|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||||||||||
Military.com Forums Hot Topics & Current Events Gay/Lesbian Issues in the Military DA/DT allows heterosexual males to get away with rape|
Go
|
New
|
Find
|
Notify
|
Tools
|
Reply
|
|
|
Member |
I have been told that this story needed its own thread so I have reluctantly decided to start one. I have been relaying my story in other DA/DT threads so I apologize if you have already read about it. However, here is one big reason that DA/DT is a miserable failure. While I was on active duty in the Army I was very careful not to engage in any activities on post that would raise the suspicion about my being a lesbian. I even went so far as to not date anyone for my first enlistment. Man, that was a lonely time! I eventually started going out to lesbian clubs to meet like minded military women. One night as I exited the club and waited for my taxi back to post, a car pulled up along side me. Four soldiers that I recognized from my post were inside. The two closest to me jumped out and attacked me. I wish I hadn't been so intoxicated, because I really was not in a position to protect myself. However, it is what it is, and they wrestled me into the car and took off. While we drove out to a secluded, wooded area in the country, the men inside taunted me about 'learning how to be a real woman.' They forced me out of the car and onto the trunk. They beat me on my torso where the bruises would not be visible, all the while calling me very sick names for a lesbian that I'm sure you understand would be ***'d out if I wrote them. I was forced to perform oral sex on all four of them, and was raped in every orafice, repeatedly. One of them nearly cut off my nipple with a knife. All to "cure" me of my lesbianism. You see, they knew I couldn't report them because to do so, I would have to break the DA/DT rules and be subject to discharge. I endured five hours of rape and torture. In the end, I went to a nurse I knew was also a lesbian and even tho she thought I should go to the hospital, she understood why I couldn't and she helped me by cleaning and stitching up my wounds, and suggesting that I find a way to obtain some antibiotics as human bites are the worst for getting infected (I had several bites that drew blood on both my breasts). I never turned them in, but it took nearly 10 years of counseling to get over my PTSD from this vicious attack. If DA/DT were repealed, and lesbians didn't have to worry about losing their jobs, they would be able to report these types of attacks. Heterosexual preditors would no longer be able to get away with rape!
|
||
|
|
- Member |
FYI: Rape is/was not an issue with which DADT was designed to deal. Rape is an assault issue to be delt with by JAG and the UCMJ.
|
|||
|
|
Member |
Exactly. DA/DT was not designed to "deal with it" but it HAS created an atmosphere where rapes of lesbians are encouraged by the simple fact that most will NEVER be reported due to the REALISTIC FEAR of DISCHARGE of the lesbian from the DA/DT regs! Heterosexual preditors are WELL AWARE of the regs, and use them to their advantage. Just because it was not an intent of DA/DT, does not dismiss the fact that it happens as a result of the regs. FYI: If DA/DT were abolished and homosexuals were allowed to serve without fear of being discharged simply because of who they are, then when heterosexual males rape lesbians, they would feel free to prosecute, thus ending the "easy pickins." I see you still have no condemnation for the heterosexual rapists. How telling... |
|||
|
|
- Member |
Careful; your paranoia is showing. JAG investigations of rape allegations do NOT involve seeking the victim's orientation. |
|||
|
|
Member |
I never said that JAG investigations did. You said that, not me. However, being kidnapped out of the parking lot of a known lesbian bar DOES. How can someone report that without "outting" themselves? Hm? *That* is the reason that most rapes against lesbians are not reported. The circumstances around the abduction would lead to discharge from violation of DA/DT. You know, for supposedly being female, you don't show too much compassion for rape victims. Why is that? |
|||
|
|
Member  |
Thank you for starting this thread. I'm not sure I understand your reluctance to do so as to my mind it brings your situation where it can be discussed with no distractions. I do see your problem with DADT but going back to how it was before DADT would be, if anything, worse. When DADT was implemented, it was thought to be, no matter how wrongly, something to make it easier for the G/L military population. since DADT isn't working and there is no going back to the old way I think the powers that be are being forced to look at simply accepting G/L people into the military. |
|||
|
|
Member |
21194237, I think you kind of miss the point of view from a lesbian victim. If the crime is reported during the investigation the attackers are most likely going to give their reasons why if they admit to the crime. Once that happens even though the victim does not tell there is a good chance that another investigation as to if the victim is actually a lesbian, and possible discharge. So then do to no fault of her own being outed and prosecuted under DADT. It is not how it was intended but that is the fear of the victim.
This is not always the course of things but after such a trauma such a mindset will have a detrimental effect on the victim making it even worse. There is no simple solution for this but it does need to be solved. |
|||
|
|
Member |
I think it's not that some might miss the point as much as they refuse to to look at it in it's proper context. Some people will simply ignore the reality of a situation because their vision is clouded by their bigotry. |
|||
|
|
Member |
Yes, you see the problem exactly correct. I have a hard time remaining objective and taking myself out of this situation in order to discuss it objectively. Thank you for explaining it so well. |
|||
|
|
Member |
I agree whole-heartedly! That was my point in the other thread. Thanks for pointing it out in this one! |
|||
|
|
- Member |
I have no shortage of compassion for victims of assault, regardless of orientation. Can't say the same for some of the folks around here though. IF....your story is accurate, you have my sympathies; HOWEVER, your story is no MORE credible than Steve's, and HE has been subjected to undue scrutiny while you've not. Why does ya reckon that is? BTW....just so you'll know, some of my hetero female friends patronize "lesbian" bars too simply because they prefer to not be hit on by men. As one who claims to be patron of such establishments....how come ya didn't know that? It's common knowledge among females who do. |
|||
|
|
- Member |
Reckon that Steve has a hard time remaining objective, too? Ought we give him the same leeway, rather than psycoanalysis? |
|||
|
|
Member |
Do you honestly think a CID investigation is going to conclude that "this woman simply went to a lesbian bar because she didn't want to be hit on by guys" and NOT discharge me? Please. You should know by now that it is guilty by association 99.9% of the time! As for knowing straights who do this. I've known a few, but not very many. I've known cool heterosexual people who just want to party and have fun. However, most women who frequent lesbian bars are...well...lesbian or bi. This would make a very weak defense to present to CID. |
|||
|
|
Member |
Please point me to ONE SINGLE POST OF MINE where I HAVE PSYCHOANALIZED Steve. It doesn't exist! I don't pretend to know what Steve feels or thinks. I can however tell this man is in obvious pain. I've been there. I have compassionately suggested counseling which is in NO WAY a marker of failure like you want to make it seem. What is obvious is that Steve is trying to hold ALL homosexuals accountable for the actions of ONE. I do NOT hold ALL heterosexual males accountable for the actions of my FOUR attackers. Now that we have addressed your deflections one more time, how about answering my question for a change? That would really be helpful for me to understand your point of view. Other than the sexual orientation of the attackers, what is the difference in what Steve endured, and what I endured? Why is it ok for Steve to call ALL homosexuals child molesters who are not worthy of any type of existance, let alone serving our country? You are defending his position, so explain to me why that line of thinking is ok, but because of what I endured it is not equally ok to assume that ALL heterosexual men are preditors and thus unfit to serve in the military? What is the difference? |
|||
|
|
Member |
The differences I notice are that Steve blames everyone of a group for the actions of a few, typical for victims of a heinous crime initially. Some of that may always be carried for their entire life, but rationally they know it was the individuals that are the cause not the group. Badbard has at least gotten to this point. Many times it requires years of therapy, this is why we all suggest Steve gets it.
Second Badbard gives some detail as to her struggle to become 'normal' again after. Steve seems content to be bigoted towards any homosexuals because of one person. Last, we know something about Badbard's attackers, 4 of them, they where straight, and did it to turn her straight. Steve just says he was abused by a man. If I had to guess I would probably say a demented married guy, or some sick in the closet freak who wanted the control. So there is a great deal of difference between the stories, maybe not so much the events but what was relayed to us. And Steve's post is more content of an attack on gays than letting us know why he feels that way. |
|||
|
|
Experienced Member |
My comments are in red...and I really couldn't continue any further with the dissection of the post. It would be repetitive. I don't buy it at all. I think it's an insult to anyone out there who truly suffered through a rape -- regardless of their orientation. DADT has NOTHING to do with 'heterosexual preditors getting away with rape'. JIF |
|||
|
|
Member |
What is so hard to believe about me not dating anyone for my initial 2 year enlistment? I originally signed up for a 2 + 2, but re-upped instead of spending the "+ 2" in the reserves. What, you don't think someone can go without a date for 2 years? Especially when you are worried about your career? But it IS lonely. As far as keeping it off post, the whole problem is that humans *do* need companionship, and after the first lonely 2 year hitch, I *did* start dating. I kept it off post! What is so difficult about that to understand? IF you don't believe what happened to me, that is your perogative, but it DID happen, and I DO go to counseling thru the VA for this attack. DA/DT DOES allow heterosexual male preditors to get away with rape because most lesbians are too afraid of being found out and discharged to report it, and the sick *******s who do this know it...they COUNT on it! IF you don't believe me, contact any VA Hospital and ask them the statistics of rape in the military and then ask about lesbians being raped. It will blow your mind... |
|||
|
Member |
I personally find it easy to believe someone did not date for their initial enlistment or even a longer period of time.
Why? Because I didn't maintain a girlfriend from 2002 to 2007 which was while I was in the navy. I will confess to a few one night stands, but I didn't date, and to my recollection I had eight one night stands, and one relationship with a female friend that was a drinking buddy, we hooked up once, the day I was discharged. Now, I shall move on to the bar type/location discussion. I went to gay bars while I was in the navy, not because I am gay but because there were hot females that didn't want to be hit on by lecherous males like myself. you go there, you have a good time, and sometimes you get lucky. Gay bars also have the best bartenders. My LPO(leading petty officer, think someone along the lines of a platoon sgt for you non-navy types) went with me to a gay bar twice after he heard I had been at one. No investigation, just a pair of friends out for a good time. I was never threatened with action under DADT. That does not mean it cannot happen. It means you have to have a witness you can count on to cover your six if asked. In tht respect I can understand why a lesbian would be concerned about bringing rape charges against someone if they were abducted from or assaulted at a lesbian bar. Which is unfortunate as that should not be the case. Now I was a squid and a submariner to boot, so I am sure we have a bit differant outlook than the surface fleet, and the other services as well, but on my boot, location was not treated as a reason for an investigation under DADT. All this being said, I will stand by my position in other threads that relate to DADT, the THEORY is fine, but the APPLICATION is fatally flawed. |
|||
|
|
Experienced Member |
How do you get counseling through the VA for this? Yes, I'm aware that counseling is available for events which are documented in a member's medical history. However, by your own admission, yours was never investigated, and you were aided by some anonymous nurse vs. a military facility. Hmm. JIF |
|||
|
|
Member |
Why don't you do some research? It is simple enough. Every year at the women's "health" exam, you are given a form that asks specific questions about sexual assaults during your enlistment. My body still bears the scars from that attack. I finally could stand the silence no longer, and since I didn't have to fear being "fired" from my job any longer, I told my women's health doctor. That doctor provided me with a mental health referral. I went to see mental health. They evaluated me, and put me into a group therapy with other women who had been raped or sexually assaulted in the military. The therapist's eval was sent up the VA chain. If the VA felt that I was lying, they would not provide care. The scars I have on my body, that were not there when I enlisted, but there when I was discharged, along with the scars I carried on the inside were the proof. You don't need to believe me for it to be true. I know the truth. I've lived it. I survived, and I'm getting better all the time. I don't blame ALL heterosexual men for what happened to me that night. I DO understand from what I went through, and from listening to what other women (lesbians included in the group) went through to know that the DA/DT regs was the number one reason that most lesbians did not report the crime. You may find it hard to believe, but that onus is on you. Whatever helps you sleep at night. Sexual assault in the military is rampant, and the vast majority of perpetrators are heterosexual males who prey on those whom they know will remain silent to save their careers. |
|||
|
| Powered by Social Strata | Page 1 2 3 4 5 |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
Military.com Forums Hot Topics & Current Events Gay/Lesbian Issues in the Military DA/DT allows heterosexual males to get away with rape
