RE: http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,173798,00.html

The VA leadership is dead wrong on this voter drive issue; & the CinC needs to countermand this VA decision immediately, as it is a totally unAmerican action. Every military person, in or out of a VA facility, has the unmitigated right to vote, & be signed up for it as he or she chooses to....

Like many government agencies, the VA has idiots who have no idea what "Real Life" means.
Too bad we can't vote out the "Leadership" of the VA!!!

quote:

Originally posted by 8950331:
RE: http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,173798,00.html

The VA leadership is dead wrong on this voter drive issue; & the CinC needs to countermand this VA decision immediately, as it is a totally unAmerican action. Every military person, in or out of a VA facility, has the unmitigated right to vote, & be signed up for it as he or she chooses to....

I totally agree with you, however I would change the wording of the last sentence.

"Every military person, in or out of a VA facility, has the unmitigated right (and duty) to vote, & be signed up for it as he or she chooses to....[/"

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Frisco

quote:

Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Frisco

Very true, yet look at the apathy of citizens with the poor turn out at elections.

Here is a bit more balanced and well researched series of articles from VA Watchdog ... that comes to the same conclusion but without the misrepresentations ... in other words, a non-partisan approach to the topic.

http://www.vawatchdog.org/08/nf08/nfAUG08/nf081308-1.htm

quote:

Originally posted by 67NOV:

quote:

Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Frisco

Very true, yet look at the apathy of citizens with the poor turn out at elections.

I know, in some countries it is actually a crime not to vote, I am beginning to wonder if we should not make it so here.

Frisco

quote:

Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

quote:

Originally posted by 67NOV:

quote:

Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Frisco

Very true, yet look at the apathy of citizens with the poor turn out at elections.

I know, in some countries it is actually a crime not to vote, I am beginning to wonder if we should not make it so here.

Frisco

but then that would go against everything America is about... if one dosent want to vote one dosent have to....

[QUOTE]Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Sorry but I have to disagree. IMO, elections for POTUS are mere sham events. I sincerely believe that the POTUS is selected far in advance by the elitist oligarchs who run this country. Americans just participate in the illusion of choosing the next POTUS. That's why John McCain has a genuine chance of becoming President. I've said it before on this forum, and I say it again - Joseph Stalin was correct when he stated that "Those who cast the ballot decide nothing, those who count the ballot decide everything". BTW, I don't vote so it's immaterial to me whether Twiddle-dee or Twiddle-dum becomes President.

quote:

Originally posted by Misanthrope2:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Sorry but I have to disagree. IMO, elections for POTUS are mere sham events. I sincerely believe that the POTUS is selected far in advance by the elitist oligarchs who run this country. Americans just participate in the illusion of choosing the next POTUS. That's why John McCain has a genuine chance of becoming President. I've said it before on this forum, and I say it again - Joseph Stalin was correct when he stated that "Those who cast the ballot decide nothing, those who count the ballot decide everything". BTW, I don't vote so it's immaterial to me whether Twiddle-dee or Twiddle-dum becomes President.

In a way you and I are not that far apart in belief. We the voters have not had a voice in our government for some time. I believe their is only two ways to resolve that problem, by the vote and forcing the issue by ramming our choices down the political Aristocracies throat or revolution.

I am not yet ready to say that revolution is our only choice, however I am close to believing that.

Maybe the words to the song Silent Running by Mike and Mechanics are closer to the truth than we thought:

"Swear allegiance to the flag
Whatever flag they offer
Never hint at what you really feel
Teach the children quietly
For some day sons and daughters
Will rise up and fight while we stood still."

We can either take back control of our nation through the vote and or civil disobedience or in the same manner as the Founding Fathers established it in the first place.

I prefer the first choice.

Frisco

quote:

Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

quote:

Originally posted by Misanthrope2:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Sorry but I have to disagree. IMO, elections for POTUS are mere sham events. I sincerely believe that the POTUS is selected far in advance by the elitist oligarchs who run this country. Americans just participate in the illusion of choosing the next POTUS. That's why John McCain has a genuine chance of becoming President. I've said it before on this forum, and I say it again - Joseph Stalin was correct when he stated that "Those who cast the ballot decide nothing, those who count the ballot decide everything". BTW, I don't vote so it's immaterial to me whether Twiddle-dee or Twiddle-dum becomes President.

In a way you and I are not that far apart in belief. We the voters have not had a voice in our government for some time. I believe their is only two ways to resolve that problem, by the vote and forcing the issue by ramming our choices down the political Aristocracies throat or revolution.

I am not yet ready to say that revolution is our only choice, however I am close to believing that.

Maybe the words to the song Silent Running by Mike and Mechanics are closer to the truth than we thought:

"Swear allegiance to the flag
Whatever flag they offer
Never hint at what you really feel
Teach the children quietly
For some day sons and daughters
Will rise up and fight while we stood still."

We can either take back control of our nation through the vote and or civil disobedience or in the same manner as the Founding Fathers established it in the first place.

I prefer the first choice.

Frisco

Frisco: I too believe that you and I are close in our beliefs. You are an experienced, well-informed person with a wonderful ability at expressing yourself. I admire the way you stand up for your beliefs.

quote:

Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

quote:

Originally posted by 8950331:
RE: http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,173798,00.html

The VA leadership is dead wrong on this voter drive issue; & the CinC needs to countermand this VA decision immediately, as it is a totally unAmerican action. Every military person, in or out of a VA facility, has the unmitigated right to vote, & be signed up for it as he or she chooses to....

I totally agree with you, however I would change the wording of the last sentence.

"Every military person, in or out of a VA facility, has the unmitigated right (and duty) to vote, & be signed up for it as he or she chooses to....[/"

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Frisco

FriscoLady01...I would aver to you that every American Citizen should make it his or her duty to exercise their Constitutional right to stand up & cast their votes in any election that they are eligible to in this Country. However, to exercise this personal right, or not to, is still a matter of personal choice whether right or wrong. I know your frustration as I see most terrible apathy in my state of Massachusetts, locally & on the state level. Whenever someone complains to me about corrupt &/or complacent politicians or public employees, or complain about the ever increasing taxes; I first ask them if they voted for them, or voted at all. If they say they voted for them (proposition 2 1/2 tax overrides in our state), or neglected to vote at all; then I unflinchingly tell them that they have no reasonable grounds for complaint at all....

8950331,

You know it is really odd for Outlaw and I to agree on something but I also agree with him, it is un-American to even suggest that not-voting be made a crime.

And you are correct as well, it is my frustration in that I see people throw away what so many over the generations have fought and died for.

For reasons that I have stated before in these forums I am no longer eligible to vote. Yet of all the rights that I wish I could regain - that is the one right I want the most.

So for me there is double frustration and as you said you do, we can only tell them so many times that they have no right to complain.

I for one as a Naturalized Citizen who came to this country at the age of 11 with the dreams of a great and wonderful nation, who later in life screwed up and lost her privilege of helping guide the nation that Welcomed my family and I by openning it's wonderful heart to us - well I get angry at those that just throw away as not important to them what my parents fought so hard to give their children by coming here!

And I am doubly angry at myself for doing the same thing, the only consolation I have is that it was not apathy that caused my loss.

For if you love your country you must help guide her and I will always love the country that adopted my family and I and gave us a home.

Frisco

quote:

Originally posted by Misanthrope2:

quote:

Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

quote:

Originally posted by Misanthrope2:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by FriscoLady01:

However, as a duty it is the duty of ALL citizens to vote.

Sorry but I have to disagree. IMO, elections for POTUS are mere sham events. I sincerely believe that the POTUS is selected far in advance by the elitist oligarchs who run this country. Americans just participate in the illusion of choosing the next POTUS. That's why John McCain has a genuine chance of becoming President. I've said it before on this forum, and I say it again - Joseph Stalin was correct when he stated that "Those who cast the ballot decide nothing, those who count the ballot decide everything". BTW, I don't vote so it's immaterial to me whether Twiddle-dee or Twiddle-dum becomes President.

In a way you and I are not that far apart in belief. We the voters have not had a voice in our government for some time. I believe their is only two ways to resolve that problem, by the vote and forcing the issue by ramming our choices down the political Aristocracies throat or revolution.

I am not yet ready to say that revolution is our only choice, however I am close to believing that.

Maybe the words to the song Silent Running by Mike and Mechanics are closer to the truth than we thought:

"Swear allegiance to the flag
Whatever flag they offer
Never hint at what you really feel
Teach the children quietly
For some day sons and daughters
Will rise up and fight while we stood still."

We can either take back control of our nation through the vote and or civil disobedience or in the same manner as the Founding Fathers established it in the first place.

I prefer the first choice.

Frisco

Frisco: I too believe that you and I are close in our beliefs. You are an experienced, well-informed person with a wonderful ability at expressing yourself. I admire the way you stand up for your beliefs.

Thank you, I am at a loss for words, except that I am honored.

Frisco

Unfortunately, we have an uninformed electorate and most are myopic about what political event to vote in.

The majority of your tax dollars are spent at the local level, by the city, county and state. Here in Florida, up to 25% of property tax goes for local schools. Yes, the school board is usually composed of staid ol geeks and geezers, unless you live around here, and the agenda is dry and oft times stale. But, they spend a huge amount of money. A voter has much more control over the politicians at the local level; however, most bypass the local elections and only vote in the national "biggie" event.

Although passing laws insisting all eligible voters vote is anathema to me, surely there must be something to get the people interested in their future, for that is what it is; not who wins the big game, or who can dance, or who can make the biggest fool of themselves on some so called “reality“show”.

I have said this on more than one occasion; Get involved in local politics. Every level has volunteer positions that do make a difference. Most are unpaid positions, but can influence how your community looks and grows.

As the old saw states; You are either part of the problem or part of the solution! Become part of the solution and quite your whining about how the politicians are screwing things up.

I voted early. And I don’t mind telling everyone that I voted for Joe Redner, the King of the Lap Dance here in Tampa. He is not beholding to anyone and knows the laws inside out; several hundred arrests and only one conviction. He also knows the local code laws better than any politician. I have meet him, and find him to be more honest than most professional politicians.

GET OUT AND VOTE!

If after the November elections you see both houses of Congress growing more and more "Democrat", and the White House changes hands to a Democrat as well? Then you will know that our right to vote has been excersized by a clear majority of the voters, and that they have made it absolutely-clear they want things to change.

If, on the other hand you do NOT see a major change, then the views expressed on this page will seem to be true, and there really is apathy and a lack of interest in participation in our government, and that may well indicate our final decline as a nation.

If the same thing happens - only it is Republicans the people choose to run our government? Then fine. I only want to see most of those who can vote, TO vote.

I am hopeful... But we shall see.