RE: http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,154037,00.html

I don't think anyone will be surprised by this news. It is just good military planning.

Yes, Turkey needs to defend themselves...
But this may be good for the U.S., after all, if we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can!

"...Turkey expected "speedy steps from the U.S." in cracking down on Kurdish rebels and that Rice, who called the Turkish leader, asked "for a few days" from him."

Rice asked Turkey not to invate Iraq, I must be on the wrong planet! Wasn't it us, i.e., the Unied States, that first 'invaded Iriq', without just cause, and now we are asking a country with just cause, to give it a few days?? WTF is that about? These Iriqi people, no matter which faction CAN ABSOLUTELY NOT behave themselves under any circumstances whatsoever! These people only understand one thing, a force that will utterly and completely destroy their entire society to the last man, woman and child! Only then will they stop this maddness, anything less then that clear understanding is a waste of time. Turkey understands exactly how to deal with them, kill em all and let Allah sort em out! What gets me is the area is the cradle of civilization, you'd think of all people they would have it together better then anyone else because they've been at it longer. But, nope, nope and nope! I'm totally in favor of permitting Turkey to go in and kick A$$ on these people, and if they needed any help we should join with them and destroy every village that has anything to do with this! They want to go to Allah, then lets oblige them!

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
Yes, Turkey needs to defend themselves...
But this may be good for the U.S., after all, if we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can!

You need to refresh yourself on the geography of the conflict. Turkey is proposing to invade an area that is friendly to the US. The US is the one currently propping up the Kurds in Northern Iraq. If Turkey invades, the US is caught between a rock and a hard place. Do they defend a friendly state against a NATO ally or do they side with Turkey and alienate the rest of Iraq and undo all of the hard work of the surge. No, this definitely not a a good thing for the US.

quote:

Originally posted by AirForceAggie:

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
Yes, Turkey needs to defend themselves...
But this may be good for the U.S., after all, if we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can!

You need to refresh yourself on the geography of the conflict. Turkey is proposing to invade an area that is friendly to the US. The US is the one currently propping up the Kurds in Northern Iraq. If Turkey invades, the US is caught between a rock and a hard place. Do they defend a friendly state against a NATO ally or do they side with Turkey and alienate the rest of Iraq and undo all of the hard work of the surge. No, this definitely not a a good thing for the US.

PHOOEY, PHOOEY AND PHOOEY!That logic makes as much sence as giving the keys of the liquor store to the drunk! If we have any chance to win this lunatic war it must be based on joining one side and sticking with it until we go over the 1 yard line with them! At this point I could care less which faction we join up with, but lets get this over with!

Besides the Kurds don't have any Oil so what do we care about them! To hell with them, wipe them out. I imagine that this is one of the reason's why Saddam killed so many Kurds, they can't behave! How in the world could we blame Saddam for killing these people when they pull stunt's like this constantly! I say, kill anyone that doesn't go along with the plan to stop this war! If the only way to stop this war is to kill everylast one of them, in the name of peace, I'm for it!

I said defend themselves, not invade... Those two are completely DIFFerent, but slick tongue I must admit, to distort my words so much...you are good at what you do

Also, you must be talking of the gains the good general mentioned.
"Noting a minute decrease in helpless cries for mercy, Petraeus added that the blast's aftermath was "not even close" to being as grisly as it could have been. A satisfied Petraeus also told reporters that Baghdad streets and avenues could be more accurately described as "blood-splattered" than "blood-soaked."

Or perhaps these gains: "Upon receiving the not-altogether-hideous news, Defense Secretary Robert Gates was reportedly optimistic, but could not predict a realistic time frame in which the overall conditions in Iraq would become the opposite of terrifying, or even sort of halfway livable. However, Gates did say that if the bombings are any indication of future conditions, the situation in Iraq could be upgraded to "nightmarish" within months."

quote:

Originally posted by AirForceAggie:

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
Yes, Turkey needs to defend themselves...
But this may be good for the U.S., after all, if we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can!

You need to refresh yourself on the geography of the conflict. Turkey is proposing to invade an area that is friendly to the US. The US is the one currently propping up the Kurds in Northern Iraq. If Turkey invades, the US is caught between a rock and a hard place. Do they defend a friendly state against a NATO ally or do they side with Turkey and alienate the rest of Iraq and undo all of the hard work of the surge. No, this definitely not a a good thing for the US.

Turkey is only following the example of the United States: INVADE !

The deviations from traditional American values by the Bush Administration will haunt us for many, many years to come. By practicing aggression and torture we, as a nation, have lost our moral standing in the world. I am shamed by what has been done the past five years by REPUBLICANS and what has not been done by DEMOCRATS to control an out of balance imperial administration.

God will teach us...................

Umm, I do not believe god will not teach us...

But besides that, if only we had the majority of people in the government offices (all the offices, to include the partisan Congress) who actually served in the military and wars... Oh well, at least we have a few... Sill we need more! In Congress and at least one in the white house...

quote:

Originally posted by helez:
Turkey is only following the example of the United States: INVADE !

The deviations from traditional Amerivcan values by the Bush Administration will haunt us forr many, many years. By practicing aggression and torture we have lost our moral standing in the world. I am shamed by what has been done the past five years and what has not been done to control an out of balance imperial administration.

God will teach us...................

quote:

Originally posted by DanDaily:

quote:

Originally posted by AirForceAggie:

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
Yes, Turkey needs to defend themselves...
But this may be good for the U.S., after all, if we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can!

You need to refresh yourself on the geography of the conflict. Turkey is proposing to invade an area that is friendly to the US. The US is the one currently propping up the Kurds in Northern Iraq. If Turkey invades, the US is caught between a rock and a hard place. Do they defend a friendly state against a NATO ally or do they side with Turkey and alienate the rest of Iraq and undo all of the hard work of the surge. No, this definitely not a a good thing for the US.

PHOOEY, PHOOEY AND PHOOEY!That logic makes as much sence as giving the keys of the liquor store to the drunk! If we have any chance to win this lunatic war it must be based on joining one side and sticking with it until we go over the 1 yard line with them! At this point I could care less which faction we join up with, but lets get this over with!

Besides the Kurds don't have any Oil so what do we care about them! To hell with them, wipe them out. I imagine that this is one of the reason's why Saddam killed so many Kurds, they can't behave! How in the world could we blame Saddam for killing these people when they pull stunt's like this constantly! I say, kill anyone that doesn't go along with the plan to stop this war! If the only way to stop this war is to kill everylast one of them, in the name of peace, I'm for it!

First, learn to spell. Second, the situation in Iraq is not as simple as you make it. Let's look at your lack of logic. Okay, we stick with one "faction" as you put it. Well, guess what Genius, we stick up for them against Turkey. Turkey in response cuts off our supply lines for two thirds of our forces. Yeah, great situation for the US. Conversely, we side with Turkey against the only faction in Iraq that has set up a stable and safe government in Iraq. The Kurdish autonomous region is practically free of bombings and have been pro-US from the get go. We go against them and what do you think any of the other groups in Iraq will think? Learn some more of the region and the circumstances. Stop being so ignorant.

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
I said defend themselves, not invade... Those two are completely DIFFerent, but slick tongue I must admit, to distort my words so much...you are good at what you do

Also, you must be talking of the gains the good general mentioned.
"Noting a minute decrease in helpless cries for mercy, Petraeus added that the blast's aftermath was "not even close" to being as grisly as it could have been. A satisfied Petraeus also told reporters that Baghdad streets and avenues could be more accurately described as "blood-splattered" than "blood-soaked."

Or perhaps these gains: "Upon receiving the not-altogether-hideous news, Defense Secretary Robert Gates was reportedly optimistic, but could not predict a realistic time frame in which the overall conditions in Iraq would become the opposite of terrifying, or even sort of halfway livable. However, Gates did say that if the bombings are any indication of future conditions, the situation in Iraq could be upgraded to "nightmarish" within months."

quote:

Originally posted by AirForceAggie:

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
Yes, Turkey needs to defend themselves...
But this may be good for the U.S., after all, if we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can!

You need to refresh yourself on the geography of the conflict. Turkey is proposing to invade an area that is friendly to the US. The US is the one currently propping up the Kurds in Northern Iraq. If Turkey invades, the US is caught between a rock and a hard place. Do they defend a friendly state against a NATO ally or do they side with Turkey and alienate the rest of Iraq and undo all of the hard work of the surge. No, this definitely not a a good thing for the US.

Amazing, a lot of babble with no concrete arguement for your point. The Turkish parliament has given the green light for the Turkish army to defend the country. Now how do you think they will defend their country? They'll do exactly what the US would do in a similar circumstance and invade Northern Iraq. That's the way they will defend themselves and if they do so, it won't be good for the US at all.

Or you could just do as Clinton did, to the great affect his policy had. Bomb your enemies Kurds)until the land turns to glass. Make sure the American's know to not be there at the time of the bombings byt the way.
If that does not work, madate a policy that no one crosses the Turkey line, or vise versa, those that do would get the same treatment as the "Gun Line" that American jails and prisons have... But to invade? That should be a last option, like with A-gan, and should only happen when the country under attack is threatend whole heartedly (like 9/11)

I do agree, your point has a lot of babble without any conrete argument for your post, since of course you were responding to your own post as well...( See, I just used your own "word manipultaion" against you, it's funny)

quote:

Originally posted by AirForceAggie:

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
I said defend themselves, not invade... Those two are completely DIFFerent, but slick tongue I must admit, to distort my words so much...you are good at what you do

Also, you must be talking of the gains the good general mentioned.
"Noting a minute decrease in helpless cries for mercy, Petraeus added that the blast's aftermath was "not even close" to being as grisly as it could have been. A satisfied Petraeus also told reporters that Baghdad streets and avenues could be more accurately described as "blood-splattered" than "blood-soaked."

Or perhaps these gains: "Upon receiving the not-altogether-hideous news, Defense Secretary Robert Gates was reportedly optimistic, but could not predict a realistic time frame in which the overall conditions in Iraq would become the opposite of terrifying, or even sort of halfway livable. However, Gates did say that if the bombings are any indication of future conditions, the situation in Iraq could be upgraded to "nightmarish" within months."

quote:

Originally posted by AirForceAggie:

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
Yes, Turkey needs to defend themselves...
But this may be good for the U.S., after all, if we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can!

You need to refresh yourself on the geography of the conflict. Turkey is proposing to invade an area that is friendly to the US. The US is the one currently propping up the Kurds in Northern Iraq. If Turkey invades, the US is caught between a rock and a hard place. Do they defend a friendly state against a NATO ally or do they side with Turkey and alienate the rest of Iraq and undo all of the hard work of the surge. No, this definitely not a a good thing for the US.

Amazing, a lot of babble with no concrete arguement for your point. The Turkish parliament has given the green light for the Turkish army to defend the country. Now how do you think they will defend their country? They'll do exactly what the US would do in a similar circumstance and invade Northern Iraq. That's the way they will defend themselves and if they do so, it won't be good for the US at all.

AAA, you and I it seems, so far are the only ones with any real military expertise on this site today. Those other three only want to argue. If they had any real knowledge of what was happening in Iraq, they wouldn't have to spew off with nonsense. As for diplomacy with the Kurds, yes we need to maintain it along Turkey. Huge strides have been taken to get where we have gotten with the Kurds and to loose it over this would be an injustice. But, to loose Turkey as an allie would be just as detrimental.

All of this is going so well!

I'm sure that the Turks will wait as long as we ask them to; y'know they love us. After all they only lost 17 soldiers yesterday. What's the rush. Besides they would be aggressors. And they're affraid of us. Just look how they rolled over and let the 4th ID cross Turkey to invade Iraq in '03.

If y'all think that Iraq is FUBAR now just wait!

It takes two to argue first of all. My origanal post was distorted and I reponded in like, as far as me wanting to argue, that is a side purpose of the entire blogging community. However, I do not agree with blatant, stupid, look-at-the-monkey arguing (kinda like what you said about the other three posters...). I simply stated that Turkey should protect its country, now I will add that they should protect their own troops.
I agree (the opposite of argue for those of short leashed brains) that we should hold Turkey with diplomacy, rather than undo what we've done.

quote:

Originally posted by rkgtactical:
AAA, you and I it seems, so far are the only ones with any real military expertise on this site today. Those other three only want to argue. If they had any real knowledge of what was happening in Iraq, they wouldn't have to spew off with nonsense. As for diplomacy with the Kurds, yes we need to maintain it along Turkey. Huge strides have been taken to get where we have gotten with the Kurds and to loose it over this would be an injustice. But, to loose Turkey as an allie would be just as detrimental.

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
It takes two to argue first of all. My origanal post was distorted and I reponded in like, as far as me wanting to argue, that is a side purpose of the entire blogging community. However, I do not agree with blatant, stupid, look-at-the-monkey arguing (kinda like what you said about the other three posters...). I simply stated that Turkey should protect its country, now I will add that they should protect their own troops.
I agree (the opposite of argue for those of short leashed brains) that we should hold Turkey with diplomacy, rather than undo what we've done.

quote:

Originally posted by rkgtactical:
AAA, you and I it seems, so far are the only ones with any real military expertise on this site today. Those other three only want to argue. If they had any real knowledge of what was happening in Iraq, they wouldn't have to spew off with nonsense. As for diplomacy with the Kurds, yes we need to maintain it along Turkey. Huge strides have been taken to get where we have gotten with the Kurds and to loose it over this would be an injustice. But, to loose Turkey as an allie would be just as detrimental.

You said "we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can". Did you expect for Turkey to stay behind its borders to do this so-called winning, or to invade Iraq. I would think the latter. I believe you meant want you wrote the first time and you just want to argue. It is obvious by the name calling on your posts. You must be very young and immature. But, that's ok, you'll grow out of it.

Age card huh? Well at least you didn't bring up my race...

You only see one way to win, I see many. Generals have lost many wars with the singular thinking of winning battles.

First you must decide what it is you need to win. In Turkey's cae (supposedly) they are responding to the capture of their troops and the violence... Well, to win they need to stop that from happening in the future (though what they really want to accomplish will only truely ever be known by them).
Invading would be one response. Foolish, seeing as how they would then own responsibilty like us. I do not adovcate that course since we ourselves, a nation one billion times as powerful, can't win in Iraq..
Bombing as Clinton did would be a second response. Again, I do not agree with that plan. Kurds do not fear a few bombs here and there, they need to be scared poop less in order to stop what they (or the extrimists) are doing.
The third would be to violently control all coming and going through the border... I would vote for that one, but then again I do not live in Turkey, as none of you do... So I am not 100%. However that would not pis off the U.S. as much as an invasion, or a complete bombing of the border area...

P.S.
I only call names of people who manipulate an easy to understand post for their own favor. I do respect your reponse thought, and you point out where I could be misunderstood... "We couldn't win, maybe Turkey could"...I was refering to the war against extremists, so I do stand by my statement. This was too easy to understand because the war in Iraq (to conquer Iraq, not the war on terror) has been over since 48 hours since it began...

Edit added later:Game,set, match.

quote:

Originally posted by rkgtactical:

quote:

Originally posted by Holynotsomuch:
It takes two to argue first of all. My origanal post was distorted and I reponded in like, as far as me wanting to argue, that is a side purpose of the entire blogging community. However, I do not agree with blatant, stupid, look-at-the-monkey arguing (kinda like what you said about the other three posters...). I simply stated that Turkey should protect its country, now I will add that they should protect their own troops.
I agree (the opposite of argue for those of short leashed brains) that we should hold Turkey with diplomacy, rather than undo what we've done.

quote:

Originally posted by rkgtactical:
AAA, you and I it seems, so far are the only ones with any real military expertise on this site today. Those other three only want to argue. If they had any real knowledge of what was happening in Iraq, they wouldn't have to spew off with nonsense. As for diplomacy with the Kurds, yes we need to maintain it along Turkey. Huge strides have been taken to get where we have gotten with the Kurds and to loose it over this would be an injustice. But, to loose Turkey as an allie would be just as detrimental.

You said "we couldn't win, maybe Turkey can". Did you expect for Turkey to stay behind its borders to do this so-called winning, or to invade Iraq. I would think the latter. I believe you meant want you wrote the first time and you just want to argue. It is obvious by the name calling on your posts. You must be very young and immature. But, that's ok, you'll grow out of it.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Holynotsomuch,

I'm sorry to inform you that you sadly misjudged me in regard to my knowledge of the Middle East. To better define the word
‘knowledge’, first you must understand how ‘knowledge’ is gained, i.e., either vicariously or experientially. My knowledge of middle eastern affairs is based on the experience of actually living there, and working with these people 'for years', and NOT from CNN or Fox. For that matter it has nothing to do with politics either, to be more specific it has nothing to do with me being a Republican or Dem because I’m neither! Lastly, you base your argument on the term, ‘logic’. News flash, our western ‘logic’ does not apply in that region, it will never work and only lead to the conclusion of being hopelessly lost in a rat maze if you depend on your logic to understand these people!

I do apologize however, for my satirical remarks, probably I alone enjoy my sick humor, i.e., lets kill em all in the name of peace for god sakes!

But, the simple unvarnished truth remains that we created this "no win scenario". The fact is, not only we can’t possibly win this lunatic war in a 1000 years, but the price we are paying for it with the lives of our children, to make our, ‘War Industry’, ‘Oil Industry’ along with a certain ‘Oil Business family’, richer then God, defies human comprehension. Hence I make satirical remarks because I’m soooo disgusted with our monstrous mishandling of the Middle East!

At any rate, I lived and worked in the Middle East as a civilian for several years and have perhaps a depth of understanding about these issues such that most people even can’t even begin to imagine. The simple fact remains after the consideration of blending together all of the events that has taken place in the past 5 years, the latest being this new conflict between the Turks and Kurds, any sane individual with one brain cell still firing should realize this powder keg is about to explode into WWIII if we aren’t very very careful.

The sad reality is most of us here at home have absolutely no earthly idea of what is ‘really’ going on in the Middle East! We listen to CNN and Fox, both of which are slanted politically, then draw a bogus conclusion based on nothing but nonsense! Finally, I don’t think I can do justice painting a picture for anyone as to my real feelings towards this administration and/or their handling of this war. Obviously someone in the executive branch must have had some good idea in mind for the invasion, occupation and subsequent utter destruction of Iraq, but for the life of me I have absolutely no earthly idea what it was or is! As the good Reverend would say, “We may never know why or how this war started, but we DO KNOW by now we can’t win this and therefore, ought to get our butts ‘outa Dodge’! You want logic, well you can’t handle logic!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: DanDaily,

Let the Turks go for it. Let the send the whole damn Turkisk Army. At least they wear uniforms and we can identify who they are. They are suppose to be our allies. Why not let them have some fun too.

Gunsmoke6, Nam 65-66, Garry Owen, Sir

Wow, man, as if, what a sight to see a march into a country, armed to the
teeth, even.

Let the Turkeys gobble, Why Bush would send Rice is beyond me - why do you have a woman as point of contact for leaders in a Islamic world.

Iraq is in a civil war, with jerk wads coming from places like Iran.

My idea? Back out of Baghdad, move our troops northwest. Draw another line in the sand - fly some stallions over baghdad - both sides of the river - through out munitions and food,,,,two weeks later you'll have two different states sunni and shities,,,,then fleeing the area will be all the little buzzards that flew in,,,

Go ahead let the Turkeys gobble the kurds,,,,but baghdad is done,,stick a fork in it....its a civil war.

We won the battles,,,,but its not our war - its the Iraq's war,,,,,

God bless the media too, for spreading Bin Laden's words. Broadcasting a message through the news media - could it be a signal for his rats to run from their holes and attack?