I've always thought it was funny that many of those people most opposed to allowing gays to serve have never served themselves, and have no idea what they are talking about.

It's also very disturbing that the services are allowing enlistments into basic training of 40 year olds, low-IQ high school drop-outs, convicted criminals, and the mentally ill...but no gays! It's insanity.

I've served in OEF and OIF with gays, and have some in my MEB...they are great Marines and the only problems have come from some immature rednecks that were anti-gay. The anti-gay people are the REAL cause of the trouble, and they need to be the ones that are booted out.

If you can't adjust to the people you serve with, then you are not the kind of person that should be in combat.

I'm hopeful our next president will stop the insanity.

I applaud your courage to speak out, and am glad that you have chosen to do so. Your views are synonymous with nearly 80% of Americans who believe that gays and lesbians should be able to serve. Thanks.

DevilDawg1981, please join our discussion in the thread "The End of Don't Ask, Don't Tell is near." Your comments from the perspective of an active duty Marine would be welcome -- and an eye-opener for some of the folks in that thread.

quote:

Originally posted by DevilDawg1981:
I've always thought it was funny that many of those people most opposed to allowing gays to serve have never served themselves, and have no idea what they are talking about.

It's also very disturbing that the services are allowing enlistments into basic training of 40 year olds, low-IQ high school drop-outs, convicted criminals, and the mentally ill...but no gays! It's insanity.

I've served in OEF and OIF with gays, and have some in my MEB...they are great Marines and the only problems have come from some immature rednecks that were anti-gay. The anti-gay people are the REAL cause of the trouble, and they need to be the ones that are booted out.

If you can't adjust to the people you serve with, then you are not the kind of person that should be in combat.

I'm hopeful our next president will stop the insanity.

quote:

Originally posted by DevilDawg1981:
I've always thought it was funny that many of those people most opposed to allowing gays to serve have never served themselves, and have no idea what they are talking about.

It's also very disturbing that the services are allowing enlistments into basic training of 40 year olds, low-IQ high school drop-outs, convicted criminals, and the mentally ill...but no gays! It's insanity.

I've served in OEF and OIF with gays, and have some in my MEB...they are great Marines and the only problems have come from some immature rednecks that were anti-gay. The anti-gay people are the REAL cause of the trouble, and they need to be the ones that are booted out.

If you can't adjust to the people you serve with, then you are not the kind of person that should be in combat.

I'm hopeful our next president will stop the insanity.

So tell me just what is the legal steps to "stop the insanity" as you put it?

Seems like from 1993 that something could have been done in Clinton's second term.

One minor correction:

quote:

Originally posted by DevilDawg1981:
It's also very disturbing that the services are allowing enlistments into basic training of 40 42 year olds...

That, of course, doesn't invalidate your point in any way - I just find it amusing that people can now join at the same age I was when I retired.

quote:

Originally posted by dupontgaf:
DevilDawg1981, please join our discussion in the thread "The End of Don't Ask, Don't Tell is near." Your comments from the perspective of an active duty Marine would be welcome -- and an eye-opener for some of the folks in that thread.

He's pretty dang bigoted himself on some of his analogies of people he considers anti-gay: very religious, old, never served in uniform, not well educated, back country redneck, stay at home moms. Especially on the last one! What the fudge!? Since when did being a mom, who takes care of her children and feels there is value, without much thanks, in doing the hardest job on earth, get included with the other things?

Talk about being puffed up and condescending.

quote:

Originally posted by klassylady25:

quote:

Originally posted by dupontgaf:
DevilDawg1981, please join our discussion in the thread "The End of Don't Ask, Don't Tell is near." Your comments from the perspective of an active duty Marine would be welcome -- and an eye-opener for some of the folks in that thread.

He's pretty dang bigoted himself on some of his analogies of people he considers anti-gay: very religious, old, never served in uniform, not well educated, back country redneck, stay at home moms. Especially on the last one! What the fudge!? Since when did being a mom, who takes care of her children and feels there is value, without much thanks, in doing the hardest job on earth, get included with the other things?

Talk about being puffed up and condescending.

Huh????? Sorry, but I don't see what you're referring to.

quote:

Originally posted by DevilDawg1981:
I've always thought it was funny that many of those people most opposed to allowing gays to serve have never served themselves, and have no idea what they are talking about.

It's also very disturbing that the services are allowing enlistments into basic training of 40 year olds, low-IQ high school drop-outs, convicted criminals, and the mentally ill...but no gays! It's insanity.

I've served in OEF and OIF with gays, and have some in my MEB...they are great Marines and the only problems have come from some immature rednecks that were anti-gay. The anti-gay people are the REAL cause of the trouble, and they need to be the ones that are booted out.

If you can't adjust to the people you serve with, then you are not the kind of person that should be in combat.

I'm hopeful our next president will stop the insanity.

quote:

Originally posted by DaleU:

quote:

Originally posted by klassylady25:

quote:

Originally posted by dupontgaf:
DevilDawg1981, please join our discussion in the thread "The End of Don't Ask, Don't Tell is near." Your comments from the perspective of an active duty Marine would be welcome -- and an eye-opener for some of the folks in that thread.

He's pretty dang bigoted himself on some of his analogies of people he considers anti-gay: very religious, old, never served in uniform, not well educated, back country redneck, stay at home moms. Especially on the last one! What the fudge!? Since when did being a mom, who takes care of her children and feels there is value, without much thanks, in doing the hardest job on earth, get included with the other things?

Talk about being puffed up and condescending.

Huh????? Sorry, but I don't see what you're referring to.

quote:

Originally posted by DevilDawg1981:
I've always thought it was funny that many of those people most opposed to allowing gays to serve have never served themselves, and have no idea what they are talking about.

It's also very disturbing that the services are allowing enlistments into basic training of 40 year olds, low-IQ high school drop-outs, convicted criminals, and the mentally ill...but no gays! It's insanity.

I've served in OEF and OIF with gays, and have some in my MEB...they are great Marines and the only problems have come from some immature rednecks that were anti-gay. The anti-gay people are the REAL cause of the trouble, and they need to be the ones that are booted out.

If you can't adjust to the people you serve with, then you are not the kind of person that should be in combat.

I'm hopeful our next president will stop the insanity.

AND this one: He posted a threaded titled: The anti-gay people]
-------------------------------------------
This post is not meant to be personal.

So far, after reading many of the threads on this forum, I've noticed that most of the anti-gay people appear to fall into one of several categories: very religious, old, never served in uniform, not well educated, etc.

So, why would it make sense to keep a policy in place that is obviously wrong, just to satisfy the lower rungs of society? In other words, just because some back country redneck stay at home mom doesn't like gays, we all know that thinking people and those that actually are serving their country know better - much better.

Gays are not a threat to morale or discipline. Closed minded, ignorant, insecure dead-enders are.

Dealing in stereotypes is never a good thing, IMHO.

But stereotype images of gays and lesbians are exactly what led to the DADT law. The gay pride parade image of gay people is what Congress and DoD thought would happen in the military. They apparently never stopped to think that the extremes of behavior when someone is in a party mood is not germane to what someone does in their professional life. And so you had this fear that pride parade behavior would be detrimental to unit morale, unit cohesion and combat readiness -- and it probably would be -- except that's not what gay military people are about, what they want, or what they advocate for.

Gays and lesbians in the military are indistinguishable from their straight counterparts, no more prone to misconduct than are their straight counterparts. But they bleed the same and die the same while doing the same mission, and they join the military for exactly the same reasons as their straight counterparts.

So KlassyLady25, good for you for standing up for stay at home moms. Now how about standing up for the rights of gays and lesbians to serve their country under the same rules and regulations as everyone else.

dupont, I've done that several times in our discussions but I'm not going to change my tune about DADT, as long as it's in place - obey it - it's that simple; Don't Ask, Don't Tell. When it's repealed and I've said over and over that it will be. Then things will change.

Until then I'll be a stay at home gramma, that works of photo restorations of soldiers of days gone by and try to learn my ABCs so that I can communicate well with others.

www.flickr.com/clearimage

KlassyLady25, cool photos. I love looking at old photographs --it's particularly nice that you are working to restore and preserve them. Good job.

quote:

Originally posted by dupontgaf:
KlassyLady25, cool photos. I love looking at old photographs --it's particularly nice that you are working to restore and preserve them. Good job.

Thanks and dupont, we've had so many conversations, please call me Candice.

Candice,

Nice to meet you - I'm Mike.

quote:

Originally posted by dupontgaf:
But stereotype images of gays and lesbians are exactly what led to the DADT law. The gay pride parade image of gay people is what Congress and DoD thought would happen in the military. They apparently never stopped to think that the extremes of behavior when someone is in a party mood is not germane to what someone does in their professional life. And so you had this fear that pride parade behavior would be detrimental to unit morale, unit cohesion and combat readiness -- and it probably would be -- except that's not what gay military people are about, what they want, or what they advocate for.

Exactly. This is what I try to get across to people. Repealing DADT isn't about running around your post half naked, wearing a pink boa, waving rainbow flags in people's faces, and demanding that they listen to and enjoy explicit details about your sexual encounters.

It's about not discharging people for making non-threatening statements that arise during the natural flow of day-to-day conversation, or for having off post relationships with someone of their desired gender.

But, I digress.

You don't digress at all, parapsycho, you are RIGHT ON THE MONEY!

Marines, soldiers, etc that cannot deal respectfully with others in their unit should be discharged as a threat to unit integrity. This includes religious zealots in all ranks and positions.

I whole-heartedly reject any law that is unethical or a violation of basic freedoms or fair expectation of said freedoms, and I conduct myself accordingly each and every day.

Until we rid ourselves of religious zealots, fanatics and nutcases in political office, we will be forced to actively rebel.