RE: http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,151594_2,00.html

I am entirely sympathetic to this writer's point of view. However, I think that it will be better for the Iraqi refugees themselves and for Iraq in the longterm, if the U.S. funded -I do mean generously funded- Iraqi enclaves inside Iraq or in nearby countries (including Syria) which are away from the carnage and mayhem. This way, they remain available to return to their country and to contribute to the rebuilding of Iraq. I further believe that we should pay reparations for many years to come for the destruction we have wrought in this country and to the people of Iraq.

I'm not sympathtic to this writer at all.

Ok pal, step up to the plate and have them move in your neighborhood! What? Oh thats not what you meant? Yeah, it's easy to critcize the US action until all of a sudden it's in your back door. Did anybody bother to ask the people of Lansing Michigan if the were peach keen happy about those 2000 Iraqi's moving to their neighborhood...I bet a resounding NO would have been the answer.

Get off your freakin greater than thou horse...cause if you aint actually volinteering to give up some of your neighborhood for the refugee's then shut the "Bleep" up!

I'm, happy Switzerland and all those "other" countries stepped up to the plate to take them in...maybe if they had stepped up to the plate to Help out over in Iraq in the first place, they wouldn't be taking refugees into their country.

quote:

Originally posted by 6362250:...maybe if they had stepped up to the plate to Help out over in Iraq in the first place, they wouldn't be taking refugees into their country.

Nearly forgot:
"I'm not sympathtic to this writer at all."

Could somebody give this guy a citron, so at least he loses this dumb smile.
His expression would fit better to his stories then.

I also would prefer to see the Iraqi's stay in Iraq. Let's help them get the situation under control and see how things will work out.

I also think that the writer (Paul Rieckhoff) has earned the right to express his opinion.

Military Background
Rieckhoff was a First Lieutenant and infantry rifle platoon leader in the Iraq war from 2003-2004. He is now a nationally recognized authority on the war in Iraq and issues affecting troops, military families and veterans.

Rieckhoff enlisted in the U.S. Army Reserves on September 15, 1998 and completed Basic Combat Training and Advanced Individual Training at Fort McClellan, Alabama. He then served in the U.S. Army Reserves, as a Specialist with the 812th Military Police Company. While working on Wall Street at J.P. Morgan in 1999, Rieckhoff transferred to the New York Army National Guard, graduating from Officer Candidate School in June 2001. He was named a Distinguished Military Graduate. Rieckhoff selected infantry as his branch and joined A Company, 1/105th INF (Light).

Rieckhoff left Wall Street on September 8, 2001 with plans to travel and complete additional military schooling. Those plans would change dramatically. On the morning of September 11, Rieckhoff was at his apartment on 24th Street in Manhattan when the first plane hit the World Trade Center. He joined scores of volunteers serving in the rescue effort at Ground Zero. His unit was formally activated for rescue and security operations later that evening.

In February 2002, Rieckhoff began Infantry Officers Basic Course at Fort Benning, Georgia. He graduated in June of 2002 and immediately volunteered for active duty and a place in the pending war in Iraq.

In January 2003, Rieckhoff got the call to go to Iraq. Two days later, he was on a plane to join the 3rd Infantry Division at Fort Stewart, Georgia. Rieckhoff was then assigned as a Platoon Leader for 3rd Platoon, B Company, 3/124th INF (Air Assault) FLNG.

The unit was attached to 1st Brigade, 3ID and spent almost a year conducting combat operations in Iraq, centered in the Adamiyah section of Baghdad on the Eastern bank of the Tigris River. Third Platoon conducted over 1,000 dismounted and mounted combat patrols. 3/124th INF was the first reserve component unit in the Army to be awarded the Combat Infantryman Badge since the Korean War. All thirty-eight of the men in Rieckhoff's platoon returned home alive. Rieckhoff was released from active duty on March 2004 and now serves as an infantry officer in the New York Army National Guard.

He makes an appearance in the 2006 documentary on homeless veterans, When I Came Home.

Serveral problems with bringing them to the US.

How are they going to get there? Swim? Most of them can't afford shoes.

What are they going to do in the US? They would be better off if they remained in Iraq. There is plenty to do in Iraq. As can be seen in Ramadi, they can occupy their time rebuilding and cleaning up.

As for the assertion that we should pay "reparations". Bullsh-t. We lawfully engaged in combat and provided freedom to the people of Iraq. Freedom isn't free, it requires sacrifice. When you have a war there is going to be damages involved. The liberating force doesn't pay reparations. Former members of Sadam's regime should pay reparations. Al Qaeda should pay reparations.

Let them stay in Iraq and clean up the mess with our assistance. That's what we're doing now, that's what we need to keep doing.

Nobody, included me, questions the right to have his opinion, nor do I question his service.

I question his credibility how he does, what he does now, concerning his org and the articles here. There are enough opportunities for him to serve the people he pretends to care in a real useful way. Lurid articles will not help them, they help only him to sustain his greed for publicity.

Last time he gave his statements in a similar lurid way about Walter Reed, with lots of links. Following them I did hard to find any prove for the extent of his complaints.

Rather all his reports I've read here are accusing and they sound mostly like he is disclosing the big fish. So I feel it's a bit inappropriate to have every time his happy face grinning side by side with his ad for his book. I'm glad he's a happy guy. But for what he is happy for ? For the ugly things he describes ?

I had contact to him not so long ago via this forum, I've accused him, that as he got the direct chance to do something for the vets, he failed. He offered to clear things up and to create a thread accordingly here. Guess what ? Never happened. No thread, but lots of bad excuses and everything to avoid a real stance.
That in return gives me the right for my personal opinion, this guy produces lots of hot air.

quote:

Originally posted by HRDKAS:
I also think that the writer (Paul Rieckhoff) has earned the right to express his opinion.
...

This message has been edited. Last edited by: NikeAjax,

quote:

Originally posted by joshua_sergeant:
Serveral problems with bringing them to the US.

How are they going to get there? Swim? Most of them can't afford shoes.

What are they going to do in the US? They would be better off if they remained in Iraq. There is plenty to do in Iraq. As can be seen in Ramadi, they can occupy their time rebuilding and cleaning up.

As for the assertion that we should pay "reparations". Bullsh-t. We lawfully engaged in combat and provided freedom to the people of Iraq. Freedom isn't free, it requires sacrifice. When you have a war there is going to be damages involved. The liberating force doesn't pay reparations. Former members of Sadam's regime should pay reparations. Al Qaeda should pay reparations.

Let them stay in Iraq and clean up the mess with our assistance. That's what we're doing now, that's what we need to keep doing.

When the war is a war of agression and also a war of choice then yeah the attacker needs to be held accountable. That means paying repatrations. And the reason they can't afford shoes according to you is unemployment is running around 60 to 70% because of us. In 1989 the literacy rate in Iraq was 97%. Do you know what it was in the U.S. at the time? 83%. I don't our rate has risen since then. Iraq also had a higher rate of people going after advanced degrees than the U.S.. Prior to action taken by the U.S. Iraq had running water, 24/7 electricity, universal health care and public education. Women were allowed to attend school and enter nearly any profession they wished. None of that exisists any more. So yes, the U.S. should pay for it. And it should be paid to the Iraqi people, not to Haliburton and the other War Profiteers that are making Billions of Taxpayers Dollars and delivering next to nothing and what what they do deliver is shoddy workmanship that falls apart in a matter of weeks.

As far I remember they had also Scuds, Saddam, fedahin, nerve gas, lots of neat stuff for such a wonderland as you describe it. And only to see values in relationship: what's the average dictators elections approval rate ? Yep, 99 percent of his happy people, or so...

Would you mind to share some links for your statements ?

quote:

Originally posted by SSG_Coder:
When the war is a war of agression and also a war of choice then yeah the attacker needs to be held accountable. That means paying repatrations. And the reason they can't afford shoes according to you is unemployment is running around 60 to 70% because of us. In 1989 the literacy rate in Iraq was 97%. Do you know what it was in the U.S. at the time? 83%. I don't our rate has risen since then. Iraq also had a higher rate of people going after advanced degrees than the U.S.. Prior to action taken by the U.S. Iraq had running water, 24/7 electricity, universal health care and public education. Women were allowed to attend school and enter nearly any profession they wished. None of that exisists any more. So yes, the U.S. should pay for it. And it should be paid to the Iraqi people, not to Haliburton and the other War Profiteers that are making Billions of Taxpayers Dollars and delivering next to nothing and what what they do deliver is shoddy workmanship that falls apart in a matter of weeks.

Between the Author of this piece and HRDKAS I guess they expect americans to pay the bill, you know - give them special jobs they are not qualified for that americans need, social security payments not earned low interest home loans (on the other hand probably a free home).

Sure he's entitled to his opinion - but this bringing them here is crap. I'm happy for Switzerland, BUT NOT IN MY COUNTRY!

We've had enough of subsidizing people who are brought here in this manner. And please don't tell me we are leaving them to die - don't buy it. Let them go through training and put themselves on the line. Or maybe it's because he met one with a little talent. We all no Artists need to be payed money by the government (Sans Tax's) since they need to concentrate on their ART.

I say leave them there and let them take back the country that they are helping to give away.


P.S. I suppose WW II, Korea, Vietnam were wars of aggression? All three have had a heavy cost in lives and treasure. Both mention citizens (?) need to get their heads out of the academic liberal life .

quote:

Originally posted by 6362250:
I'm not sympathtic to this writer at all.

Ok pal, step up to the plate and have them move in your neighborhood! What? Oh thats not what you meant? Yeah, it's easy to critcize the US action until all of a sudden it's in your back door. Did anybody bother to ask the people of Lansing Michigan if the were peach keen happy about those 2000 Iraqi's moving to their neighborhood...I bet a resounding NO would have been the answer.

Get off your freakin greater than thou horse...cause if you aint actually volinteering to give up some of your neighborhood for the refugee's then shut the "Bleep" up!

I'm, happy Switzerland and all those "other" countries stepped up to the plate to take them in...maybe if they had stepped up to the plate to Help out over in Iraq in the first place, they wouldn't be taking refugees into their country.

Did anyone ask the Iraqi's if they wanted us to invade their country, destroy it's infrastructure, install a corrupt government with ties to criminal religious nuts and Iran, allow terrorists to enter and attack their towns, and give the re-building jobs to American robber barons instead of local workers? And if the United States had shown the wisdom and restraint of certain European countries and STAYED IN AFGHANISTAN where the terrorists were, we wouldn't have this humanitarian issue to begin with. So now, yes, we are responsible for the fate of the Iraqi's.
Am I volunteering my neighborhood for the Iraqi refugees? Absolutely. Both my hometown of Wallingford, Pa, and where I live in Fairfax, Va, are full of immigrant business owners and residents. So what? Everyone in America came from somewhere else. My great-grandfather came from Italy in the 1890's, my friend James' parents from Cuba in the 60's, and a guy I knew in high school from Jordan in the 80's. Good Americans every one.
NikeAjax: Your argument for the justification of the invasion has been roundly refuted time and again. George Tennet, the former head of the CIA who gathered the intel, has said it was trumped up. Saddam, while a monster, was no threat to the United States, and actively antagonistic to both Al-Qaeda and Iran.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: crzymdc,

Mr. Rieckhoff is not alone in voicing his opinion on Iraqi Refugees. Aside from the American Indians, most of us posting on this subject come from Immigrant Families who were fleeing their homelands because of War or Religious Persecution. Our Country was founded and has flourished because of Immigrants. Perhaps our Government's current reluctance to allow many Iraqi refugees into our Country is the fact that they are Muslims. At last count, somewhere in the neighborhood of over Two Million Iraqi Nationals have fled Iraq to Syria and Jordan...A fact that none of us should be proud of.

Where is the UN in all of this... since the UN has sanctioned the operations in Iraq... you know... Multi-National Corp in Iraq...

I don't support easing the visa process for the Iraqi translaters at all. They are the educated of the country and need to stay in their country to help with the reconstruction.

quote:

Originally posted by SSG_Coder:

quote:

Originally posted by joshua_sergeant:
Serveral problems with bringing them to the US.

How are they going to get there? Swim? Most of them can't afford shoes.

What are they going to do in the US? They would be better off if they remained in Iraq. There is plenty to do in Iraq. As can be seen in Ramadi, they can occupy their time rebuilding and cleaning up.

As for the assertion that we should pay "reparations". Bullsh-t. We lawfully engaged in combat and provided freedom to the people of Iraq. Freedom isn't free, it requires sacrifice. When you have a war there is going to be damages involved. The liberating force doesn't pay reparations. Former members of Sadam's regime should pay reparations. Al Qaeda should pay reparations.

Let them stay in Iraq and clean up the mess with our assistance. That's what we're doing now, that's what we need to keep doing.

When the war is a war of agression and also a war of choice then yeah the attacker needs to be held accountable. That means paying repatrations. And the reason they can't afford shoes according to you is unemployment is running around 60 to 70% because of us. In 1989 the literacy rate in Iraq was 97%. Do you know what it was in the U.S. at the time? 83%. I don't our rate has risen since then. Iraq also had a higher rate of people going after advanced degrees than the U.S.. Prior to action taken by the U.S. Iraq had running water, 24/7 electricity, universal health care and public education. Women were allowed to attend school and enter nearly any profession they wished. None of that exisists any more. So yes, the U.S. should pay for it. And it should be paid to the Iraqi people, not to Haliburton and the other War Profiteers that are making Billions of Taxpayers Dollars and delivering next to nothing and what what they do deliver is shoddy workmanship that falls apart in a matter of weeks.

You sound like someone who has spent a lot of time in Iraq. I have to wonder if that's true.

Wisdom and restraint of European countries ? Cowardice, self serving and shortsightedness are better words for it. You have intel where terrorists are or have been ?
All these countries connect together, if you exterminate the rats in one country, they move to the next, to do the job in Afghanistan alone (which by far is not done) gives not the needed result.

Read my arguments again , they did not serve to justify anything, that's your projection of my words. They are only facts. What from the mentioned was trumped up ? Fedahin ? Nerve gas ? Scuds ? I don't have to prove that, it's openly known.

Also you pretend to know who's a threat and who's not ? Based on what intel ? George Tenet's, who wrote a book to increase his small pension a bit ? Like the guy, who wrote this article here, who wrotes also a book ?
Opinion about Tenet is very controversial. Following his book he lied, why he remembers this only as he left his job, and not earlier ? His remorse needed some time, till his book was ready ? When he will put to trial ? Come on, really believe that stuff ?

quote:

Did anyone ask the Iraqi's if they wanted us to invade their country, destroy it's infrastructure, install a corrupt government with ties to criminal religious nuts and Iran, allow terrorists to enter and attack their towns, and give the re-building jobs to American robber baron's instead of local workers? And if the United States had shown the wisdom and restraint of certain European countries and STAYED IN AFGHANISTAN where the terrorists were, we wouldn't have this humanitarian issue to begin with. So now, yes, we are responsible for the fate of the Iraqi's.
Am I volunteering my neighborhood for the Iraqi refugees? Absolutely. Both my hometown of Wallingford, Pa, and where I live in Fairfax, Va, are full of immigrant business owners and residents. So what? Everyone in America came from somewhere else. My great-grandfather came from Italy in the 1890's, my friend James' parents from Cuba in the 60's, and a guy I knew in high school from Jordan in the 80's. Good Americans every one.
NikeAjax: Your argument for the justification of the invasion has been roundly refuted time and again. George Tennet, the former head of the CIA who gathered the intel, has said it was trumped up. Saddam, while a monster, was no threat to the United States, and actively antagonistic to both Al-Qaeda and Iran.

quote:

Originally posted by stewamart:
Mr. Rieckhoff is not alone in voicing his opinion on Iraqi Refugees. Aside from the American Indians, most of us posting on this subject come from Immigrant Families who were fleeing their homelands because of War or Religious Persecution. Our Country was founded and has flourished because of Immigrants. Perhaps our Government's current reluctance to allow many Iraqi refugees into our Country is the fact that they are Muslims. At last count, somewhere in the neighborhood of over Two Million Iraqi Nationals have fled Iraq to Syria and Jordan...A fact that none of us should be proud of.

Well I am not only a descendant of Immigrants I am also a descendent of the Cherokee tribe. Government reluctance as you put it is dependent on their specific political agenda.

Let's take a look at the Phillipines shall we, when the bases there closed the number of Phillipinos allowed to join the US military was drastically cut, it became and still does take years for a professional phillipino to get a visa for immigration.

I don't particularly care which country we are discussin, it comes down to the same thing. If they want to come here fine, go through the process and wait in line just like the rest of the world who seems to want the same thing.

I still contend that this is a major head in the sand Liberal cry baby/whining that should not be allowed to happen.

If you have Conscience issue please take them some where else. I find statements like these and those made in the article somewhat insulting.



P.S. Yes my wife is from the Phillipines.

quote:

However, I think that it will be better for the Iraqi refugees themselves and for Iraq in the longterm, if the U.S. funded -I do mean generously funded- Iraqi enclaves inside Iraq or in nearby countries (including Syria) which are away from the carnage and mayhem. This way, they remain available to return to their country and to contribute to the rebuilding of Iraq.

Just like we funded the Cuban enclaves so they could prepare for the Bay of Pigs invasion. That worked out well for us didn't it.

You missed the point boys. This isn't about 'normal' Iraqi refugees this is about Iraqis who've put themselves firmly on 'your side' by their actions in helping you.

In the best of all possible worlds they'd be like the retreaded Nazis who helped put Germany back on it's feet.

Iraq's still a war zone, and so, to some of their neighbors, they're collaborators, Quislings, traitors. They're fair game. You leave them unsecured, they will get whacked. It happens every day in Iraq.

What the writer points out, and quite correctly is that during your tours of duty some of the Iraqis become friends. You 'go home', they're 'at home'. The guys who replace you don't necessarily feel the same way about your buddy 'Achmed', and they might, in ignorance, do or say something that exposes him.

This is one of those 'Saigon embassy gate' stories, before the panic evacuation.

About reparations: You broke it, you fix it still applies. 'Why' doesn't.

But the Vietnam experience points out that fact that Americans aren't very 'good' losers. Iraq 'needs' you to win.

From: RETIREDANDPROUD

quote:

Well I am not only a descendant of Immigrants I am also a descendent of the Cherokee tribe. Government reluctance as you put it is dependent on their specific political agenda.

Let's take a look at the Phillipines shall we, when the bases there closed the number of Phillipinos allowed to join the US military was drastically cut, it became and still does take years for a professional phillipino to get a visa for immigration.

I don't particularly care which country we are discussin, it comes down to the same thing. If they want to come here fine, go through the process and wait in line just like the rest of the world who seems to want the same thing.

I still contend that this is a major head in the sand Liberal cry baby/whining that should not be allowed to happen.

If you have Conscience issue please take them some where else. I find statements like these and those made in the article somewhat insulting.

TO: RETIREDANDPROUD

Not sure where you are coming from in your response to Iraqi Refugees. Trying to compare the Phillipines to Iraq is confusing at best. We didn't create Two Million Phillipino Refugees when we closed the Subic Bay Naval Base. We have, however, created over Two Million Iraqi Refugees that have fled Iraq and another Two Million or so Displaced Iraqis inside of Iraq. On July 5, 2007, Assistant Secretary of State Ellen R. Sauerbrey (Who is Responsible for Refugees and Immigrants) said that "Iraqi refugees are arriving in the United States and that their numbers will increase sharply in the months ahead." "In fact, The United States admitted one Iraqi refugee in each of the months of April and May. In June, it admitted 63. That does indeed constitute a sharp increase, but one of little consequence to 2 million Iraqi refugees and another 2 million displaced inside Iraq."

The only Political Agenda most of the Iraqi Refugees have is SURVIVAL!

Sorry you felt "Somewhat Insulted" by my comments and those of Mr. Rieckhoff, but I have just as much right to comment as you Sir. This isn't a "Conscience issue" or Liberal or Conservative issue...This is a Human Rights issue that even our own Government admits that we are doing a Lousy Job resolving the problem!