RE: http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,146609,00.html Military desent, is OK, yea right, how many times the New York Times made up stories about the military. When it was released that Carl Rove was resigning the NYT press room started to cheer. The only two times I can remember being told to not make any type of negative comments about the president and admin. was during the Carter and Clinton years

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Originally posted by big_daddySPS:
RE: http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,146609,00.html Military dissent, is OK, yea right, how many times the New York Times made up stories about the military. When it was released that Carl Rove was resigning the NYT press room started to cheer. The only two times I can remember being told to not make any type of negative comments about the president and admin. was during the Carter and Clinton years

The New York Times takes a very dim view of anybody making up stories about anything, and fires people who do. The cheering section (which wasn't everyone, by the way) was at the Seattle Times, which isn't the same paper. Most serious journalists thought that outburst was an embarrassment.

This sidesteps the issue raised in the column ... do you want to trust a column by two analysts, claiming to be war critics (who were cheerleaders for the war from day one), or seven enlisted guys in an Airborne unit in country?

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Originally posted by oldmole:

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Originally posted by big_daddySPS:
RE: http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,146609,00.html Military dissent, is OK, yea right, how many times the New York Times made up stories about the military. When it was released that Carl Rove was resigning the NYT press room started to cheer. The only two times I can remember being told to not make any type of negative comments about the president and admin. was during the Carter and Clinton years

The New York Times takes a very dim view of anybody making up stories about anything, and fires people who do. The cheering section (which wasn't everyone, by the way) was at the Seattle Times, which isn't the same paper. Most serious journalists thought that outburst was an embarrassment.

This sidesteps the issue raised in the column ... do you want to trust a column by two analysts, claiming to be war critics (who were cheerleaders for the war from day one), or seven enlisted guys in an Airborne unit in country?

Darn Mole, you're using logic and facts here. That's not fair.

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Speaking truth to power...

And when I say power, I mean the politicians, AND The People...

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Originally posted by ANZACbiscuit:
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Speaking truth to power...

And when I say power, I mean the politicians, AND The People...

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You got that right. Who should we believe, boots on the ground, or suits who have set through some briefings that have been sanitized for the general public who really don’t have a need to know?

If you read the op-ed the soldiers wrote, it's clear these guys have it right, and we're getting it from the horse's mouth. Unfortunately, our policy in Iraq will continue to be shaped by the yes-men in suits and uniforms, and above all by the CinC who has little concern for facts or reality.

What is the over/under on how long it will take linedoggie to post they are traitors?

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This op-ed was written by seven American soldiers who are serving in Iraq right now.

I'll trust seven American soldiers who are serving in Iraq, Jack.

Alrighty, finally a real assessment.

Now, how 'bout some suggestions? Armed tribes alone aren't going to attack our country, neither are the Sunni extremists...etc. The only problem is these groups are ripe for recruiting/manipulation by al Qaeda. and, al Qaeda is a threat to our country.

look at al Qaeda's modus operandi. they don't need to take over a country. they just need a few key people in a country's government to help set up their network in a country.

Iraq Report: Sunni insurgents vs. al Qaeda in Diyala

Al Qaeda in Iraq continues to face opposition from Sunni insurgent groups. In the Buhriz district in Diyala province, the 1920s Revolution Brigades assisted Iraqi police in fending off an attack of upwards of 60 al Qaeda fighters. Multinational Forces Iraq identified the Sunni insurgents as the "Baqubah Guardians," however IraqSlogger reported the al-Ishreen Revolution Brigades (1920s Revolution Brigades) engaged in the fight. Multinational Forces Iraq described the fighting, and notes the coordination between the insurgent group, the local police, and US attack helicopters:

In an unprecedented combined action in Diyala Province, Iraqi police and citizen volunteers defeated a coordinated attack of approximately 40-60 al-Qaeda terrorists in the southern Burhitz area of Baqubah, Wednesday, and killed an estimated 21 insurgents, wounding more.

As the terrorists entered the city of Burhitz, a group of concerned local citizens, called ‘Baqubah Guardians,’ and IPs stationed in Burhitz engaged the first wave of attackers, killing seven. At least two suicide bombers were killed before they reached their intended targets, with the bomb vests detonating prematurely.

The IP notified the Provincial Joint Coordination Center and requested Coalition Force attack helicopter support after the first engagement. Attack helicopters arrived and engaged another large group of heavily armed fighters staging near the first attack site, killing or wounding an estimated 14 terrorists.

The 1920s Revolution Brigades previous drove al Qaeda in Iraq out of Buhriz, with the help of US forces. The battles between the 1920s Revolution Brigades and al Qaeda began in April. The Anbar Salvation Council, through its ties in the 1920s Revolution Brigades, helped organize the anti-al Qaeda resistance in Buhriz. As these groups work with the US and Iraqi security forces, they are being integrated as local police or as provincial security forces.

The degree to which Sunni insurgent groups have turned against al Qaeda and are working with US troops and Iraqi security forces is an underreported story in the war. Approximately 25,000 Sunni insurgents from groups such as the 1920s Revolution Brigades, the Jaysh Mohammed, and the Islamic Army of Iraq have turned against al Qaeda at the behest of their tribal leaders. "Tribe members and others who agree to support Iraq's government have to sign a pledge form and consent to biometric scans of their fingerprints and retinas so their data can be kept on file," USA Today reported on August 6. "They are also vetted by the Iraqi government."

The strategy of turning the tribes and insurgent groups has been successful in Anbar, and is being applied inside Baghdad, Diyala, Salahadin, Ninewa, and Babil province. This is reconciliation at the micro level. Al Qaeda is threatened by this development and is actively targeting members of groups that have turned on them.

Al Qaeda in Iraq's heinous multiple suicide on the Yazidi villages near Singar in Ninewa province on Tuesday is the single greatest mass casualty strike since the war began. The initial reports of 175 killed have climbed to at least 400 killed, with the Kuwaiti News Agency reporting over 500 killed and 375 wounded.

Col. Stephen Twitty, commander of the 4th Brigade Combat Team, 1st Cavalry Division, warns that it is too soon to know the death toll. “So far the accounting of casualties has been very speculative,” said Col .Twitty. “The villagers and rescue workers are still trying to find those missing; and their efforts, and those of the local, provincial and central government leadership, along with the ISF here, have been tremendous." Multinational Forces Iraq estimates are 275 killed and 400 wounded.

The Kurdish Regional Government has stepped in and deployed about two companies, numbering about 340 troops total, of the Kurdish Regional Guards to provide additional security in the region. US troops and Iraqi Army soldiers from the 3rd Division are providing assistance to the recovery effort, and US air assets are providing air transportation to the wounded.

Elsewhere in the North, two civilians were killed and 33 wounded in a simultaneous, dual roadside bombing strike in the city of Kirkuk. The attacks bear the hallmark of al Qaeda in Iraq, which has been working to stir up sectarian tensions since Iraqi and Coalition launched major offensives against the terror group starting June 15.

US and Iraqi security forces have launched two sweeps against al Qaeda in the North since the bombings in the Yazidi villages. Iraqi soldiers from the 3rd Brigade, 3rd Division, which is based in northern Ninewa province, captured seven suspected terrorists in the village of Abu Bareyj on August 14. Iraqi security forces captured eight terrorists during raids in Mosul and the Hamrin Ridge region. A sniper cell leader in Mosul and the leader of an Al Qaeda in Iraq terrorist smuggling cell in the Hamrin Ridge region were among those captured during the raids. Further south in Balad, US forces killed six al Qaeda operatives and captured 26 during a series of operations from August 9-14.

On the Shia terror group front, Coalition forces captured "a highly sought Special Groups weapons facilitator before dawn Thursday northeast of Baghdad." Three Special Groups operatives were killed and five others were captured during the raid. "The captured high priority individual was responsible for smuggling explosively formed penetrators (EFP), Katusha rockets and other weapons from Iran into Iraq," Multinational Forces Iraq reported. "The target was also responsible for the distribution of those weapons to Special Groups and extremist militants operating throughout Baghdad. The weapons smuggler had direct ties to senior militant leaders and the Iranian Revolutionary Guards Corps-Qods Force." The Special Groups are essential Iraqi-born Qods force operatives.

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Al Qaeda in Iraq's heinous multiple suicide on the Yazidi villages near Singar in Ninewa province on Tuesday is the single greatest mass casualty strike since the war began. The initial reports of 175 killed have climbed to at least 400 killed, with the Kuwaiti News Agency reporting over 500 killed and 375 wounded.

al Qaeda messed with the Yezidis? Oh, they're dead now, fer sure!! Even Saddam didn't mess with the Yezidis.

FindArticles.com

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Yezidis are a part of 40-million-strong nation, which has endured many, many years of persecution and massacres and yet has managed to keep our own religious beliefs, Yezidism, to this day. Kurds are one of the Aryan nations. On Kurdish land, the rich Aryan civilization was born and later embraced by other nations all over the world. Historically, when there were wars and massacres, many nations lost their traditions and heritage. However, the Kurds were so strong that they were able to keep their national culture, language, religion and traditions.

Despite the forced Islamization of most Kurds, the Yezidi Kurds' traditions have existed for centuries. The whole history of the emergence of the Kurds as followers of the Yezidi religion is still largely unknown. Yezidi Kurds are not of the same race as the Turks, Persians and Arabs even though they have lived among them for hundreds of years. Many Yezidis have blue eyes, blonde hair and fair skin. Yezidi women are truly beautiful and men are chivalrous. Yezidis are different from those around them. Their blood is pure. Yezidi Kurds did not allow the Kurds to be assimilated by others. They have always refused to become a part of any Muslim nation. They have valiantly fought to keep their identity, their language, their culture and religious beliefs. No Persian, no Turkish and no Arab ruler was able to force the Yezidis to forget their Kurdish national identity and their religious beliefs. This despite the horrible wars, massacres, oppression and discrimination throughout centuries. The meaning and the place of Yezidi religion in the history of human civilization and how it has affected other religions are still being studied. Its foundations are very interesting from a religious point of view, but it remains for someone to fully investigate them in order to provide a full account.

This was a well-written, tastefully-done, and respectfully-submitted piece. I don't always agree with Paul Reickhoff's politics, but I do agree with his statement "there is always room for professional dissent in the military."

These troopers did a fine job for their country by laying out a coherent argument based on their true observations in-country. My hats off to them.

I can only hope that we can retain at least a few of them. These are the soldiers that are going to be needed in the coming years to repair and rebuild the Army as it comes out of its experience in Iraq and, eventually, Afghanistan.

Finally, I wish a speedy and full recovery for SSG Murphy. AIRBORNE!!

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Originally posted by GroovyLady:

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This op-ed was written by seven American soldiers who are serving in Iraq right now.

I'll trust seven American soldiers who are serving in Iraq, Jack.

Alrighty, finally a real assessment.

Now, how 'bout some suggestions? Armed tribes alone aren't going to attack our country, neither are the Sunni extremists...etc. The only problem is these groups are ripe for recruiting/manipulation by al Qaeda. and, al Qaeda is a threat to our country.

look at al Qaeda's modus operandi. they don't need to take over a country. they just need a few key people in a country's government to help set up their network in a country.

You believe what the boots are telling you, now you want 'suggestions'? The suggestions have been obvious, and unheeded, because of the next bit of 'spin'.

Just who came up with the concept that Al Qaeda wanted to bring the Jihad to America? The same suits who humped bringing a war to Iraq. You're doing your neocon impersonation.

PS. You might want to mention how a massacre is being staved-off, or an Iranian take over, a radicalization of the middle east, destruction of Israel, etc or a host of other potentialities if Mr. Bush hadn't started his war.

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Just who came up with the concept that Al Qaeda wanted to bring the Jihad to America? .

yea because it was all just lies... they are really a peacefull people that want to give us love and kisses...

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Originally posted by outlaws93:

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Just who came up with the concept that Al Qaeda wanted to bring the Jihad to America? .

yea because it was all just lies... they are really a peacefull people that want to give us love and kisses...

Lies? Don't forget the flowers! Rummy said there'd be flowers and and the 'neocons' said there'd be cake.

Well then there are two press rooms who were cheering, to many stories came from NYT than were unfounded. You got seven guys who wrote this, OK now it was said that we are winning or doing great there, the demos who support cut and run and their moonbats supporters are upset cause of this. Now how many articles we will get from service people who has another view point in the NYT.

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Originally posted by popsiq:

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Originally posted by outlaws93:

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Just who came up with the concept that Al Qaeda wanted to bring the Jihad to America? .

yea because it was all just lies... they are really a peacefull people that want to give us love and kisses...

Lies? Don't forget the flowers! Rummy said there'd be flowers and and the 'neocons' said there'd be cake.

and we were greated as liberators till the islamofascist gain in numbers in the area and chased off the good people... they stayed in the houses on fear of getting killed....

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Originally posted by outlaws93:

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Originally posted by popsiq:

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Originally posted by outlaws93:

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Just who came up with the concept that Al Qaeda wanted to bring the Jihad to America? .

yea because it was all just lies... they are really a peacefull people that want to give us love and kisses...

Lies? Don't forget the flowers! Rummy said there'd be flowers and and the 'neocons' said there'd be cake.

and we were greated as liberators till the islamofascist gain in numbers in the area and chased off the good people... they stayed in the houses on fear of getting killed....

Nice try. The insurgency is now to the point where most of the fighters are natives, not Al Queda. We bungled the initial occupation by not having enough boots on the ground. We didn't secure the arms caches left around the country. We didn't prevent the looting, which disrupted the local infrastructure to the point where they never recovered. We also dismissed the only armed, organized force, the Army. This was a huge mistake that even Paul Bremer has acknowledged. Finally, we just plain overstayed our welcome. It's easy to be a cheerleader, when you never had to play the game isn't it? It is great to try to blame the enemy for everything. However the truth is that we could have squashed any insurgency if the post war planning had been done properly.

yea and its all sunni too huh... and the whole iran thing dosent add into that either... whatever... read my first post in this thread...

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Originally posted by GroovyLady:

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This op-ed was written by seven American soldiers who are serving in Iraq right now.

I'll trust seven American soldiers who are serving in Iraq, Jack.

Alrighty, finally a real assessment.

Now, how 'bout some suggestions? Armed tribes alone aren't going to attack our country, neither are the Sunni extremists...etc. The only problem is these groups are ripe for recruiting/manipulation by al Qaeda. and, al Qaeda is a threat to our country.

look at al Qaeda's modus operandi. they don't need to take over a country. they just need a few key people in a country's government to help set up their network in a country.

Welcome back, your Grooviness. On behalf of your legion of adoring fans, let me express our best wishes, and hopes that your hiatus was due to nothing more unpleasant than cheerleading camp ... we were discussing starting blood drives for you.

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Originally posted by big_daddySPS:
Well then there are two press rooms who were cheering, to many stories came from NYT than were unfounded. You got seven guys who wrote this, OK now it was said that we are winning or doing great there, the demos who support cut and run and their moonbats supporters are upset cause of this. Now how many articles we will get from service people who has another view point in the NYT.

Do you have any proof to back up your charge that the NYT press room was cheering? I don't mind your not liking their editorial policy, or even the content of their stories ... it is a newspaper, and you don't have to buy it.

I do wonder exactly what the moral difference between them allegedly making things up, and you making things up might be, though.