from this site. One to Minorica (Spain Balerica islands) one Shot to Coltano Italy (On Pisa Airport, and one shot to Mt. Virgine(located to the east of Naples).
By the way there towo paths out of Coltano. One shot was as you listed Army Tropo (Savona to Swartzwald) and the other was to Air Force Microwave ( Mt Cimone, Mt Corna, Mt Paganella, Cima Galena, to Zugspitz).

Anyone out there ever stationed in Korea with the Peace Fortune Tropo/Microwave System I was there 59-63 and 75-76. Again Special Maintenance (Scope Creek) teams. Also spent 76-82 in Japan on Scope Creek team working the Kanto Plains Microwave System (484N-B).

I have a copy of the old AFM 100-32 drawing that lists the entire European Broadband System circa 1968-69. This was acquired when I attended heavy tropo school at Keesler.
The above is probably more than you wanted to know

Bill

The shot to Ringsted England I think was 970mhz and the shot south was 740Mhz. Going through some paper work found a route map. But as cleaning up goes I have missplaced it.

I posted some drawings in the the European Broadband Photo Gallery on this site. Click on each picture or drawing and select the large drawing to read the small print. I do have some pictures of Ringstead but could not find them. I remember the UK Government required us to back our power down because of interferance we were causing to the UK Navy. Our Shot went directly over Weymouth Harbor. This shot was originally designed with a relay in France but when Charles Degaule threatened to kick NATO out of France in 1964 it was decided to make the direct 519 mile shot to Gormendi. As I remember it was 24 cannels and was proprogationed out a lot of the time.

quote:

Originally posted by jrouttusa:
Wow -- been a long time I saw anything regarding Wideband career field

Spent 18 years as a 304x0: TRC-97, 486L Tropo/Micorwave, BISS-SafeNest, Project Silk Purse, SAS comm sites, GLCM comm, etc.

I've worked with few 304s since I retired, traveling around the world installing, integrating and testing telecom system.

I've seen a couple web sites on 307 Tech Control but this is the first one I havs seen on 304's

Also Spent most of my time as a 304. Equipment was TRC-24s, TRC-97s,TRC-66,FRC-39s, Lenkurt 74A2s, GRC-66. Also worked both Silk Purse(Europe) and Blue Eagle (Far East). UK Microwave System, 486L MedCom System, Korea Peace Fortune System, Japan Microwave(484N-B) and Japan Tropo System. Was Special Maintenance team (Scope Creek Trained) for Korea,and Japan Also worked HF systems SAC Giant Talk and AFCC HFGCS. Stateside spent 4 yrs Active Duty Technical Advisor to Washington Air National Guard at Boeing Field, Seattle. 143Cmbt Comm Sq. Lived in old Nike Missle Site housing area right off I-5 in Kent Wa. Been on many mountaintops in Wash, Ore, Idaho, Utah, Nev and Calif. with TRC-97s. as 1970 to 1975. Been on Mica Peak, Ravens Roost(near Mt Ranier) Saddle Mts, Gold Mtn. in Wash.
Left USAF and worked as a Network Engineer for State of Penna. Left the state gov job two years ago. Now work as an independent consultant doing telecommunications network design.

Bill

Some interesting reading.

Satellite/Wideband - signed up in 94 a few years after the merger. Worked with a bunch of old Wideband guys who worked on the 97s.

While we don't use the 97s anymore, you still see the ole Horn Antennas kicking around to use with the TRC-170s.

We've also merged w/ Telemetry and Space Systems and I've seen the CFETP draft for the merge w/ Ground Radio coming up in a year or so.

Good stuff.

quote:

Originally posted by DHarris75:
Some interesting reading.

Satellite/Wideband - signed up in 94 a few years after the merger. Worked with a bunch of old Wideband guys who worked on the 97s.

While we don't use the 97s anymore, you still see the ole Horn Antennas kicking around to use with the TRC-170s.

We've also merged w/ Telemetry and Space Systems and I've seen the CFETP draft for the merge w/ Ground Radio coming up in a year or so.

Good stuff.

thank you,
The USAF has been merging career fields for over 40 years. The old 304X0 field originally consisted of 4 shreds A. Microwave, B. Carrier, C. VHF/UHF Radio Relay, and D. Time Division Multiple. If memory serves me correctly A and C merged and B and D merged first and a few years later they wer all merged. However having been assigned to EIS (old GEEIA) we were expected to work on all systems. During my career I installed Microwave, Satellite Systems, Heavy Ground Radio , Navaids, Radar, CATV and Security Systems. I spent time with the 3d CCG in the early 70s.TRC-97s. Was also with in the 728 Air Control Sq and Detatchments at Shaw and Myrtle Beach, that was a tough assignment. Spent some time (1970s) TDY at Hill Range and at a Communications Sites near Tremonton, Utah and Mountain Home, Id. How do you like Hill? I liked the hunting in that part of the country especially Wyoming. I was at F.E Warren for a year turning up comm systems for the Minuteman Missle Systems. Every chance I got I went hunting.
You mentioned TRC-170s there is an Air Guard Unit (271st CCS) at Ft Indiantown Gap that had twoof these set up in static display. The first sat sys I worked was the TSC-54 and MSC-46. The last was a WSC-3 (suitcase system)
I am a ham radio operator and I have an old TRC-66 dish (same size as the 97) that I have used for Ham Tropo experiements into the south east US. I also use an old Prime Star TV Dish for my 802.11g network here at home.

Good luck on your tour at Hill. Learn everything you can about every system you can. I can tell you that the broader your knowledge base definitely enhances your chances of picking what you want do after you complete your AF career.

I don't know if you looked at my photo gallery on this site. Just click on my name and select my public profile my Photos are at the bottom.
i will be posting more pictures from around the world in the near future.
Here is a good link to the history of the US Army and AF in Germany and to a lesser extent all of Europe. <www.usarmygermany.com>

Here is a link to Satellite Picture of the old Heavy Tropo site at Mt Limbara Sardinia Italy

http://local.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&cp=40.857095~9.1...t=-1000&scene=202216

May have to cut and paste the link.

Bill

Bill;
After your link I remember one. I is not so easy to get to. The link is:
http://sitna.cfnavarra.es/?lang=eng

input this link point and click the enter.
When the map comes up, first point on to Background Maps & Images.
Move pointrt down to 1:500/ Color Orthophoto and click the years 1998-2000.
this has the best contrast. Move the pointer over the Photo and watch the cord's of
43deg, 12min, 38412sec N by 1deg, 26',39392" W keeping close to that will get you at thr Tropo
Site Gorramendi. At 43deg 13' 9927"N by 1deg 27' 9948"w is Gorramendi air station, or wheere we lived. on top to the NE is a sp telcom microwave tower and farther nw was where the ac&w site was at. At the tropo site you can see the 120' dishes layout to the south of the east dish was the radio van for silk purse. Down south of the two dishes is the pad for thr radio building.
To the southe and SW of that is the pads for the 60's going to Hamosa.
I am still Looling for a Photo of Hamosa. on google earth you can see most of torrahone AFB(?sp)
Dave.

quote:

Originally posted by DavidJPhelps:
Bill;
After your link I remember one. I is not so easy to get to. The link is:
http://sitna.cfnavarra.es/?lang=eng

input this link point and click the enter.
When the map comes up, first point on to Background Maps & Images.
Move pointrt down to 1:500/ Color Orthophoto and click the years 1998-2000.
this has the best contrast. Move the pointer over the Photo and watch the cord's of
43deg, 12min, 38412sec N by 1deg, 26',39392" W keeping close to that will get you at thr Tropo
Site Gorramendi. At 43deg 13' 9927"N by 1deg 27' 9948"w is Gorramendi air station, or wheere we lived. on top to the NE is a sp telcom microwave tower and farther nw was where the ac&w site was at. At the tropo site you can see the 120' dishes layout to the south of the east dish was the radio van for silk purse. Down south of the two dishes is the pad for thr radio building.
To the southe and SW of that is the pads for the 60's going to Hamosa.
I am still Looling for a Photo of Hamosa. on google earth you can see most of torrahone AFB(?sp)
Dave.

I try to post this a second time.

My ISP went down.

I was able to get your link to work. I was to many of the 486L sites in Spain one or two times. Someone from the site always met us and took us to the site. I did not need driving instructions for those sites. This makes it difficult to locate the old sites on a map or Satellite Image. Humosa was the exception. Many of the Italian sites we were either required to drive a military vehicle of rent a car. I have two Google Earth links below the first is Humosa the second is Torrejon AB. Hiumosa was several KM east of Torrejon AB. I have pictures of Humosa and Ringstead. Some are my photos and some are USAF Photos and others I obtained from other sources. I will post them on my Photo gallery on this site when I get them scanned in to my photo folder. They were taken befor the digita era. I already have some of Mt Limbara and Majorca.

I can also send them to you if you wish.

Bill

Former Humosa Tropo Site.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=humosa++Spain&l...56,0.006647&t=h&om=1


Torrejon AB.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=base+nato+torre...01,0.078192&t=h&om=1

Bill
In 1968 or 69 there was in I think Air Force news a artical on Hiumosa it showed the 3 set of 60 footers two north and one south. I have not found it yet. From the link i gave you and google earth i have tryed to look for Hiumosa and now with this i can find it. Thanks Dave.

quote:

Originally posted by DavidJPhelps:
Bill
In 1968 or 69 there was in I think Air Force news a artical on Hiumosa it showed the 3 set of 60 footers two north and one south. I have not found it yet. From the link i gave you and google earth i have tryed to look for Hiumosa and now with this i can find it. Thanks Dave.

Dave

Here is a link for Torejon that has a couple of pictures of Humosa.
I think these pictures may have been in that atricle. I do know there was an article in Airman Magazine (Feb 1969) titled Men on Mountaintops that covered Mt. Cimone Microwave Site in Italy( Firs relay north of Coltano(Pisa) and the site at Mt Pateras (Athens)Greece. I do have a copy of this article(7 pages)

In the link below the first picture of Humosa is an Aerial shot. It is the same one I got from an Air Force Pub sometime in 1985? If memory serves me the two antennas in the background are to GorrmendiSpain. The two to the right are to Inoges, Spain (Inoges then shot to Soller then on to Menorca and then to Mt Limbara Sardinia, Italy) The two to the left in the picture were to San Ppablo, Spain. I have another picture that was taken from down the hill looking up on the Antennas. It seems that the Spanish have removed all of the antennas and in some cases the buildings. This true of Majorca.
The sites in Italy are pretty much in tact.

I worked as Telecom Engineer for the State of Pennsylvania and three of my co-workers were on 486L sites. One on Majorca, Spain 79-80 and one on Mt Vergine, Italy 1982-83 and another on Sahin Tepsi, Turkey in 1978-79.

I saw the second picture when I was at at Scott AFB some years ago. It was hanging on the wall of someones office. Not sure if this was an AFCC picture or the office workers personal photo. I have seen it somewhere else on the Internet. It appears to be taken from the north or north east with Inoges antennas on the left, Gor on the right and San Pablo in the background. There is another tower (M/W) that had a microwave shot to Torrejon and it is just visible, it is sort of behind and between the two San Pablo tropo antennas.

Thanks, Bill

http://www.torrejonairbase.com/photos.torrejonairbase.c...umbnails.php?album=1

Bill
Whenn I was at Gorramendi we had 3 groups during good trx and 1 during bad. it would drop one rx but I do nor remeber droping out for very long. We would run -60db to a -104db sig. During Oct 1969 the sig was about -80db and in about an hour went up about -60db that took out all 4 of the parametric amps we had to put 20db of pads on the recive just to get back on line tell we reset the amps. I do not rember what happend to Ringstead.\Dave

quote:

Originally posted by DavidJPhelps:
Bill
Whenn I was at Gorramendi we had 3 groups during good trx and 1 during bad. it would drop one rx but I do nor remeber droping out for very long. We would run -60db to a -104db sig. During Oct 1969 the sig was about -80db and in about an hour went up about -60db that took out all 4 of the parametric amps we had to put 20db of pads on the recive just to get back on line tell we reset the amps. I do not rember what happend to Ringstead.\Dave

Dave,

When I was at Rinstead in 1966/67 we only had 2 groups going south, one was a through group from Hillington and the other was a througroup from Croughton. Both were translated at Ringstead. Somewhere around here I have the old mux charts for most of Europe.
In many cases where I was TDY at various sites in Europe I was able to take pictures. The UK was never a problem and neither was Italy or Turkey. However, Spain, Germany, and Greece were a different story. Most of the sites in Spain were shared with Spanish Military (joint AC&W sites). Like Gorrmendi, Inoges, San Pablo, Soller and Minorca all posted strong warnings against photography. so except for Torrejon, Humosa, Moron, and Zaragoza, where USAF only I have no pictures of the other sites. I guess if you were stationed at these sites it was possible to take photographs. The reason I say this is that there are other web sites that cover AC&W Site both in the US and overseas that contain photographs of sites in Spain.

You know, to me, the two 120 foot billboards didn't seem to look as large in the mountians of Spain as they did on the sea coast of England.

If you are interested in AC&W the <www.radar.com> site is the best I have seen. It is mostly for sites in the US. I spent some time on some of these sites but not in wideband. I was in ground Radio at that time. In fact some of my time in Spain and Italy was upgrading UHF A/G radios (GRT-3's/GRR-7's) co-located on the 486-L sites. When you were at Gorrmendi did you still have the SAC Green Pine UHF Air/Ground and 16th AF Fuller Control UHF Air/Ground equipment. I know they were co-located at the 486L site in early 1968 but were to be moved to the AC&W site. Before you sent me the Spanish web site to locate Gor I was able to find the site on Google Earth but the resolution did not indicate any detail. A friend of mine that was in the UK from 1970 to 1974 told that the Ringstead Link was taken down sometime in the early 70's, the link to Humosa supposedly remained up to support the Radar site and Silk Purse. I do know one group went from Gor to Humosa and another group went from Gor to Mt. Limbara Italy. Thats in addition to the 2 through groups from the UK. I do not remember the RSL performance that was experienced at Ringstead other than in the winter it seemed to be in and out a lot. At Minorca, Coltano, and Mt Limbara we could watch the Strip chart recorders on the receivers and track a weather front moving across the Med. this was especially true in the Spring and Fall. It could go in and out of threshold extension in a matter of minutes. Our threshold extension permitted levels to go below -108db on down to
-120db. I don't remember having to pad the paramet down due to signal level conditions. In fact I remember in one instance the US Army was running Coltano did not understand the purpose of the Klystron Carrages and the spare. They had both of their primary and their spares fail (to Mt Limbara)due to collant leaks in the hoses. I actually went TDY there and got the link back up on the 15 Watt Amplifier Drivers. Fortunately it was in the middle of the summer (best tropo medium) and was able to find spare hoses to fix one Klystron carrage and get them back up to full power. We had to send two of their bad Klystrons to Tinker AFB for repair. There were no spares in the AF supply chain. At $33,000.00 a copy the AF only purchased a limited number of spares. If I rmember Gorrmendi was somewhere around 3000 to 4000 feet above sea level?? I went to Tolouse France in the mid 1990s and when we left France we flew south of San Sebatian over the part of Spain wher Gor is located but I am not sure of the exact path we took, I did however look out the window to see what I could, but at 15,000 feet it is hard to see something on the ground.
I have been into Pisa and Rome in the last 10 Years and both flights from the west go right over Sardinia. it is apparently a major jet airway from the west.

It's kind of funny I worked on FRC 39's and 56's for almost three years 65-68 before I was sent to the school at Keesler. I actually didn't go TDY to school until early 1969.

If you were at Gorrmendi in 1969 did you know John Kuba?? I worked several projects with him in Spain and Italy. Somewhere I have a picture of him digging his Siat out of a snow drift.


Bill

I too am an old school 304X0!

I was at Los Santos Dela Humosa from Jan 87-Jan 89. I was on leave the day they bombed the site! Spent the next six years at Yokota when they merged us. Stayed wideband at Andersen and then I went to the 1st Combat Comm (my first SATCOM job). I then went to Misawa and maintained the antenna farm up on The Hill.

I am currently playing with AFSOC trying to figure out how they are going to deploy the MQ-1 Predators!

Here is something for you history nuts.

Do you remember the UCC-4 multiplexer that they used in Jones Hall to teach us FDM?

Well Misawa still has the satellite antenna that multiplexer system was designed for! It was built in 1964 and is still running!