RE: http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,157468,00.html

So many articles have been written about this topic --it has been beat to death, burried and then dug up over and over again. Please let it rest.

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Originally posted by rhanley: Please let it rest.

Agreed mostly, but this part needs to be said often:

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"If Mitt Romney or President Bush wanted moral credibility [on war in Iraq] their kids would be in uniform," Schaeffer said. "That's not to say they'd force them into it ... but if they're talking that way at home [about the importance of serving] there would be a Bush and a Romney in uniform."

Romney, a former Massachusetts governor now running for the Republican nomination for president, caught flak recently when, asked by an Iowa woman if any of his five sons are in the military, he said they were "showing their support for the nation" by campaigning for him to be president.

And it’s not only Republicans, he said. Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y., has been hawkish on Iraq, but her own daughter, Chelsea, is not in uniform.

Charles Moskos, a military sociologist at Northwestern University, Evanston, Ill., and expert in recruiting, believes the absence of people from such high-profile, politically significant families has contributed to recruiting woes.

And recruiters believe it too, he said.

There'd be no talk of a draft, if more high-profile political families "walked the walk".

Recruiting for a Safe and Secure future for Freedom has and always will be an issue. As long as the side liners think they can sit and warm the bench and Live off the Bravery of fine Patriots! I treasure our Heroic Men and Women, Sons and Daughters whom have chosen to Serve! Many if not most come from a legacy of Familial Forefathers. I Believe Strength of Character comes from Grateful parents and good parental leadership! Our ALL Volunteer Military force is this Nations most valuable asset.

We must Appreciate, Support Financially ALL of their needs in training, in theater, & especially Lifelong after they have done their jobs. Military Service builds character, we should have fewer pansies in our society and more involved, less self centered Me-bots. Too many young ones think *So-called celebs are where it's at with Big Cribs and lots of bling-bling stuff. Morale fiber and character are things to hold high; look up to. Our perspectives are skewed, to be too Materialistic.

America needs to get back to the basics: Family, Faith, Service to Others, Health & Education, but never forgetting Safety and or Security. Our elected officials need to address National Security starting with the borders......Make NO Mistake the enemy is Here within our shores! Enlighten yourselves and Snap out of the Latte/Mall FOG! Everyone who lives in this Great Country should feel an obligation to give back for this great Life! Service is not an option, it is a DUTY! You don't have to run with a gun, but should be involved with your community on some level! Volunteer to "Make a Difference" for someone other than yourself. You will be amazed how wonderful that FEELS!

God Bless Our Troops, Our Veterans, Our World Leaders, & America!

Respectfully,
Christina Finn


"I have learned that in order to bring about change, you must not be
afraid to take the first step. We will fail when we fail to try. Each
and everyone of us can make a difference." Rosa Parks

This message has been edited. Last edited by: PillowLady,

How can it be beat to death when there is still a war going on? The sad truth is that the priveleged and their children don't fight wars. When you rely on mercs and foreigners to defend your nation, that's the beginning of the downfall, just like the Roman Empire. But since political careers are more important than patriotism, the politicians will sacrifice the nation to keep their influence and jobs.

That's all it's about. If we did suddenly get invaded by China or Russia, how could we train a fighting force to defend the country on such short notice? We couldn't, and it would be all over. Waging a global war with a small volunteer army is ignorant.

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Originally posted by OneThreeMarine:
But since political careers are more important than patriotism, the politicians will sacrifice the nation to keep their influence and jobs.

Well Said. I think people should stop complaining. The people who serve our country now knew what they were doing when they signed up. If they want to worry about what are we going to do with an army stretched so thin, I say this either bring them home now and then you don't have to worry about it. Or put the rich kids right along side the poor ones and call it a day. Heres a quote from a band some of you might know.

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WHY DON'T PRESIDENTS FIGHT THE WARS, WHY DO THEY ALWAYS SEND THE POOR!!!!

I live in a part of the country (Northeast) where the idea of someone choosing the military as a career is widely seen as the last resort for kids too stupid or too poor to go to college. Frank Shaeffer (mentioned in the article) wrote his book when his son enlisted and all his friends and neighbors wanted to know what was "wrong" with his kid. While an all volunteer military is more "professional" it is also becoming more and more divided from the rest of American society. I can see it in a lot of the postings here which reflect an "us and them" viewpoint.
While the war has made many Americans express gratitude for the sacrifices made by the troops, unlike what happened during Viet Nam, they are no more likely to encourage their children to enlist than during that era.
Charlie Rangel is right; we do need to talk about who fights our wars. Twenty or thirty years from now, I hope that serving in Iraq or Aghanistan will be a necessary pre-req for holding high office and not the norm for the inhabitants of homeless shelters and mental wards.

Our forces are doing fine now that Rumsfeld is out. If politicians would have allowed our highly trained military to fight the war, it would have been over by now. Before this war started our military generals were saying that it would require 300 to 500 thousand troops to secure Iraq and force out the opposition. The generals that stated this were either forced to resign their commissions or forced to retire.
Our military was and now is strong enough to handle the present situation, as long as politicians stay out of their way.

My question all along. Why aren't those who believe so strongly in this war as to send out other people kids, feel strongly enough to send their own kids to war? When that actually happens, I just might support George Bush and his personal war.

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Originally posted by jack_flats:
My question all along. Why aren't those who believe so strongly in this war as to send out other people kids, feel strongly enough to send their own kids to war? When that actually happens, I just might support George Bush and his personal war.

Here Here

Because the people rarely elect presidents who have fought in wars. Every presidential race since the Carter administration has had war veterans running for president. They usually remain low in the polls and have to drop out before the primaries. George Bush Sr. was a WW II veteran and was shot down twice during his service. John Kerry was a war veteran and ran in the past elections. John F. Kennedy was a war veteran, his PT boat was sunk by a torpedo. John McCain is a war veteran who spent over 5 years as a POW. The list goes on and on.

quote:

Originally posted by flea2825:

quote:

Originally posted by OneThreeMarine:
But since political careers are more important than patriotism, the politicians will sacrifice the nation to keep their influence and jobs.

Well Said. I think people should stop complaining. The people who serve our country now knew what they were doing when they signed up. If they want to worry about what are we going to do with an army stretched so thin, I say this either bring them home now and then you don't have to worry about it. Or put the rich kids right along side the poor ones and call it a day. Heres a quote from a band some of you might know.

quote:

WHY DON'T PRESIDENTS FIGHT THE WARS, WHY DO THEY ALWAYS SEND THE POOR!!!!

You cant force anyone to get in the military thats why its refered to as a volunteer force.

If their kids choose not to join then thats their decision not their parents so suck it you idiots. Thats why its called freedom.

I just wish they instilled a draft so all you mighty desk jockies can get drafted.

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Originally posted by NickBrand:
You cant force anyone to get in the military thats why its refered to as a volunteer force.

If their kids choose not to join then thats their decision not their parents so suck it you idiots. Thats why its called freedom.

I just wish they instilled a draft so all you mighty desk jockies can get drafted.

That alot of bunk. You can force people into the military with the stroke of a presidents pen. It's called the draft. Draftees have been fighting wars for this country and have been in service to their country for millenniums, and they do a fine job of it. The myth that a all volunteer army is better is just that, a total myth. Draftees have always proven to be just as good a fighter as any volunteer.

quote:

Originally posted by NickBrand:
You cant force anyone to get in the military thats why its refered to as a volunteer force.

If their kids choose not to join then thats their decision not their parents so suck it you idiots. Thats why its called freedom.

I just wish they instilled a draft so all you mighty desk jockies can get drafted.

They should have never gotten rid of the Draft.

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Originally posted by Migbuster:
They should have never gotten rid of the Draft.

AMEN to that.

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So many articles have been written about this topic --it has been beat to death, burried and then dug up over and over again. Please let it rest.

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Wow... here's a novel approach for Military.com to consider. If an important topic has had some pre determined level of articles written, followed by much discussion, than prohibit any further dialog.

This is an important matter to discuss because it is indicative of other important issues, such as America's involvement in what was described by our CIC "as a long hard war". I'm not necessarily an advocate of a draft, but I don't rule it out either. More importantly, if you buy into the notion that we are engaged in a long and difficult war, then we must involve more Americans than are currently bearing the load.

A united movement, led by veterans such as us, could go a long ways towards mustering support for this nation's strategic interests, and I'm not talking about magnetic ribbons with catchy slogans. All Americans must be willing to sacrafice in order to support the GWOT. If Americans are unwilling, than one must question the cause and justification. I believe our nation is up to the challenge, if only someone in a leadership position would present it.

If there was a mandatory service requirement, I think it would do away with a lot of the problems we see today. Teenagers these days just want to play X-Box and stay in front of their computers. Mandatory service would force them to work, see what real life is all about and maybe even instill a little patriotism.

First: The draft should be reinstituted.
Second: The "run-up" time for the draft would be considerable.
Third: NO draft exceptions WHAtSOEVER!
Fourth: If it has been "beat to death", why bring it up again on this thread?

We could hire x pres clintoon to manage the draft dodger detectives!

The military today is technologically sophisticated enough that I don't think drafting those that choose not to be there would be of any benefit to those who have chosen to serve. I know that I don't want my husband's back being covered by some eighteen year old forced into service that doesn't have the moral integrity to cover his fellow soldiers. Because if they lack the will they will never understand the way.

I think what we need is to raise the value we place on those who have that moral integrity and intelligence to serve in our military today. It needs to start at the top and filter down through our country. When government officials and CEO's of corporations start choosing to hire someone with military experience over an average college graduate, then we will start seeing things turn for the better. When it is publicly recognized that these men and women in uniform are not only highly educated and skilled in many different venues but that they have the moral integrity to do the job in a far superior manner because of that integrity, that is when we will see more parents willing to encourage their children to serve their country. The media needs to starts recognizing the honor and integrity that is instilled in most military personnel and quits broadcasting on only the few who have done things to discredit all those who do the right thing day in and day out. The children in our schools need to be taught the value of patriotism and have pride in being part of such a wonderful country. These children also need to be educated on the proper respect that should be given our flag, our pledge of allegiance, and our military personnel, both active and veterans. Heck, most adults need to be educated on these topics as well.