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An Historic Vote
http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,167351,00.html It is about time. You guys might want to know that Paul has been pushing this Bill since his organization began, that nobody has fought for it nor lobbied for it as much as he has, and we should all be thanking him. The only thing that still surprises me about this bill is that John McCain is NOT on-board... and that should make him the LAST vote you consider in the fall, if you really are a Veteran. Why he ever boxed himself in on this thing evades logic, and indicates just how smart he really is. "I support the troops"... don't EVER believe him when he says that, ever again. |
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Experienced Member |
April 10th news spoke of Senate McCain backing the new GI bill. There is a difference on some of the admendments. Specifically, Senator from Virgina propose large increases in education while many think its too much and will lure seasoned troops from the corps earlier than in the past. Your opinion is wrong.
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Experienced Member |
I'm about to whup it out and wee-wee all in the holy water: From what I've read The new bill seems too generous.. not because it lures people out of the service too early, 'magine the amount of the GI BIll would be way down the soldier's list of pros and cons for re-upping or not.. but the total cost of the most expensive college in state? c'mon.. you know there are other sources of tuition assistance out there.. having to put all the pieces together rather than having a full ride is part of an essential deprogramming out of the military and into private sector....
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Highly Experienced Member Ex-Moderator, Fired For Cause |
TOO GENEROUS? Never in my life did I think I'd hear that from our "Support The Troops" stronghold here.
Are you guys smoking something and I wasn't invited to the party? We're not talking Harvard or Stanford here ... STATE schools, people. And full tuition + books + small stipend STILL won't support a family, so come back to reality, please. |
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Super Member |
Nothing is too good for our boys in uniform! And nothing is what it would seem that some of you would give them! Sheez!... Respectfully, SUNLINER81 |
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Highly Experienced Member |
You either read that wrong or are misrepresenting, dawg ... it is based on the most expensive public institution in state, which is not at all the same thing, say like the difference between UConn and Yale. There is another thing that bothers me about your position too. You seem to think that the Puritan work ethic that you have in abundance [as demonstrated by standing in front of Loew's, among other things] gets handed out uniformly in the population, when it is no such thing. It gets distributed as randomly as height or G-2 or straight teeth, and limiting a college education to those who have it is not good public policy. I understand you are from a large family ... everyone got the same indoctrination as you did, presumably. Did everyone in your family have the same kind of drive you managed? As a side issue, some of the Blue Dog Democrats are fixing to hold the business up since it isn't paid for. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,354458,00.html  |
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Experienced Member |
Not about leaving the troops with nothing.. I got the GI Bill, part of my enlistment contract.. and so should everyone who signed up for it.. and it should be accurately adjusted for inflation. the difference is, that I don't think that making it a silver bullet is the best thing for the troops.. they are still entitled to all scholarships, grants, and loans that anyone else is.. I guess some states may means test their tuition assistance that would make it either-or, and if so they need to change the way they do things.. The GI Bill as I understood it was to help with college, not raise a family.. for married soldiers seems the spouse would be working.. and most colleges have on-campus housing for the non-trads.. I cut my cost for doing my core at a community college, that should be a good alternative in any state.. As for work ethic, it's great but the ability to get outside the box is MORE important, and college OUTSIDE the classroom is where I learned that.. Don't get me wrong, the traits I gained from the military are invaluable, but the military establishment by it's nature makes people linear.. queue up and wait your turn.. truth is, the real world doesn't always work like that.. sooner you learn to zig-zag the better..
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Highly Experienced Member |
That is what college does for the people who pay attention. It isn't an extended high school, and it is supposed to teach people how to think. That is probably why it turns out such a disproportionate number of liberals.
I see no possible advantage to making it financially more difficult to achieve. |
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Experienced Member |
I still don't get the financially more difficult bit.. 6 year degree $10,000 in student loans, half of which never left the bank.. what's difficult? as for thinking, a lot of brainwashing, and learning that if your GPA is taking a header just drop the hard class and take it by itself later on, or not at all if possible, or at a satellite campus with an easier professor... thus are Enron execs made...
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Highly Experienced Member |
Ten thousand in student loans for a six year degree? You have been out of the loop for a while. Try $10,000 a year, if you are willing to live a monastic lifestyle.
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Experienced Member |
Keep in mind, that was 10 grand over my income, grants, and GI Bill, and considering community college for the first two years..(incidentally this had the added benefit of surrounding me with other non-trads until i could get my 'sea legs' back).. and actually, once I got to University, a monastic lifestyle was about all I had time for.. I wasn't aware that the GI Bill was s'posed to land you on an episode of 'Cribs'.....
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suspended pending review,Nemesis |
This debate operates under the assumption that the only one who benefits is the individual soldier. Well, that is not the case. The country benefits from an educated work force. Those who graduate will be paying a heck of a lot more in taxes then those who don't have access to this program. It should be supported simply on THAT basis alone. This is besides the fact that, in whatever position you were in, in the military, you risked your precious life, and you only have one last time I checked. If you can't properly take care of your veterans, you might as well hang it up. I realise that Dawg isn't saying to forget about veterans, but he's being short sighted. Eventually this program will MORE than pay for itself. This isn't some sort of charity, it's pay back, and a "pay back" that benefits everyone. Dave |
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Experienced Member |
Oh jesus christ.. I got the flat rate and I don't/didn't feel uncared for.. and wazzup with the notion that if folks don't get a FULL RIDE they won't get an education? partial responsibility is sort of like a deductible or co-pay, in this case preventing a 'morale hazard' that hell.. i'll just major in underwater golfball stacking until i figure out what to do with my life....
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May I suggest you read the front-page article on Mil.Com today? Then tell me how wrong I am. And McCain is still not on board for this bill... by the way? |
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Good, but don't let us know when you finally figure it all out. |
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Experienced Member |
This one?
Dems Propose Taxes for New VA Benefits Gotta love those Blue Dog Democrats though ... at least they have enough spine to stand up to Pelosi. |
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Highly Experienced Member Ex-Moderator, Fired For Cause |
Dawg, if so much money weren't being poured down the crapper on unappreciative and illiterate jocks who only stay in school long enough to satisfy pro sports requirements, then you might have a point.
I'd much rather see money spent on servicemembers who have already served years in public service. What do the jocks do? Make a few PSA commercials, buy more bling. No thanks. The emergence of the US as a world power during and after WWII is due, in great part, to the power of the GI Bill - that paid for full tuition, books and a stipend. G.H.W.Bush finished up his education at Yale because of it - though there was enough money in his family to have paid for it. Not a single GI in WWII put a penny away for the GI Bill - it was given to them outright, unlike the MGIB that requires substantial funding from the individual servicemember him/herself. There's no "free ride" here, but what is being offered in the bill is a good deal for the servicemembers AND the country. |
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Experienced Member |
Mil.com isn't exactly written in stone. But, you're right McCain is not a on board with this particular bill, since he's in Senate, Paul's in the House and the two have yet to have a conference on it. And, the above post shows that there are difference of opinion. |
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Highly Experienced Member |
Pass the Bill, co'z I aint done yet |
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Experienced Member |
the American sports Industrial Complex is a whole 'nother matter entirely.. used to not be so bad in the days of Bear Bryant, Lou Holz, Bo Shembeckler and the like.. these days college sports is becoming a place where primadonnas in the larval stage are groomed to become full-grown and blown azzholes at the professional level.. This country has some pretty screwed up priorities all the way around... |
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